caulfield12

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ Aug 24, 2008 -> 11:50 AM) I have a love/hate for our bullpen. It's funny watching Dotel - he still throws it over the plate like he has a 98 mph heater, saying c'mon, let's see you hit it. But now it's 92. And Thornton, like someone else said, is more effective when he's starting an inning, but that really shouldn't make a difference. That points to mental midgetry, imo. I get pissed at talented players like Boone Logan who should be helping this team right now but instead don't have their heads screwed on right. We need a pick me up in the pen right now and his name is Aaron Poreda - please give him a plane ticket to Chicago. Jenks made the transition to closer, but he had at least four minor league seasons of experience I think, and a full repertoire of pitches, particularly a more developed off-speed pitch. Poreda, if we were very lucky, would be a good "back-up" option to Thornton and could rest Matt's arm and prevent overuse, especially so that he wouldn't have to pitch in back-to-back games. The same problems usually occur with Jenks when he is used back-to-back, pitches more than one inning or has elevated pitch counts over a number of appearances. I'm sure they will discuss bringing him up in September, but they will use him very carefully, if they do make that decision...hand-picking the situations and limiting his exposure if he gets knocked around.

If we don't make the playoffs, which is looking more and more likely without Linebrink, I'll definitely be rooting for TB. If all else fails, I will root for the Twins agains the Angels/Red Sox. I guess Longoria's supposed to come back in the first week of September...and there's still a possibility that Crawford will come back, although much less likely. Yes, I know 21 of Minnesota's next 27 games are on the road. It's just that only 8 of their remaining games are against teams over .500. Actually, the way Cleveland's playing, they've become extremely dangerous, especially if you're unlucky enough to catch Cliff Lee.

Why was Crede out of the line-up this time? Ozzie said that he was going to hand him the starting job at 3B when he was ready to come back. Will that ever happen again with the Sox?

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 07:55 PM) Did Javy load the bases? If so then Ozzie was right to take him out. Thornton usually has been lights out dominating, but of all days to take a step back it had to be today Yep...single, walk to Gross (that was the real killer), then another single. The two walks (the second one with Thornton pitching to Iwamura that went about 11 pitches) and the Cabrera error/hit really destroyed our chances that inning. Then we didn't even have the heart this time to try to mount a comeback or at least get a runner or two on and pretend to make it interesting so we could say, well, these Sox are resilient, they never give up.

Well, we can all now say that Ozzie should have taken Thornton out one batter earlier, but you don't expect to give up 4 runs in that situation. If the bullpen is doing a reasonable job at all, you should at least go to the bottom of the 8th with a 3-3 tie. Not to mention the fact that he got Iwamura yesterday. Where was El Duque when we really needed him, lol?

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 05:04 PM) BTW, wasn't it refreshing to not see Tampa play smallball in the 8th inning? They went for the win instead of having Bartlett bunt. Kudos to their coaching staff. They are simply on a roll, despite all the Upton mess. In fact, that's really solidified their team together (like the DET fight in 2000 did for us) and everyone on that team has each other's backs. Maybe it was walking Josh Hamilton, getting MVP numbers from the likes of Royals castoff Howell or Twins' castoff (after surgery) Balfour...this team, for whatever reason, just "has" it. Even without Crawford and Longoria, they're really tough...they simply don't beat themselves.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 05:00 PM) Keeping the starter in just didnt work today. OC didnt help the bullpen either. Not really sure that you can blame the bullpen for Cabrera's error, or for the fact that Thorton was brought in a terrible position to succeed. Its 1 game just have to focus on tomorrow. I really think Thornton is not unlike Marte. Neither one of them could pitch in really clutch situations, or with runners on base. Thornton has a better fastball, but it doesn't have much movement (see Iwamura's AB), especially with his arm wearing down and throwing 93-95 instead of 95-97. Marte's slider/slurve was a better secondary pitch than what Thornton throws up there. Well, at any rate, it's telling when your best set-up guy is expected to only pitch when there are not runners on base.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 05:00 PM) Thornton had the chance to get out of that inning with the Sox still tied if OC could field the damn ball. Does he have naked pictures of the official scorer? I've never seen a player get the benefit of the call more than he does. The official story is that Bartlett, using his Lew Ford/Tyner/Punto/Hocking/LeCroy "grinding-ness" intelligently screened Cabrera and that he didn't see the ball until it was too late. Of course, OC is too afraid to speak for himself, so it will be interesting to see if Ozzie defends him or not.

I think they should start selling sponsorships now, like they do with walks and doubles. The next thing, we'll see fans clamoring to bring in Jenks to start the 8th. Vazquez's pitch count was in the low 80's, I think 81 to be exact, when the 8th started. In all seriousness, with Dotel nearing Damaso Marte-like oblivion (see 2005) and Carasco looking like a savior out of the bullpen, things sure look bleak. What's that saying about the darkest time of night is right before the dawn? Well, I think we're getting close. You just know that the next time we have a lead like that in the 8th, we'll see either Jenks or DJ. Of course, a LH batter will rip a home run, and everyone will say "why the ---- didn't Ozzie use Thornton there?"

This will be the first time since April the White Sox have been 1.5 games out of first place. Marcum has fallen completely out of the major leagues after leading the AL in ERA in April and May, which means we will be lucky if Minnesota sees either Burnett or Halladay. The way Minnesota is playing with all the momentum on their side, and with Liriano's resurgence, they could sweep through Oakland and Seattle.

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:46 PM) GREAT job by Tarasco...forgotten in this friggin mess Tony has come back to the big leagues? Just kidding. You might want to change that "T" to a "C"

Stone and Farmer are arguing that Bartlett, being the fundamentally-trained Twins' player that he is/was (I know he started with Philly) screen Cabrera and led to the error/hit against Cabrera. How many seconds will it take for OC to leave the clubhouse today? Faster than Kobe and Lebron will be gone if the Redeem Team collapses today. How lovely to be victimized by Torii Hunter's horrible defense and Jason Bartlett's "heady" baserunning all in the span of 3 days. If the Twins weren't in the head of the White Sox, they certainly are now...and that three game series in Minnesota seems scarier by the day. Maybe it will turn out like 2006 and the Red Sox will also fade, but this team just doesn't feel like it is capable of beating the Tampa Bays, Anaheim's or Minnesota's, partly due to managing, partly due to the pen, partly due to lack of execution/fundamentals/speed/defense and the rest just due to bad vibes about a team constructed almost 100% around hitting 3 run homers.

QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:35 PM) except for the two come from behind wins by the mariners, amirite? I think the 3rd game they won in SEA to stop the bleeding and their first game in Anaheim (the 12 inning fiasco for Torii Hunter) will turn out to be the two key games of the season for the Twins. Need I mention that they are in the position to sweep the Angels out of their own stadium without even using Francisco Liriano, who has won 14 starts in a row now between AAA and the majors?

QUOTE (Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:30 PM) No, but stop blowing smoke up my ass about Linebrink, Kenny. And I thought Bradford was acquired for cash, was he not? The White Sox have never taken on a contract in their in-season deals, they've always favored not giving up the cash OVER giving up a prospect.

QUOTE (Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:24 PM) Meanwhile, Linbebrink continues to be out with what Kenny Williams termed pretty unserious, in fact, it really was just totally precautionary to put him on the DL. Meanwhile, no relief pitchers were acquired. But, cool, we got Griffey. So when we trade Poreda to get someone like Chad Bradford, you'd be satisfied when the White Sox are 72-90 in 2010? You know you're in trouble when your best option now in the 8th inning is DJ Carraso, who's lucky to crack 87-88 MPH with his fastball? Every White Sox fan KNEW deep down that Thornton was going to walk Iwamura, there wasn't a doubt in anyone's minds. I think he should be traded next year when he's on a hot streak and we should just start over again to rebuild our pen. Heck, we might even be better off trading Jenks while his value is at a high to get some speed on this team, as it's not coming from our farm system.

QUOTE (Elgin Slim @ Aug 23, 2008 -> 04:22 PM) and what's sad about this game is that Javy will get the loss. He doesn't really deserve the win when he crapped his pants and walked Gabe Gross. He's just not a playoff pitcher. He gets the easy outs and puts up great strikeout numbers, but he's also the pitching equivalent of Thome or Albert Belle with the Sox. White Sox, of course, botch the rundown and allow the runners to move up to 2nd and 3rd...watch these two extra runs score and put us completely out of the game. We don't deserve to make the playoffs...we are just not a smart team, and I don't think coaching is going to change this.

Well, if anyone wants to march over to the Twins' board and surrender like their "fan" already did this week...yes, it's a long season, and yes, anything's possible...but this doesn't feel very good to me. Ozzie has no more confidence left in the bullpen...and it's impossible to blame him. Losing Linebrink was due to haunt us eventually, and now it's raising its ugly head.

I think that might be the game. Error on Cabrera...of course, it's ruled a hit by Rosenberg instead of an error on our "Gold Glove" Shortstop. Don't let the door hit you on the butt when you're leaving, Orlando.

So everyone will blame Ozzie for staying with Vazquez when he'd barely thrown 80 pitches coming into that inning, right? I guess if you want to quibble, you could say he should have been removed after the walk (2nd batter). But this is why no matter what Ozzie does, it's always going to be his fault, because we have no good options. We'll see what happens to Thornton. Now, not only did he walk him, but Thornton's fastball is fading fast after so many pitches.

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Aug 22, 2008 -> 11:14 PM) Silverio has 25 errors already!?!?!!? Move him to 1B already... Jeter had 56 errors in 128 games at Greensboro (SAL) in 1993. Relax.

QUOTE (Tony82087 @ Aug 22, 2008 -> 10:42 PM) Dotel is about 8th on the list of problems tonight. I have been traveling for about a week, so I feel pretty out of touch with the team. I got in last night, and went to the game tonight. Not the way I wanted to be welcomed home. Worst game I have seen in a real long time. The lack of execution by any of our hitters was disgusting, and Ozzie probably had his worst game as a White Sox Manager tonight. Just a disgusting game all around, and thats being nice. They need to pound the hell out of Tampa these next two games. You just highlighted the problem that Guillen has...no team in MLB can go out and pound the likes of Edwin Jackson and Scott Kazmir on a consistent basis. Sure, we can have Thornton go 2 innings every time out and not use Dotel again. But then, when Thornton's arm is about to fall off, who do you go to then, DJ Carrasco? Do we now start to use Jenks in the 8th inning of games we are tied or down only one run? This game is on the offense...we had something like 16 runners on base through the first 6 innings. When you only score 2 runs and leave that many runners on base, have 2 thrown out stealing and mix in some GIDP, well, then the eventual result is not a surprise.

Ah...memories of the irreplaceable Kelly Dransfeldt. It was kind of funny...it was almost like the Twins' radio announcers were shocked Hunter didn't make the play. Not only that he jumped when he didn't need to, but that he totally misjudged where the wall was. Of course, if it happened against the Sox, he would jump up to about 11" and rob a home run from Carlos Lee or run over a helpless Jamie Burke. Well, at least we owned the Angels in 2005, if nothing else. This Twins' team is getting annoying...Mauer/Morneau don't do anything and Nick Punto beats them almost singlehandedly with his bat. Their bullpen didn't even cave in as expected. If Gallagher gets the bunt down like he's supposed to, I think the Angels win. Oh, well.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 21, 2008 -> 11:28 PM) Whenever I say I'm worried the Cubs will win the World Series, I always get the response "not if they have to go through the Angels". There's no way this Angels team would be able to outslug the Cubs. Gage...you might know this. Do the Angels allow their minor leaguers to use aluminum bats? Guys like Rodriguez and Wood put up huge minor league numbers, and when they get called up, they look like pitchers at the plate. McPherson, Kotchman and Morales also put up huge numbers in the minors. Seems like Kendrick and Aybar are doing fine though.

1) Torii Hunter, since he hurt his ankle a couple of seasons ago, is just an average at best defensive CFer now 2) The Angels aren't that good...in fact, it's almost like they have White Sox-itis, with the boppers now in the middle of the line-up, they've forgotten how to execute and manufacture runs....their pitching is saving them this season, but I think they will go down in the first round of the playoffs.

QUOTE (fathom @ Aug 21, 2008 -> 11:09 PM) If they put up a 10-4 on the road trip...well, let's hope Boston starts losing a lot. If they are ahead of us after playing 24/30 games on the road, then they deserve the division title.