caulfield12

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ May 9, 2007 -> 12:02 AM) If this team is 10+ games out next month, I wouldn't be too upset with a fire sale, but I hope KW actually gets some real quality in return. It's sort of intriguing as well. KW needs to look at Oakland and Milwaukee. Rebuild how they did. Oakland rebuilt with getting a very good pitcher in Haren in return for Mulder. Some of their moves, like signing Loaiza and overpaying, weren't so smart. They really could use Bonderman about right now. Blanton is serviceable but not more than a 4/5. Kennedy and Gaudin are castoffs from other organizations. The only way they can do any damage is for Harden and Haren to be healthy all season...but BB doesn't believe that will happen, so he's trying to get the highest possible return for Harden, but I don't think anyone will be dumb enough to bite. They haven't really replaced the firepower of Giambi, Tejada, Damon, Dye and Hernandez...they're a team that heavily relies on starting pitching, clutch hitting, OBP and the back of their bullpen. Buck looks like he MIGHT be a decent player, but Crosby really struggled with injuries and the sophomore jinx, and Chavez fell off as well. Bradley was a high-risk/high-reward move that KW would have prided himself in, but they have too many complementary players on offense like Kotsay, Ellis, Johnson, Kendall, etc. Just not enough firepower without Piazza's bat in the middle of the order. If you want to look a model organizations, you need to look at Florida, Minnesota, Milwaukee and the Angels.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ May 9, 2007 -> 12:04 AM) The Gospel According to Dusty. Thanks for that. Probably the dumbest thing I've read here in quite a while. From 2000-2006, why have we only played better in the 2nd half of the season once? I want to hear YOUR explanation. We're just chokers 86% of the time? That seems like a trend to me. Maybe it's global warming.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ May 8, 2007 -> 11:01 PM) Excellent, I have work tomorrow night so I won't be around to demand a trade or firing. No firings this year. Bring in a new hitting instructor for 2008. That's it. I'm fine with Ozzie. We're just not good...if OG was a great manager, we'd win 86-90 games with this team, but it still wouldn't be enough to make the playoffs, and we'd be a year older and a great manager would be doing incredibly well to get to .500 without Buehrle, Crede, Dye and Iguchi, and probably Uribe too. QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ May 8, 2007 -> 11:03 PM) Personally, I hold June 11th as the deciding date to officially declare players for sale. Little more than a month from now. If we're seven or more games out, it may be time for Williams to make a difficult decision -- either have false belief, or restock for 2008 and beyond. I just hope Williams realizes for any player traded, this organization's future relies upon the return package. Fans shouldn't be expecting only a 'B' and 'C' level prospect for Buehrle. I don't even care if people make excuses of "oh well, no one wants a rent-a-player" or "who trades (player) for (return value)." It's what needs to be done to ensure this team competes in the future. And no, I don't expect a Top 10 prospect; but neither do I expect the type of players Williams acquires from scrap heaps. You know, the pitchers or positional players who have had several good seasons in the past and are currently mediocore. Or those players who, because of injury or ineffectiveness, haven't fulfilled their promise. No Gavin Floyd projects. No one who I have to hear ," Coop will fix him." If the Tigers gave up the now injured Humberto Sanchez, who was one of their 3 best pitching prospects, along with a couple of others, to get a 38 Sheffield....we should be able to get something comparable for Dye, especially if KW predicates the deal on that team working out an extension as a condition of the trade. We wouldn't have traded for Garcia had we not known we were going to be able to keep him for 3 more years.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:57 PM) Do you want to start the next one or should I? Last year in the second half is when KW should have "sold out" to go for broke and try to hold off the Twins, when the Red Sox and Indians were down... It's too late now. The only weak spot with Detroit was Maroth and Sheffield's slow start, but they're covering up nicely, even Durbin has done well enough and they have Andrew Miller. Heck, Jason Grilli is replacing Rodney adequately right now. There's a reason we're last in the AL in runs for a stretch of 115 games. We're not very good...and we're getting older and older, you're starting to see signs of why KW was so hesitant with Dye and Iguchi. The only really bad contract I think we'll end up with is for Contreras, through 09, unless Konerko never wakes up and returns to 2002/03 stupor form.

QUOTE(SoxAce @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:52 PM) That's another organization. Maybe Houston should have quit two years ago when their record was horrid the first couple of months. It's a different ballgame for different organizations. Houston also developed quite a history of that, doing it at least twice and coming VERY close last year as well. The heat in Chicago takes a lot of out us in August and the first half of September. We've traditionally been a lousy second half team, holding on and treading water in 2000 and 2005 and fading in 2003, 2002 and 2006. 2001 is the only year we played better the last four months (without Wells, David and Thomas), and that year, the struggle was to get from 14-29 back to the .500 mark, which we did accomplish. Minnesota and Houston play in climate-controlled parks.

QUOTE(fathom @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:48 PM) Did Jerry Owens do something I didn't see? Heck, even Escobar has had more success in the majors than Owens has. Well, considering he only spent $25,000 or $50,000 on Escobar, it was a very good move...I guess it seemed better in 2004 or 05 than it seems today, because of his age and some of his struggles as well as his defensive and arm strength limitations.

QUOTE(SoxAce @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:45 PM) I know this lost was tough, but this thread is ridiculous. Two days? Please. I'll agree with Showtime in saying that if we play s***ty these next couple weeks, then I can see this organization thinking differently next month even though I would give it a month and a half/ two months tops. The Twins were very close to trading Hunter and sending Morneau to the minors in early June last year...and they finally turned the corner, around the 7th-10th of June. That's exactly one month from now. We don't have the luxury of bringing in Liriano from the pen, discovering an MVP, Rookie of the Year, Cy Young Winner and Rolaids Relief Man all on one team....we'd be lucky to have ONE of those happen. Where it becomes a mathematical difficulty is one month from now and 7.5-9 games out. We could be closing in on that territory after this weekend.

QUOTE(chisoxt @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:41 PM) Yea, I was thinking the same thing.... Kenny has never been good at fleecing other teams for prospects. Usually, he's the one in the giving mood. Great at identifying undervalued major league players....horrible at finding AA and AAA talent, with the one exception being the slight chance he took on Bobby Jenks and picking up Jerry Owens from the Nationals for Alex Escobar. If you look at 2002, you remember names like Barry/Berry, Felix Diaz, Jon Adkins, Onan Masaoka, Gary Majewski, the immortal Byeon Hak-An and Frank Francisco. The two "stars" were Diaz and Adkins, and they disappointed mightily. Francisco and Majewski would have been nice bullpen pieces had we kept them. In fact, we might have won in 2003 if Francisco was the closer for the entire season, instead of Koch. But he wasn't quite ready then, nor had he thrown any chairs or suffered a major injury.

QUOTE(fathom @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:37 PM) No way....we're still counting on Thome and Hall to help this team. If we had to go into firesale mode less than 2 months into the season with a 100 million dollar payroll, then everyone in the organization should be fired. We wouldn't have to do it in any division except the one we're in right now...our team is in the wrong place at the wrong time. And KW is going to have to be decisive, not wishy-washy, like he has been since the World Series championship.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:36 PM) I don't see it starting within the organization for at least another month. If we get swept by the Twins, who we're fighting with for third place, it has to cross the minds of every single White Sox fan. We've seen it all before, the last time in 2002. It's not only losing, it's how we're losing. Even after Sunday's miracle, you didn't get the sense that this team was ready to take off and get on a roll of 5-6 wins in a row, like we did after Buehrle's no-no.

Last year, the Twins had to play 38 games over .500 over a four month stretch to catch the Tigers on the last day. They also had to catch only two teams, we will have to pass three, in Detroit, Cleveland and Minnesota. Our bullpen has now blown more games than the Twins last season, both total blown saves (7) and games lost as result of those blown saves (4). Our offense is last in the American League since the All-Star break of 2006 in scoring runs. The low point for the Twins last year was 8 games under .500 and 12 games back. We're staring a 6.5 games back after tomorrow, as the team simply hasn't scored any runs for Danks, I think they're averaging a little over a run per game for him, actually. I don't think we have the ability to play much more than 20 games over .500 for five months, and the odds are that either the Indians and/or the Tigers will be ahead of us....and now we have to deal with the Yankees again with Clemens being added to that staff. For the record, I don't think the Twins will be able to stay with the Tigers and Indians either, but they're a better team than the White Sox and could be a great team again next year if Liriano returns to 100%, which is a big question mark. Sweeney will be a good player in a year or two, and I'd love to see him play everyday for the rest of the season, but he's not going to carry the offense either. He's a complementary player, like Erstad or Mackowiak or Uribe, nothing more. Not yet. I would seriously see what I could get for MacDougal, Thornton and maybe even Jenks...although I'm backing off that a little now, realizing that Aardsma might not ever have the mentality to be a closer, Sisco is too wild and Masset just doesn't have dominating stuff....or he hasn't shown it yet at least.

QUOTE(southsida86 @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:16 PM) Just Logan and Jenks. I think Bobby is unavailable today. 2 games in a row, but he had yesterday off I swear I would walk Morneau here...but it won't happen, you don't want to walk in the winning run

QUOTE(fathom @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:14 PM) The offense didn't exactly go nuts tonight. If not for a terrible throw by Bonser, we might have only one or two runs. Mastny is coming in according to the Twins'...er, Masset. Looks like he's in for the duration, unless the choice is Logan, Ozuna or Buehrle.

QUOTE(TheOcho @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:09 PM) This is the end. My only friend, the end.... Jim Morrison, 1944-1971

QUOTE(fathom @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:06 PM) Wow, quite funny. It's hard for me to get too down on him after two magical seasons. The HR against Nathan last year was almost as good as Carlos Lee's against Mariano Rivera...or Konerko.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:05 PM) Great f***in AB. Looking forward to running out of pitchers if we somehow make it to 11. We still have Masset and Sisco. The problem is we have 15 games in 16 days and I have a feeling Danks is going to struggle for some reason tomorrow...meaning two "pen" days in a row.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ May 8, 2007 -> 10:01 PM) I love when Ozzie manages to use 3 pitchers in one inning and we are forced to play extras. Puts us in a great situation. You have to play for the win ASAP on the road. Your best pitchers do their job and there's no reason to not have Jenks close the game in the 9th.

QUOTE(RME JICO @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:48 PM) 24 pitches for Nathan on 3 outs, wow. At least they all worked the count a little. Does Iguchi's swing look slow as hell or is it just the MLB.tv? Blyleven said it....like he was reaching or searching for the ball, called them "akward" swings to be nice.

QUOTE(fathom @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:42 PM) Pitchers must love facing our hitters....they can throw all the hangers they want, and no damage will come of it. I'm so thankful we didn't extend Dye, Iguchi, or Crede. Straight down the middle...thanks for playing, Joe. Grab a seat.

QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:42 PM) Dye really needs to take Iguchi with him and join Brian Anderson in AAA. The only good thing about tonight is Torii Hunter is quickly pricing himself out of Minnesota's salary range when he hits the market.

QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:42 PM) Dye really needs to take Iguchi with him and join Brian Anderson in AAA. The only good thing about tonight is Torii Hunter is quickly pricing himself out of Minnesota's salary range when he hits the market.

QUOTE(Capn12 @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:33 PM) Every. f***ing. Time. Our "vaunted" bullpen just isn't that good...7 blown saves, 10 for 17 so far this season. That's not good enough. The Twins lost 3 games ALL last season they were leading going into the 7th, we've already lost 3 this season in that category (CLE, at Oak, at Detroit)

QUOTE(fathom @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:31 PM) Clutch Crede strikes again Gold Glovers make that play...watch it come back to bite us.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:29 PM) Give me a f***ing break. One ball was hit hard that inning. Buckling my ass... I love when people here become psychiatrists... Find a single Royals' fan who is upset Mac is gone...I dare you. I've lived in KC and watched his entire career, he's not good against the best teams.

QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ May 8, 2007 -> 09:23 PM) shocking. mcdoogal gets pounded. And there's the essence of the trade...against really good teams, in difficult circumstances, Mac buckles. It's why the Royals parted with him so easily, he's not reliable when you really need him to get an out, his control just isn't good because he has no idea where his FB is going. This Rabe kid has some pop...better be careful.