caulfield12

QUOTE(kwolf68 @ Aug 31, 2007 -> 01:51 PM) We needed to deal Mackowiak for an aging A ball player so we could get Andy Gonzalez some quality at bats. /extreme sarcasm above Not sure about Dubee (the kid acquired for Iguchi), but overall the deals made were head scratchers with players coming to Chicago that possessed very little (if any) upside. Dealing quality players under the auspices of turning positions over to up and coming players only works if said 'up and coming players' can actually hit their weight. All in all, Williams and Ozzies management of this franchise has been very questionable at best since the World Series. Part of it does seem like a "make good" because of the Garcia deal. Willie Harris...Richar...we've seen this before w/ Durham and Iguchi, and Ray was a better player (but even more expensive, albeit not as old as Tad). If we kept those two guys and we 10 games under .500, how would we be in any better shape? They'd still be gone in the offseason...our team would still be aging and getting WORSE from a fielding perspective...and Rob M. would still be a 4th/5th outfielder type. Nothing more, nothing less. We saw what happened in 2006 when he was an everyday player. As much as we might like Ozuna, Rob M. or Ross Gload, they are utility players for a reason...although 99% of Sox fans would take Pablo back at this point over Andy Gonzalez!

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Aug 31, 2007 -> 10:26 AM) Ever since I noticed the names in the 1B department hitting free agency this offseason, I've wanted to trade Konerko. The best FA 1B this offseason is Shea Hillenbrand. Someone would pay a lot for Pauly. And you would move Crede, Fields or Dye to 1B? Maybe Eddie Pearson or Liefer are still available...

QUOTE(Jenks Heat @ Aug 31, 2007 -> 09:53 AM) I disagree with the AL Central outlook. I am not sold on the Indians at all. They have some nice pieces but they have holes, they also do not shell out cash. The Tigers are getting as old as the White Sox and although they are spending, I think they will slip a little next year. The White Sox are almost forced into a position that they need to make moves and big one's. I am not sure what that means but minor league pitching for positional players ala the Indians last season will be the M.O. and having pitching in the minors in this day and age is much better than positional players and I think this is the stength that Sox fans miss. The back end of the pen, core rotation and run producers are there, they need to fill in the pieces. Why Thome, Konerko, Buerhle and Garland are still hanging around is beyond me they should be kicking back for next season. Our September rotation should be Floyd, Haegar, Masset, Sisco and one anyone else that needs to be on the 40 man. The problem is which of our pitchers have any value to other teams? Gonzalez and De Los Santos would be the highest rated I would guess. Russell? Egbert? Which leaves Broadway, Floyd, McCullough, Philllips, Haeger, Sisco, Masset. This is starting to remind me of the LH reliever tryouts going into the 2006 season...sure, we have a LOT of young pitchers. But can any of them actually pitch and be anything more than a fifth starter or long reliever? Egbert, Philllips and Haeger have so many detractors out there. Floyd is a headcase. McCullough and Broadway just don't have the stuff. Russell is headed for the bullpen apparently with his secondary pitches not quite crisp enough...probably the same situation with Sisco. Which leaves Masset, Egbert or Gio Gonzalez? Maybe FDLS if you REALLY push him developmentally.

QUOTE(Soxfest @ Aug 31, 2007 -> 08:43 AM) Alot is Williams fault, as far as the pick Sox will NOT spend top dollar and will draft the most signable guy period and cry about financial restraint! Well, it can't be both ways. First, we have too many expensive players (Konerko, Thome, Dye, Buehrle, Garland, Contreras, Vazquez) and now we're too cheap? I guess we will get on KW for painting us into a corner with the lack of payroll flexibility, and the fact that the contract for Contreras will be almost impossible to get off the books over the next two seasons, barring a miraculous turnaround. I don't even think that most of the issue with first rounders is KW's doing, it's more of a JR-philosophical thing. The fact is, there are only about 6-8 teams in MLB that are currently what you would call free spenders...unfortunately, the Tigers are one of them...and the Indians SEEMINGLY are set up for a nice run the next 2-3 seasons as well...Minnesota will always be in the mix with Ryan as GM, and the Royals are looking better and better, not to mention Moustakas COULD be a stud to go along with Gordon.

QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 31, 2007 -> 12:46 AM) Just blow the whole freaking thing up. The problem is that holding onto our numerous $10 million plus salary players (so we don't drive off our season ticket base and completely alienate them), partly due to the 2005 season...is holding us back big-time. Not unlike the patience of KW with the 2001-2002 teams leading to the possibility of a World Series in 2003 (with Valentin, Thomas, Lee, Ordonez)...we're in a much more difficult position than then, because these players are even older...early to mid 30's, not late 20's/early 30's.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines Interesting theory, I guess. You can only belabour the lack of production from SS, 2B, LF and CF so much...or the lack of "quality" from the replacement minor leaguers we've used in some of those positions. It's really difficult for me to see any article about the 2007 season that doesn't make Contreras' slippage (or falling off a cliff, if you prefer that analogy) the #1 item on the agenda. Even with McCarthy, Garcia, El Duque, Vizcaino, Thomas, Rowand and Chris Young....we're very much a .500 club, maybe 5 games above, or five games below. Somewhat like the Twins, I would guess. And I suppose that would be much better for Sox fans, but we would still probably be roughly an equal distance from contention...assuming that dealing a Vazquez or Garland could get us a comparable player to Young. You know Rowand wouldn't be putting up the same numbers in the AL, nor would El Duque. I know that's a HUGE assumption (that KW could find another Young), and requires more faith in KW than many currently have at the present time.

I think the best example might have been the Cameron game against Parque, et al.

QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Aug 28, 2007 -> 03:38 PM) Not a lot new here, but interesting to see it all summarized in one article. They also mention the Houston firings. http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-w...p&type=lgns Wonder if KW and Reinsdorf would ever think about hiring Purpura as Asst. GM?

QUOTE(Wanne @ Aug 30, 2007 -> 03:34 AM) Amen. I'd still give my left nut if Garland finished strong and he could be shipped to Seattle for Balentien. Second destination...Angels. I know what's coming next...an attack on Vazquez for being the second most underachieving/overrated Sox pitcher...fought off by the Roto players who love his peripherals, K/9IP, IP/H, WHIP, VORP, etc. The VORP could say he's one of the best pitchers in baseball and half the fans would have already decided he's a #4 starter, no matter what the season's evidence to the contrary is. The problem, of course, is that Buehrle is more like a great #2, and we our ace, El Gran Titan de Bronze, disappeared into the hazy Havana air. Which leaves us hoping that Danks can somehow morph into a Buehrle impersonator and become a legit #3 instead of a fading #5. Heck, I bet many Sox fans are starting to clamor for B-Mac again after his run of quality starts, juxtaposed with Danks' slide and Masset's exile to Oblivionville, Population 4 (Diaz/Adkins/Barcelo/Parque).

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Aug 30, 2007 -> 08:07 AM) This has nothing to do with earlier in the season. This issue here is, unless drastic changes occur in the roster -- which, aside from SS and CF is unlikey -- we're going to have the same group of people who are frustrating Guillen next year. I don't care that he bothered to voice his frustrations now. He could have said the same thing two months ago and it would have been just as true. It's just, he better get used to it. Does anyone seriously think Richar, Owens or Gonzalez are everyday players? Or has he reached Willie Harris status yet with the organization? Seriously, there's a huge talent shortage, and the talent we do have is either underachieving (Uribe), injured (Crede) or aging/declining (Dye, Konerko, Thome, Erstad, Pods, AJ). Fields is one of the lone bright spots..maybe Wasserman, lol. No quick fixes...unless we somehow can convince other organizations that the likes of Floyd, Phillips, Haeger, Broadway, McCullough, Sisco, Masset, Aardsma, etc., are actually worth something. Egbert, Russell, Gonzalez and De Los Santos had better arrive (and with positive results) in a hurry. Going out and spending $15-20 million on the bullpen like the Orioles did isn't the automatic solution either. If you look at 2005, though...it wasn't so much younger players that were the difference, it was the laddition of the likes of Pods, Vizcaino, Hermanson, El Duque, Contreras, Iguchi, players that were still close enough to their primes to "jell" as a unit or team.

QUOTE(chisoxt @ Aug 29, 2007 -> 08:46 PM) Exactly. It's one thing to have several 'projects' in the bullpen, but with this payroll it's downright cheap and foolish. Obviously, as has been send 1,000 times, the bullpen is a crapshoot. Thornton was very good last year, this year, so-so at best. I never thought Bukvich would be anything "close" to decent, and he has surprised me, same with Wasserman. Did the Brewers miraculously get better with Linebrink? Has SD collapsed without arguably the best middle reliever in baseball (him or Shields) over the last 2-3 years? Even if we had the 2005 bullpen, this team is, at best, a .500 proposition...maybe 5 games over. Right now, we're below major league average at 3B, SS, 2B, LF (with Owens) and CF. Our rotation, the most important part of any team....looks to be in good shape. SEEMINGLY. But that's what everyone wrote coming into 2006 and look what transpired. Besides Fields and a healthy Crede, we still have no "in house" answers for SS, 2B and CF. Assuming Joe is healthy. Richar probably will disappear from the White Sox and show up 2 years later hitting .350 for the Braves! Maybe we should just get Eckstein, Edmonds and bring back Aaron Miles. Just kidding. Although if we actually give Aaron Rowand anything approaching $10 million per season, I will officially think Williams has lost his mind.

QUOTE(Dogfood22 @ Aug 29, 2007 -> 05:33 PM) This thread should be titled "s***ty Articles Haunt Rogers' Credibility." Is there anything this guy doesn't b**** about? I agree with those who say the Vazquez trade was a good one. KW won a WS and did what he had to in order to improve the starting rotation and improve the team's chances of making the postseason. Also KW must have seen that a dropoff from the starting staff was possible if not probable, so at the time adding a veteran innings eater in Vazquez was going to give them something more dependable than McCarthy/El Duque and also save the bullpen some work. It takes balls to trade a prospect like Young for a shot at the present. I'd much rather have a ballsy GM willing to go the extra mile when the opportunity is there than have some cocksucker whose big winter additions after a 95-win season are Paul Byrd + Jason Michaels or Sidney Ponson + Ramon Ortiz. The only reason some douchebag sportswriter, and a bad one at that if I may say so, can complain to anyone is because the Sox didn't repeat in '06. If the Sox had won it all again it would have been very well worth it. As it is, considering Javy's contract and the state of the upcoming FA market without Burls or Zambrano available and turd-filled hotpockets like Kyle Lohse getting paid out the cornhole, Javy's value is going to be higher this year than it was when we traded for him in the first place. If KW wants to avenge a trade that really wasn't a bad trade at all, he can do it this offseason and actually come out ahead. I don't think Ryan can magically spend millions he doesn't have...and the Indians rotation isn't THAT bad, I'll admit that Jason Johnson was a stretch last year, but you can't make a Pinto into a BMW 7 series. As always, it will come down to pitching...with Russell looking like he's slated for the bullpen, the end of the Sweeney future apparently, or Haeger, or Anderson. Simply, Egbert, Phillips (the one seemingly nobody in the Sox organization wants to succeed) or Gio has to step up and be a legitimate 3 caliber starter. And that's asking for a LOT. I've given up even considering Masset, Broadway, McCullough, Floyd or Sisco, although I am sure I will hear Floyd's name in association with the starting rotation next spring again. Luckily, I've been in the Philippines and now in China (since July 23rd) so I've missed seeing the live carnage, following through MLB Extra Innings and cbssportsline. I guess nobody really saw the wheels completely coming off the Contreras train like they have, QUITE SO SOON...going from the best pitcher the AL to one of the worst in the span of less than two seasons. I also see the drumbeat for Torii Hunter and don't see the different philosophy taking hold of this organization...if anything, KW is going backwards in time, to the 2002-04 teams with Ordonez, Valentin, Carlos Lee and Thomas. And we still don't know anything about Joe Crede. By the way, please get what we can for Jon Garland. I've never seen such an average pitcher so overvalued in the recent history of this organization...

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Jun 26, 2007 -> 10:56 PM) Before KW begins his rebuilding, I would like him to take a few facts into consideration: 1. Detroit, Minny, and Cleveland will be good to very good the next few tears. 2. Based on my calculations, the Sox have $55 mill tied into 6 players next year with guaranteed contracts-Vazquez, Garland, Contreras, PK, Thome (I only included $8 mill since that's all the Sox are paying) and AJ.I'm too lazy to look up Mackowiack and McDougal's contracts as well as Ozuna's. 3. Assuming all White Sox free agent's walk after this year, the sox will have 9 glaring holes to fill: 1 SP, at least 3 relievers (unless they reach their potential quickly), 2B, SS, all 3 OF posiitons. 4. Crede will get a 1 year contract worth $4-4.5 mill making it $60 mill tied up in 7 players. The Sox won't release him but may trade hm if he proves he's healthy. So, assuming the payroll stays where it is this year-and taht's a big assumption because there will be a decline in attendance this year--do you think you can spend $40 mill and fill 9 holes to legitimately compete with the rest of the division? Sure trading Buehrle may get you 2 studs and you'll get something good for Dye. But will this be enough? I don't think so. Now is the time to start an almost full scale rebuilding. Don't trade everyone, but get pretty damn close to it. The money saved by trading now with the added payroll flexibility added with the prospects we will receive can make this a very quick rebuilding process...if KW does it right. IMHO, Garland is the player with the most trade value on this team. He is pitching the best and signed through 2008. What's preventing the Sox from getting a great offer for Buehrle is that it's his walk year. Heck, even teams are scouting Contreras. As much as I like him, there's something to be said of getting a good prospect or 2 for a $10 mill. pitcher with an ERA near 5. KW needs to make this team younger, faster, and more fundamentally sound. If it means trading good pitching now to get 2 stud prospects for Buerle, or 3 studs for Garland or a couple of good prospects for COntreras then do it. Because this team has too many holes too not do it. Unless KW can figure out how to fill 9 glaring holes with $40 mill., it won't matter how well Garland, Contreras, and Vazquez pitch next year because an OF combo of Erstad, Ozuna, Sweeney, Mackowiak, Terrero, Gonzalez, Anderson and anyone else I'm missing that's under contract for next year is pretty awful. Paying $5 mill for Uribe and his .270 OBP is terrilbe. I hope KW has thought this through. Because to come into 2008 and maybe ne an 85 win team next year isn't worth keeping a guy like Garland or Contreras who will leave town after 2008 anyway. Might as well trade both of them now while teams are willing to give up more talent since these guys have that extra year on their contract at a realistic price. I hope KW gets it. I have a feeling he's going to try to rebuild on the fly. And I don't think that's a good plan considering the divison we're in. If this were the NL Central, I'd be looking to buy right now. But it's not. So unless the minor league system starts producing good players overnight, it's time to ake a step back this year to take many steps forward in the upcoming years. Do you think KW realizes this? Bob Contreras' deal is through 2009, fwiw. I do think that dealing Garland and Buehrle makes the most sense, although I wouldn't mind trying to keep one of them as the centerpiece of the rotation and as a "mentor" for Danks/Gio and the other youngsters on the way. You'd much rather trade Vazquez or Contreras, but how easy would those moves be compared to Garland and Buehrle? Also, KW invested too much into Vazquez to prove the Chris Young deal wasn't a bust...but he's not going to get us back to the World Series, just .500, like his career record and results indicate. He's not a "winner" like Garland, Buehrle or Contreras IMO. It's the principle of letting Ordonez, Lee and Valentin go and replacing them with AJ, Iguchi, Hermanson, El Duque, Dye, Pods and Vizcaino. As long as you get quality, regular players, it's the logical way to rebuild. You don't go out and spend $10-15 million on Ichiro, Hunter or Andruw Jones with the White Sox many players away from being a contender...those acquisitions are the "over the top" players you add to a roster with a 90 win potentially, like we thought we were doing with the Thome move. The thing to be optimistic about is that the depth we do supposedly have in the minors is pitching, which is a lot more expensive to go out and buy through FA than position players.

QUOTE(GreenSox @ Jun 26, 2007 -> 10:29 PM) ERstad was hardly a serious effort to replace Anderson (and it wasn't anderson anyway - an anderson/mack platoon)....he's a declining player that struggles getting on base and has no power and no arm. Williams should have brought in a legitimate CF. I know Erstad hits ozzie-style: he goes up there hacking at any pitch his bat can reach and can make an out to whatever side of the infield Ozzie instructs him. Williams doesn't need to cater to Ozzie's weak-points. And Williams added no one solid in the bullpen either - and unfortunately they have pitched about as bad as they possibly could. Williams had some rough luck in the offseason. The real concern is Ozzie's unwillingness to develop young talent. Hopefully he's capable of doing it (not sure he is) and hopefully Williams will force him to do it, because Ozzie has little patience with young hitters. But pretty soon, developing young hitters will be the prime goal of the season. He has been rewarded for his patience with Andy Gonzalez with two very productive days. Fields is playing almost everyday, except against the toughest righties. Should he have played Fields instead of Cintron versus Shields? Would that necessarily help Josh to strike out 2-3 more times? What else could Ozzie do with Owens or Molina? Not much. You can argue about Sweeney, but he was clearly overmatched the last week or so and they did the right thing with him IMO. This always goes back to Brian Anderson, but that's such a polarizing argument, there's no point in rehashing it, is there?

I wonder if KW is seriously considering bringing back Crede next year? We would have to pay him around $5 million again, or I suppose we could cut him like the Cubs did with Prior. It sucks to just lose an asset like that and get nothing at all in return, but it would also be foolhardy to bring him back, just to try to "showcase" him and trade him to the highest bidder. Then again, he could go out like Magglio or Frank Thomas and become a very productive player again...but back injuries are the trickiest for baseball players and golfers, since there's so much torque generated by a swing (see Thome, Jim or Sheffield, Gary).

QUOTE(GreenSox @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 10:14 PM) I agree. The players with real talent sit in AAA, while the hackers get the PT. It's ridiculous. Anderson and Sweeney should be playing every day on the ml team. My only reservation is whether Guillen develop them or ruin them. Ozzie jerked Anderson around last year and didn't give him a chance this year. Chris Young, the recipient of immense hype particularly after he left the Sox, hasn't set the world on fire in Arizona. He's been injured. I think Rogers has slightly changed his tact on the Garcia and McCarthy trades...he first criticized them saying the Sox got ripped and certainly they wouldn't help a ready-to-win team; then he said he was wrong; now he's saying well, they didn't address real needs...so we used Mccarthy and Gacia to bring in pitchers instead of CF, SS etc. It's BS. I don't know how everyone can just magically assume Brian Anderson was ready to be a regular player with that swing of his. Heck, you can make the same argument about Fields, but he's at least making some productive outs and picking up RBI's at a nice pace...still you can't strike out 1/2.5 PA. I guess if he put another hit or two together tonight (two balls barely foul, one a would be homer), I'd feel better. The other problem is Fields isn't hitting to the opposite side either. I don't mind Gonzalez playing, I would love to see some new blood replace Cintron and maybe Ozuna if he's not healthy again. The more questions we answer with Owens, Sweeney, Anderson, Fields, the better off we'll be in terms of finding a direction in the offseason. Richar should get a long look as well as he assumes the Willie Harris "heir apparent" label, and Getz could get a few AB's as well down the stretch, especially if Iguchi were to be traded.

And Farmer's delivering a dissertation on why the manta rays should not be compromised by being housed in a tank at the Trop. Hilarious stuff, he sounds like Pamela Anderson.

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 07:32 PM) OMG, 3-3 for Gonzalez. Uribe scores, it's a 2-2 ballgame. DJ and Hawk praising Gonzo? Well, even Owens had one or two decent games this season. I think he actually started out 3 for 5.

Are the White Sox really interested in Corey Hart (not to be confused w/ the I Wear My Sunglasses at Night dude)???

Did anyone notice Rick Ankiel has 20 homers in the minors this year? If he made it back to the majors, that would be the Disney script for The Rookie II.

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 06:54 PM) Thats really awesome. Good luck to you. 2-0 on the slow roller down the line. I have an MS in Sports Management and worked for the Augusta GreenJackets (we were w/ the Pirates at the time) two seasons, but I've only coached high school soccer, volleyball and basketball, so I don't think I will be selected. However, with the Olympics in Beijing in 2008 (along with baseball) and the very real possibility of exhibition games in Beijing and Tianjin next February or March, I think maybe I will take the "translator/marketing/promotions" angle and pitch it to them more from an administrative than coaching standpoint, as that's more my background.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 06:49 PM) Are you serious? You working on becoming an agent? Not really. However, I did apply for the MLB Envoy Coaching program and have been talking to someone in the MLB offices in NYC. They are close to opening an office in Beijing, but I am in Wuhan. I was in Colombia, South America, teaching last year and didn't find anyone worth signing in the games I watched in Cartagena, Santa Marta and Barranquilla. I did talk to Renteria's brother on the phone a bunch, and Orlando Cabrera is from there as well.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 06:46 PM) Would Earvin Santana and Brandon Wood meet that description (albeit Wood's status has dropped off a bit). Or maybe Howie Kendrick and prospects? PG Earvin "Magic" Santana? Or Swervin' Ervin Santana?

Well, I'm working on signing 3 players for the White Sox in China. If KW or Laumann doesn't listen to me, I'll send them the Royals' way. LOL. Actually, the Yankees signed the first two last week, and the Red Sox and Dodgers are already making inroads as well here.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 06:43 PM) If Terrero and Fields play everyday the rest of the year, and Paulie and Thome do their thing, the Sox should at least come close to the franchise record for ks in a season. Didn't seem to hurt the Tigers too much last season...