caulfield12

QUOTE (JPN366 @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 07:13 AM) In trades...you never know how prospects will pan out, especially if you don't develop them. Have you actually seen Gio pitch? Have you met him? If you had, you would want him on your team forever. Teams can have success by developing players, look at the Brewers, Braves, or even the Red Sox. Yes, I have seen Gio pitch....I know, I know, he's the second coming of Barry Zito with a better heater. Seriously, Matt Guerrier was also the next Greg Maddux, according to Lloyd McClendon. I don't believe any hype unless it's backed up by results at the big league level...there have been too many Joe Borchards and Jason Dellaero's in my lifetime to justify getting excited by a future HOFer who is traded not once but twice by the same GM whose one strength is identifying talent that's struggling or undervalued/underappreciated.

QUOTE (Elgin Slim @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 07:01 AM) Maybe Homer Bailey is coming back as well for one of Coop's reclamation projects. One can only pray. I just hope Reyes doesn't figure things out in DET. Look at what Guthrie did for awhile in Baltimore...it would have been really hard on had he put up those same numbers for the Indians. And I'm still happy that we don't have to deal with Garza over the long-term, even though D. Young still has the chance to be a very good player, too.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:53 AM) Might? Volquez is one of the best young pitchers in the league, you would have to convince them to MAYBE think about our offer. Well, Floyd and Danks looked like two of the best pitchers in the AL in the first half...although both lack Volquez's high 90's heater, Floyd doesn't fall short compared to many starters in "pure stuff." At any rate, it's not going to happen...any more than Lincecum or Cain would be traded by the Giants for that same package. I would like to see Volquez have consistent success over a 2 year period, that's all I am saying.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:52 AM) Cordero's contract is hella scary. No reason to pick up Griffey's salary if you're acquiring a setup man (for us anyway) who makes $12M per year over the next 3 years. Besides Koch (who didn't get it done), we've done okay with bargain basement/low-cost relievers over the last decade. Takatsu (for awhile) Foulke Howry Hermanson Jenks Just proves that shelling out money for a long-term deal is silly, unless it's Nathan or Rivera about 5 years ago. There's too much of a downside...look at MacDougal, or Aardsma (although he didn't cost as much). The jury is still out on Dotel and Linebrink over the longer term, although they have been good or better than expected this year at least.

QUOTE (Sox It To Em @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:48 AM) Edinson Volquez? I might take Volquez for Floyd and Fields...but he's very unproven, certainly in a pennant race. It's one thing to produce in Cincy (see Kip Wells first two seasons in PITT)...but will he wilt in August and September (see Loiaza 2003)? I don't like dealing Floyd unless it's for someone even better than Contreras or Garcia (at the time of his acquisition). He and Danks give us a lot of payroll flexibility down the road. We can't have a $50 million plus starting rotation...that was the reason we ditched Garland and Garcia in the first place, I thought.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:42 AM) If he's going to acquire a plodding lefy corner OF/DH from the Reds why couldn't it be Dunn? At least he's still talented and would bring this team a couple draft picks at the end of the season. Because 1) we're not giving up Poreda or Fields, 2) we still need to have a bullet in the gun to go after another reliever if Linebrink can't come back or too try to pry a lefty loose on the waiver wire (along the lines of a lefty LaTroy Hawkins, like Arthur Rhodes now) to replace Logan potentially. We would have to give up a lot more talent for Dunn than Griffey. Remember, the Red Sox might be in the bidding for Dunn if they dump Ramirez and don't get Holliday or Bay somehow. Simply, we can't do anything to our roster that won't have a detrimental effect...you could argue letting Uribe or Anderson go, but how wanted are either of those guys by anyone?

QUOTE (JPN366 @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:38 AM) KW always overpays, I bet waiters and waitresses love him. It'll be at least three players going to Cincy, otherwise I'd be shocked. Overpaid on Jenks. Check. Overpaid on Danks and Masset. Check. Overpaid on Floyd. Check. Really overpaid on Alexei Ramirez. Check. Overpaid on Quentin big-time. Freddy Garcia...yeah, Reed and Morse became perennial All-Stars. Seriously, besides Chris B. Young (Mike Cameron Jr. in disguise) and Swisher, what talent have we actually given up? If you really believe Ryan Sweeney will hit 15-20 homers some day, that DeLosSantos will recover like Liriano from surgery, and that Gio's frame will stand up, well maybe that's a loss. Would anyone trade to re-acquire Chris Young for Quentin straight-up right now. If you want to go back into the past, you can cite the Todd Ritchie trade as probably the worst...Fogg and Wells had decent careers, and Lowe was serviceable (I think it was Sean Lowe, if memory serves correctly?)

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:37 AM) Any relief pitchers that could be a part of this deal? Who would we possibly want to give up besides Masset or Logan, better yet, who would another team actually want? MacDougal, lol? I guess Russell is an outside shot, but I don't KW will give up on someone who throws in the mid to upper 90's quite so easily.

QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Jul 31, 2008 -> 06:34 AM) when konerko is in the lineup, we are only running 8 capable hitters to the box, so this gives us a 9th guy who can actually swing the bat and get on base keep in mind who he's likely to be replacing in the lineup if griffey is told to wave his NTC so he can go back to playing CF, i wouldn't be surprised if he holds pat and stays in CIN There's also the remote possibility that Thome goes back to 1B and Griffey is the DH. I don't like that, but I guess it's better than sticking Dye at 1B in the heart of a pennant race....or better than Daubach, Everett or Mackowiak in CF.

Obviously he would play CF (until he got injured), with Swisher moving to 1B...and Konerko to the bench. I don't think that's worth Fields, the Reds just want to get out from under his contract and play youngsters, and we have no options then if Crede is gone besides Juan Uribe!

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Nov 22, 2007 -> 11:14 AM) Well for starters, I've been bringing up the lack of Sox farm system for years. I'm sure you'll see some repsonses from them here. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out a good farm system helps fill in holes. While I haven't been positng here until recently, I've been at other boards saying the same think and the minor league "experts' have criticized me for it. So, you're right. What's done is done. But the key is for Sox management to learn from their 7 years of mistakes and help prevent this from happening again. The reality is the reason the team has so many holes and was forced into bringing a guy like Dye back is becuase they had nothing in the minors that was major league ready to step in. same thing with Linebrink. A good reliever, but not a top tiered one. So all the years of neglect of the farm system is an issue. And while we can't go back and change it, the Sox damn well better learn something so we're not forced into these corners again. Remember this team still needs a SP, another reliever and 2 OFer's. Oh year, they're also almost maxed out their payroll and are coming off an embarassing 90 loss system. Maybe I haven't been to far off base the last 5-6 years in my critique of KW and his farm system. Or maybe I'[m just sick of just watching the Sox invest money in guys that any good farm system can easily produce. I hope KW has a good plan to fll the rest of these holes, because if this team finishes under .500 with a $100 mill payroll a second year in a row, I'd expect a lot of pissed off people around here. Bob Well, there's about 15 MLB organizations that haven't won a World Series in the last 20+ years that would beg to differ on that analysis. The White Sox fans have been systematically conditioned for so long that we don't feel we deserve a $100 million payroll...or maybe it's because we won in it all with a much lower one. When I heard about the Torii Hunter years and total money, I knew that the money was going to start flying even more crazily than last year...let's face it baseball is flush with cash, it's almost on par with the NFL in terms of profitability. How else can you explain Torii Hunter and Gary Matthews, Jr., making almost $150 million between them? There have been 7 years of mistakes, but the successes like Crede and Buehrle and Rowand...and the smart acquisitions going into 2005, that's what did it for us. If you think about it, Durham/Ordonez/Caballo had already been jettisoned for basically NOTHING substantial in return...w/ the exception of Pods in 2005. Yes, you can look at guys like Sweeney, Anderson and Valido and say if two of those three guys were ready...or if Joe Borchard ever became what he was supposed to be, we wouldn't have needed Thome so badly from the LH side, and then we'd still have Rowand, etc. If we had Rowand, then we would have traded away Anderson and a certain D-Backs CFer (Chris B. Young) who's more overhyped than Eric Davis around some parts. When you look at things realistically, Young and McCarthy are still the only two players out there that most fans would like back from our farm system....at least 50% would take them back, I would think, if not more. Dye is not an easily-replaced player. Or Buehrle. Maybe even Konerko. Even if Sweeney hit .280 with 15 homers and 80 RBI's, it wouldn't come close to approximating what JD did in 2005 and 2006. There aren't many organizations that haven't bottomed out that are consistently producing young All-Stars every season. Linebrink was one of, if not THE best, set-up man in baseball over the past five years...not the last couple, but as a composite, at least in the Top 5. After the LH reliever debacle in 2006, Jeff Nelson, seeing Hermanson try to come back, Politte, Cotts, Marte, the likes of Sean Tracey and Agustin Montero and EVERYTHING we suffered through last year...to do nothing BUT HOPE? C'mon, who wouldn't be out there trying to crucify KW for that blunder 3 years in a row? A name that doesn't come up, something that went unnoticed relatively....David Riske. Many claim he's one of the most underrated relievers in the game, and he certainly could have helped settle things down last year. But I still don't think a bullpen of Riske, Luis Vizcaino and El Duque would have got the White Sox to 81 wins the way the offense collapsed last year. MAYBE. But we still wouldn't have been close to the playoffs.

QUOTE(bigruss22 @ Nov 22, 2007 -> 11:08 AM) Maybe we can bring in Jenkins now, from what Ive heard he is very good def., and he would still give you atleast an average bat, but one that may strike out alot. Still, he wouldnt be all taht expensive, just another option i guess. Please God, no. Mike Devereaux...Cory Snyder...Ellis Burks...Dave Martinez...Brian Daubach. We have a great knack of getting players 2-3 years TOO late.

QUOTE(EvilJester99 @ Nov 22, 2007 -> 10:04 AM) How so? Does your gut tell you he would be disgusting or a terrible OF? Well, we certainly can't put Andy G. or Anderson Gomes out there, can we? I always laugh at the reactions when foreign players' names come up. Based on watching them once or never, many jump to black/white conclusions. Is Fukodome likely to be the next Matsui or Ichiro? Probably not....but remember all the nay-sayers on the Takatsu and Iguchi deals? Japanese players SEEM to fit very well into the "reinvigorated" style of play that the White Sox are hoping to inculcate into their team mindset. If you want to ask someone for a "real" opinion with relevance, ask Bobby Valentine or Trey Hillman (Royals' new manager) about this guy and see what they say first. That goes for the reliever we're in the "Top 5" for as well. Interesting that we're fighting the Royals for both this reliever and also in the discussions for T. Hunter. I wish we could get DeJesus, but they would try to stick us with a certain D-Rays castoff who can run like the wind but do little else of productive value on the diamond. If I remember correctly, KW didn't even see Iguchi once in person, just watched tons of video tape. Actually, it's amazing he signed him, because that 'rusty swinging gate' hitch in his swing certainly didn't look like it would translate into ANY level of success against MLB pitching...and KW still went with his gut and made the correct call.

Has everyone lost their bloody minds? Downfall of the White Sox? NOT signing Hunter to this ridiculous, Soriano-esque deal? Seriously, have you watched any NFL running backs have a successful career well into their 30's after playing so much on turf? Name ONE! He will be pretty good for two years, but six years and $18 per season. I would have been pissed if we spent $60 million for four years. By the way, the Yankees have WHAT as their starting rotation? They'll still be at home when the World Series is being played next year, book it! You know they're not going to pay Rowand or A. Jones that kind of money either, so here we go again with "creative" KW. Crisp, Fukodome, Billy Hall, Gary Matthews, Jr. (with the Angels paying half his contract!!!) The Angels want to play Garret Anderson and Hunter everyday (that makes absolute NO SENSE! both should play in NO MORE than 145 games IMO) and rotate Matthews and Guerrero in RF/DH, mostly to rest Vladdy's knees.

With starter Chad Billingsley probably untouchable, look for the Sox to pursue two or three of the following players in a package: second baseman Tony Abreau, outfielder Matt Kemp, second baseman/outfielder Delwyn Young, outfielder James Loney, reliever Jonathan Broxton, and monster left-handed pitching prospect Clayton Kershaw. One of those players can be sent to Florida for Cabrera, the 24-year-old third baseman who beat the Marlins at arbitration for $7.4 million last season, and is due to become a free agent after 2009. The Sox would want him in left field, where Cabrera played earlier in his career when Ozzie Guillen was a coach with Florida and the Marlins won the World Series. from dailyherald.com I'm not altogether optimistic about taking on huge salary players (especially M. Cabrera in the future, didn't we try to divest ourselves of guys like Ordonez and Magglio when they started making $10-15 million per season?)...but I would definitel like some insurance/competition and versatility with the 2B position. I guess from that perspective, Delwyn Young might make the most sense, to provide depth and possibly start at 2B (probably not OF). The chips we have/might have are Crede, Konerko, Uribe and maybe Contreras, although I doubt that he would be too attractive. I do think we need to make a trade for some younger but somewhat proven major leaguers (like the Dodgers have in abundance) in order to lower payroll and increase flexibility for the future, while still remaining competitive for 2008. I'm just not sure how much we could actually get in return for Crede until he's healthy...and why KW would be so tempted to push the button so soon on a deal, unless it's simply to know exactly which position (LF, 3B, 1B) Josh Fields will be at coming into Spring Training?

Garland is entering the final year of a three-year, $29-million deal that will pay him $12 million in 2008. A Southern California native who attended Kennedy High in Granada Hills, Garland, who helped Chicago win the 2005 World Series, said he would be "very interested" in signing an extension with the Angels. "We think he's going to make us better," Reagins said of Garland. "In fact, I know we got better today." The 6-foot-6, 210-pound sinkerball specialist, who also mixes a changeup with his fastball, has a 92-81 record and 4.41 ERA in six-plus seasons. He has reached 10 wins, 30 starts and 200 innings in each of the last four seasons. "I don't feel I've changed at all" since the consecutive 18-win seasons, said Garland, who was nearly traded to the Angels for Darin Erstad in December 2001. "I feel I've been getting better. . . . This is a great opportunity to come home and show the West Coast what my capabilities are. I'd love to bring another championship back here." Though Garland suffered his first losing record since 2003, he still gave an underperforming White Sox team 21 quality starts (six innings or more, three earned runs or fewer), and the Angels believe he will thrive in Angel Stadium, which is more of a pitchers' park than U.S. Cellular Field. "He's proved he's going to take the ball, get 30-plus starts, pitch deep into games, and that constant is very important for us as we move forward," Scioscia said. "He threw the ball well last year." [email protected]

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:00 PM) Yes, nobody really knows what they have...but it sure seems like the Angels have made it a point to go with those guys repeatedly, and are constantly clearing spaces for them. For Kendrick, they cleared out Kennedy. For Kotchman/Morales they hid Erstad. They let Glaus walk to go with McPherson, then instead of getting in on anyone bigger or trading for Crede they tried Figgins, Aybar, and had Wood play 3rd base in the minors. They let Washburn walk because they were confident their young guys could replace him. They let Percival walk to move in K-Rod. And even when they try to do so, with that Tejada deal, something winds up killing it. The Angels, for better or worse, are NOT trading away their young guys in a fair deal no matter how much we may want them to. They are like the opposite of the D-Rays; they hold onto their young guys come hell or high water and let their peak value time pass that way; the D-Rays hold onto guys until they're a year from FA until their peak value has passed. Either way, you need to overpay to get one of their key group, and that ain't changing. Well, nobody's perfect...it seems they held onto McPherson, Kotchmann, Santana and Shields, among others, way past their "sell by" dates. And even Morales would have been a huge prize for any organization to acquire a couple of seasons ago. They really haven't made any BIG moves, besides signing the likes of Guerrero, Colon and Matthews. One could argue that they would have been smarter to trade Vladdy when his value was also at its peak...now that he seems to be in a little decline (in terms of physical movement), mostly due to injuries but partly due to age as well. He also has that violent swing like a Sheffield or Thome that has to create some wear and tear...not to mention the fact that he swings SO much more than any other player I've seen. But that signing by Moreno was a huge credibility lift to the organization and first salvo against McCourt and the Dodgers' dominance of the SC "mindshare," the same battle we fight with the Cubs, the Mets with the Yankees or the A's against the Giants. The only real negatives the Angels have had were little moves like Hillenbrand or keeping Garret Anderson and Salmon way too long. That's the nature of franchises...they almost always tend to hold onto players one or two years too long out of sentimental value, although GA surprised many this year with his "comeback." They also did a good job of picking up Juan Rivera for little or nothing...and, like many teams, they have so-so catching.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:38 PM) I think it says a lot about the Halos that this strikes me as the first major trade they've made in a couple offseasons (anyone else think of any?) and they didn't give up one of their young guys; they gave up one of their veteran older guys who was blocking their young guy. The problem is the between Izturis, Aybar and Brandon Wood, nobody knows exactly what they have. I'm sure that combination will turn out better than Brian Anderson, Sweeney and Jerry Owens in the White Sox outfield...but you're taking something of a risk to trade a veteran clubhouse leader and one of the most respected players on the team for a set of question marks with potential. I know Cabrera also has a very good reputation in Cartagena, Colombia...I spent some time there in 05 and 06 and I know that he spent a significant amount of money to have the neighborhoods and streets improved in the neighborhood where he grew up and he's also the part owner (or maybe even builder) of a high rise there with his first "tenants" being his parents...so he seems like a pretty decent guy, unlike someone like Wil Cordero/Clayton/Lofton.

QUOTE(PAUL KONERKO 14 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:53 PM) Our plan=to get Torii Kedar Hunter While Michael Bourn Identity wouldn't be much better than Jerry Owens, and that's questionable...is Hunter such a lock? He's going to get a minimum of $60 million for four years, making him the highest played member of the team, or right up there with Buehrle. He had a really strong '07, but the two seasons prior to that were not so outstanding, with injuries and lower batting averages. He strikes out a ton...do we need any more of this type of hitter with our renewed concentration on contact, advancing runners, bunting, etc.? He's definitely lost a step or two defensively. I mean, is the difference between Hunter and someone like Mike Cameron worth THAT kind of money? It would certainly give the White Sox some credibility heading in 08 if they signed Hunter, had Cabrera at SS and moved some other pieces to shore up the bullpen and bench, but would anyone be rejoicing (besides Mariotti?) at that deal at this point in the game? Look at last off-season, the only OF signing that worked (Pods, Roberts, Pierre, Mathews) was the one that was the most universally questioned. Heck, Mathews and Meche both drew raised eyebrows, and those turned out to be two of the better signings.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:49 PM) One of these things is not like the other; one of these things just doesn't belong. and by one, I mean two, because one of these guys is pretty average, and another is a 1Bman. And, on top of that, another may be moving to 3B in a year. Why don't we go back five years and add A-Rod and Nomar? Seriously, that list he came up with was INTERESTING. The Indians love Peralta so much that they are trying to dump him for the second time in three years. He's a lousy shortstop and an inconsistent offensive performer, like Uribe. They still want Barfield to get another shot at 2B and to move over Asdrubal whatever his name is over to SS from what I've read.

http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune....ra-a-barga.html Something else that's interesting, losing Garland after 2008 would have netted absolutely nothing in return as a Type B Free Agent (somehow, those 36 wins over two years don't count for much, do they?) So, along with the money coming our way, the compensation if we are unable to sign Cabrera long-term, the eventual playing destination of Mr. Juan Uribe, this is starting to make a little more sense from the Sox perspective.

QUOTE(Jeremy @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 08:08 PM) Rob Neyer: Keith Law (insider content only): Has a very similar but slightly less critical take than Neyer. Baseball America: I'm not doing back flips over this deal but my take on these articles is that because these writers haven't followed the Sox on a regular basis, they don't realize that if Cabrera plays defense just as well as Uribe and produces at the level of his own career averages offensively he'll be a considerable upgrade. I feel like they're glossing over how incredibly putrid (.240/.281/.415) Uribe has been at the plate the past three seasons. Of course, the Carlos Lee deal made LITTLE to no sense at the time...the Sox are getting rid of Ordonez, Valentin and Caballo, and we're still going to somehow contend? Now, of course, times have changed and the competition in the division is much stiffer...but we have no choice but to improve our team speed, contact...I think if OG is going to go down (along with KW), it will be doing things their way, and that means "small ball" for sure. If that means they're going to cram Vazquez and Gavin Floyd and Masset and Sisco and Aardsma down our throats (in KW's unique way) to prove how wise he is, well, we will just have to wait and see. The emergence of a certain D-Backs CFer has finally given the critics their Fogg/Wells/Lowe for Ritchie of recent years...although many Sox fans would still argue that a front-line starter for the next Mike Cameron (albeit a very affordable one) isn't as one-sided as one might be led to believe. There were so many decisions with this team that look bad now but looked good at the time: 1) Letting Rowand go to start Anderson and save money, and I still don't believe Rowand was so magical or grinderish 2) Signing Jose long-term 3) Cintron and Mackowiak 4) Not spending money on a LH reliever coming into 06, and the infamous Jeff Nelson/Jose Paniagua experiment 5) Not spending any real money on relievers coming into 07, especially a veteran...trying outsmart the market 6) Not trading Crede, Dye, Contreras, Garland, Jenks, Matt Thornton, etc., at their "peak values" 7) Thinking Juan Uribe would play like 04/05 again, and the lack of development with Valido

QUOTE(kwolf68 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 04:17 PM) Simple: Because Kenny can't trade Jose. He's gassed and the real sad thing about this is Kenny didn't know he was gassed until the jalope' actually broke down on the side of the road. Kenny is such an ass. You don't trade in your junker car after it throws a rod and that is exactly what Williams tried to do last year with Jose. He couldn't get anyone out so Williams goes shopping him, as if the other GMs in baseball don't watch TV. He goes to shopping Dye in a contract year, shops Mark in a contract year, shops Crede coming back from injury going into a contract year. Crede was wanted by the Angels last year and any reports you read said the Sox were due to bring in a pretty nice haul, but Williams was out of his mind and didn't try to trade Crede UNTIL NOW, after his back finally gave way and with a contract year getting ready to start up. What is he doing? It's par for the course with this guy. Hang onto guys one year too late and then quickly try to deal your diminishing, aging talent before anyone notices they can't play anymore. He just continues to make this team older with no rhyme or reason. He's a lot like Dan Snyder, just collecting guys, making moves for the hell of it so his own name can be in the papers. If Williams ever wins another World Series again it will be a miracle. The guy sucks as a GM. He got lucky in 2005. And how did (or do) we know that, especially at that time, that Josh Fields was even capable of being a major league player? I think the jury's still out if he can actually play 3B everyday or if he's a DH/LF, which lowers his value substantially. Look at the struggles of Anderson and Sweeney and Borchard and the list goes on and on...let's say we traded Crede before last season (we definitely couldn't have put Fields there before 06) and Fields did what most Sox position prospects do, he failed miserably. Then we would have been stuck with Uribe or Mackowiak at 3B. That would have looked brilliant...trading the most well-liked member of the team and the hero of 2005 and replacing him with the equivalent of Chris Snopek/Greg Norton. It's not such an easy thing...would you have had the guts and prescience to just KNOW that Contreras would lose it just as magically as he became the best pitcher in the AL for a four month long stretch from August of 05 through May of 06? Was anyone on ANY White Sox board calling for Jose to be traded in May or June of 2006 (of course, after the sciatica injury, it was TOO late).

QUOTE(kwolf68 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 02:52 PM) You don't think adding MORE starting pitching will allow them to address those offensive problems? They added DEPTH at the most IMPORTANT position in the game and only had to give up a 33 year old player going into a contract year to do it. Don't be shocked if they make a subsequent deal within days + to get Garland they didn't have to unload a single prospect, average or otherwise, from their already loaded farm system. Well, keep in mind they have to replace Colon in their rotation...although he was injured for most of the season. This leaves the Angels with Lackey, Escobar, Weaver, Garland and Saunders as their rotation. Probably the second best rotation (ON PAPER) in the AL, minus the offensive firepower of the Red Sox. I don't see where they have any pitchers to trade...beyond either E. Santana and/or Saunders. Neither of those guys, or both together, is not going to get you a Miguel Cabrera caliber player. They would have to trade Kendry Morales, Willits and another fringe prospect in the mold of McPherson/Kotchmann (06-07) along with those two pitchers...and that opens up just as many problems as it solves. Maybe if they gave up Aybar/Morales/Willits (two of those three) along with Santana or Sanders...but neither of those pitchers are enough to get anyone excited, they're not true frontline starters, at least at this stage of their careers.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 02:41 PM) So, just really curious in all of this...what is really the point of this for either team? The White Sox get a 2nd shortstop, the Angels lose their only real good shortstop, the Sox lose a good starting pitcher and the Angels strengthen a strength...? I really don't think anybody should be surprised by the value returned; it's just the actual return that is brought back that weirds me out. Something's up, but OCab is here for sure. They felt they had to open the spot for Aybar and/or Wood. The thing that's funny is that the Angels STILL haven't addressed their offensive problems (the lack of one more middle of the order power hitter)...not having another big bat like Konerko in that line-up has been enough to cancel that strong starting pitching, lockdown bullpen and multi-faceted offensive attack in the post-season.