caulfield12

QUOTE (daa84 @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 02:02 PM) chris young has a .306 on base percentage....that chris young trade really hasnt hurt at all WE DON'T NEED OFFENSE!!! We need players on the team who can play above-average major league defense at each position. Right now, we don't have one in that category. Only Swisher at 1B and Ramirez (yes, I know about the errors, but that's only one side of the story) and a healthy Crede or Uribe at 3B would fit into that category. Cabrera might even be below average (see Royce Clayton 2001-02 for example 2) at this point in his career.

QUOTE (Cerbaho-WG @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 01:59 PM) Swisher showing plate discipline, amazing. Now bunt, Uribe. If we had Linebrink or a confident Dotel or could use Thornton to protect a tie game or 1 run lead, I'd agree with you. With the complete lack of a bullpen, we have to play for the big inning. I think we have to bring in Jenks if Carrasco gets in trouble. Of course, the problem with that strategy is we might have two "long" games tomorrow for our bullpen to cover.

There's no way this team is going anywhere without Linebrink. I guess it's easier to use that as a crutch, but the fact is that our bullpen and defense haven't been supporting our pitchers at all this season. Here's another area where the Chris Young trade has hurt. With Quentin in LF and Dye in RF, we need a much better CFer than Swisher. We can't easily trade Konerko, yet Swisher's best position is 1B and then we have Thome, who I have a sneaking suspicion will be a White Sox next year...and, at this point, the idea of Thome back (even though he's been very good offensively the last 2 months) just gives me no faith the 3 run homer nature of this team will ever change.

Please don't give up a two run dinger on a pitch in the wrong location, Mark. It's your game to win or lose here. UGHH. It's hard to complain about Quentin, but we have to possess the worst outfield defense in modern baseball history. Which is all the more depressing when you look at the ballhawks in Gomez and Span that the Twins have....or going back to Jacque Jones, Hunter and Shannon Stewart.

QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 01:45 PM) yeah he has battled every time at-bat against us. They just said he's the hardest hitter to get to ground into DP in the American League this season. I think it's time for those Catholic White Sox fans to start praying the rosary for whoever will pitch in the 8th inning for us.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 01:40 PM) Dotel I think it's DJ...has to be. Of course, his overall MLB "average/journeyman" status is bound to rear its ugly head eventually. I'm not counting on him to go Cliff Politte 2005 for the remainder of the season, but I guess stranger things have happened. Buehrle at 100 pitches and counting.

So who's the first reliever into this game? DJ? Jenks? Dotel is definitely out as far as I am concerned now. What is Buehrle's pitch count at this point? We know that we won't see Thornton 3 days in a row...Jenks has been on the shelf, and we absolutely have to take this game I think.

QUOTE (southsideirish71 @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 01:34 PM) I think only Texas has more errors. The kick the ball defense needs to go. Maybe JD was confused from watching the women's soccer team in the Olympics and thought it would be helpful to kick the ball into the stands. Actually, that might have saved Pena from scoring and put the runner on 3rd instead of 2nd, possibly. So the "kick" might have been the best defense Jermaine had in that situation.

Man, our defense has to be the worst in the major leagues, along with the bullpen...from around the first or second week of July on.

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 11:50 AM) I have a love/hate for our bullpen. It's funny watching Dotel - he still throws it over the plate like he has a 98 mph heater, saying c'mon, let's see you hit it. But now it's 92. And Thornton, like someone else said, is more effective when he's starting an inning, but that really shouldn't make a difference. That points to mental midgetry, imo. I get pissed at talented players like Boone Logan who should be helping this team right now but instead don't have their heads screwed on right. We need a pick me up in the pen right now and his name is Aaron Poreda - please give him a plane ticket to Chicago. Jenks made the transition to closer, but he had at least four minor league seasons of experience I think, and a full repertoire of pitches, particularly a more developed off-speed pitch. Poreda, if we were very lucky, would be a good "back-up" option to Thornton and could rest Matt's arm and prevent overuse, especially so that he wouldn't have to pitch in back-to-back games. The same problems usually occur with Jenks when he is used back-to-back, pitches more than one inning or has elevated pitch counts over a number of appearances. I'm sure they will discuss bringing him up in September, but they will use him very carefully, if they do make that decision...hand-picking the situations and limiting his exposure if he gets knocked around.

If we don't make the playoffs, which is looking more and more likely without Linebrink, I'll definitely be rooting for TB. If all else fails, I will root for the Twins agains the Angels/Red Sox. I guess Longoria's supposed to come back in the first week of September...and there's still a possibility that Crawford will come back, although much less likely. Yes, I know 21 of Minnesota's next 27 games are on the road. It's just that only 8 of their remaining games are against teams over .500. Actually, the way Cleveland's playing, they've become extremely dangerous, especially if you're unlucky enough to catch Cliff Lee.

Why was Crede out of the line-up this time? Ozzie said that he was going to hand him the starting job at 3B when he was ready to come back. Will that ever happen again with the Sox?

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 07:55 PM) Did Javy load the bases? If so then Ozzie was right to take him out. Thornton usually has been lights out dominating, but of all days to take a step back it had to be today Yep...single, walk to Gross (that was the real killer), then another single. The two walks (the second one with Thornton pitching to Iwamura that went about 11 pitches) and the Cabrera error/hit really destroyed our chances that inning. Then we didn't even have the heart this time to try to mount a comeback or at least get a runner or two on and pretend to make it interesting so we could say, well, these Sox are resilient, they never give up.

Well, we can all now say that Ozzie should have taken Thornton out one batter earlier, but you don't expect to give up 4 runs in that situation. If the bullpen is doing a reasonable job at all, you should at least go to the bottom of the 8th with a 3-3 tie. Not to mention the fact that he got Iwamura yesterday. Where was El Duque when we really needed him, lol?

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 05:04 PM) BTW, wasn't it refreshing to not see Tampa play smallball in the 8th inning? They went for the win instead of having Bartlett bunt. Kudos to their coaching staff. They are simply on a roll, despite all the Upton mess. In fact, that's really solidified their team together (like the DET fight in 2000 did for us) and everyone on that team has each other's backs. Maybe it was walking Josh Hamilton, getting MVP numbers from the likes of Royals castoff Howell or Twins' castoff (after surgery) Balfour...this team, for whatever reason, just "has" it. Even without Crawford and Longoria, they're really tough...they simply don't beat themselves.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 05:00 PM) Keeping the starter in just didnt work today. OC didnt help the bullpen either. Not really sure that you can blame the bullpen for Cabrera's error, or for the fact that Thorton was brought in a terrible position to succeed. Its 1 game just have to focus on tomorrow. I really think Thornton is not unlike Marte. Neither one of them could pitch in really clutch situations, or with runners on base. Thornton has a better fastball, but it doesn't have much movement (see Iwamura's AB), especially with his arm wearing down and throwing 93-95 instead of 95-97. Marte's slider/slurve was a better secondary pitch than what Thornton throws up there. Well, at any rate, it's telling when your best set-up guy is expected to only pitch when there are not runners on base.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 05:00 PM) Thornton had the chance to get out of that inning with the Sox still tied if OC could field the damn ball. Does he have naked pictures of the official scorer? I've never seen a player get the benefit of the call more than he does. The official story is that Bartlett, using his Lew Ford/Tyner/Punto/Hocking/LeCroy "grinding-ness" intelligently screened Cabrera and that he didn't see the ball until it was too late. Of course, OC is too afraid to speak for himself, so it will be interesting to see if Ozzie defends him or not.

I think they should start selling sponsorships now, like they do with walks and doubles. The next thing, we'll see fans clamoring to bring in Jenks to start the 8th. Vazquez's pitch count was in the low 80's, I think 81 to be exact, when the 8th started. In all seriousness, with Dotel nearing Damaso Marte-like oblivion (see 2005) and Carasco looking like a savior out of the bullpen, things sure look bleak. What's that saying about the darkest time of night is right before the dawn? Well, I think we're getting close. You just know that the next time we have a lead like that in the 8th, we'll see either Jenks or DJ. Of course, a LH batter will rip a home run, and everyone will say "why the ---- didn't Ozzie use Thornton there?"

This will be the first time since April the White Sox have been 1.5 games out of first place. Marcum has fallen completely out of the major leagues after leading the AL in ERA in April and May, which means we will be lucky if Minnesota sees either Burnett or Halladay. The way Minnesota is playing with all the momentum on their side, and with Liriano's resurgence, they could sweep through Oakland and Seattle.

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:46 PM) GREAT job by Tarasco...forgotten in this friggin mess Tony has come back to the big leagues? Just kidding. You might want to change that "T" to a "C"

Stone and Farmer are arguing that Bartlett, being the fundamentally-trained Twins' player that he is/was (I know he started with Philly) screen Cabrera and led to the error/hit against Cabrera. How many seconds will it take for OC to leave the clubhouse today? Faster than Kobe and Lebron will be gone if the Redeem Team collapses today. How lovely to be victimized by Torii Hunter's horrible defense and Jason Bartlett's "heady" baserunning all in the span of 3 days. If the Twins weren't in the head of the White Sox, they certainly are now...and that three game series in Minnesota seems scarier by the day. Maybe it will turn out like 2006 and the Red Sox will also fade, but this team just doesn't feel like it is capable of beating the Tampa Bays, Anaheim's or Minnesota's, partly due to managing, partly due to the pen, partly due to lack of execution/fundamentals/speed/defense and the rest just due to bad vibes about a team constructed almost 100% around hitting 3 run homers.

QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:35 PM) except for the two come from behind wins by the mariners, amirite? I think the 3rd game they won in SEA to stop the bleeding and their first game in Anaheim (the 12 inning fiasco for Torii Hunter) will turn out to be the two key games of the season for the Twins. Need I mention that they are in the position to sweep the Angels out of their own stadium without even using Francisco Liriano, who has won 14 starts in a row now between AAA and the majors?

QUOTE (Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:30 PM) No, but stop blowing smoke up my ass about Linebrink, Kenny. And I thought Bradford was acquired for cash, was he not? The White Sox have never taken on a contract in their in-season deals, they've always favored not giving up the cash OVER giving up a prospect.

QUOTE (Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:24 PM) Meanwhile, Linbebrink continues to be out with what Kenny Williams termed pretty unserious, in fact, it really was just totally precautionary to put him on the DL. Meanwhile, no relief pitchers were acquired. But, cool, we got Griffey. So when we trade Poreda to get someone like Chad Bradford, you'd be satisfied when the White Sox are 72-90 in 2010? You know you're in trouble when your best option now in the 8th inning is DJ Carraso, who's lucky to crack 87-88 MPH with his fastball? Every White Sox fan KNEW deep down that Thornton was going to walk Iwamura, there wasn't a doubt in anyone's minds. I think he should be traded next year when he's on a hot streak and we should just start over again to rebuild our pen. Heck, we might even be better off trading Jenks while his value is at a high to get some speed on this team, as it's not coming from our farm system.

QUOTE (Elgin Slim @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:22 PM) and what's sad about this game is that Javy will get the loss. He doesn't really deserve the win when he crapped his pants and walked Gabe Gross. He's just not a playoff pitcher. He gets the easy outs and puts up great strikeout numbers, but he's also the pitching equivalent of Thome or Albert Belle with the Sox. White Sox, of course, botch the rundown and allow the runners to move up to 2nd and 3rd...watch these two extra runs score and put us completely out of the game. We don't deserve to make the playoffs...we are just not a smart team, and I don't think coaching is going to change this.