Y2Jimmy0

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Aug 3, 2013 -> 01:03 AM) False. They don't need it. St. Louis is 27th in the league in home runs with 83 and have one of the best records in the league. If you can get enough hitters at the top of the line up that get on base (can be singles, walks, HBP, anything to get on) and have the middle of the order be able to get hits with those runners on base is all you need. There always has been the stigma that corner infield and outfield players need to put up good power numbers. That isn't the case. Teams can win without hitting home runs all the time. And you don't have to have tons of power in order to get doubles. Manny Machado- 9 home runs, but 39 doubles and he plays 3B. James Loney- 10 HR but is batting .313 Playing 1B for Tampa Bay who has the 2nd best record in the AL. We don't NEED hitters at 1st or 3rd or LF or RF that are going to all hit at least 20 home runs. I just don't understand why everyone thinks that a certain player can't play a position because he doesn't have enough power. If the guy can play good defense and gets on base he can play wherever the hell he wants I disagree. Those cases are the exception and not the rule. While most of your points are valid, that power has to come from somewhere. It doesn't have to be 200 homers but power is important. Machado doesn't have big HR numbers but their CF and SS hit for power. Their Catcher is capable of hitting for power as well. The Cubs of the 90's were able to survive with Grace at 1B because they had a 2B who hit for power. Trust me I understand what you are saying but the White Sox cannot get outslugged in their own park. If the White Sox are going to play in US Cellular Field they need to hit for a good amount of power in my opinion.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Aug 2, 2013 -> 05:15 PM) I really wanna know what that last deal Hahn was close to making. Stone said it was a major deal, names just aren't out. Anybody wonder that? Stone speculated about Dunn and Texas afterward. Not that that deal was available but just speculation. Stone also hammered the team and management pretty hard. He mentioned all of the moved that other teams made and then said when you add "Keppinger and Lindstrom" that isn't exactly getting it done. Yikes.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 03:48 PM) Boo to The Challenge yesterday. So do you think that happened because of Trishelle and Sarah getting booted on a guys' week last week?

QUOTE (Jake @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 02:12 PM) I think Law used to dislike the White Sox because KW had singled him out as an "idiot" in the past. I think he has since, more or less, buried the hatchet. There are reasons not to like Avisail Garcia. When he was asked about Avisail on ESPN, he was very diplomatic. He said there is division among people like him about how his approach will play at the MLB level over time. He first presented the case that many see him being a perennial all-star, but said that his and some others' opinion was that he "has no plan at the plate" and thus is unlikely to hit it big. Joel (Washington, DC) An observation not a question: when you see a guy like Brandon Cumpton (9th round draft pick) come up from AAA and shut out the Cardinals in a critical, playoff like game it puts our collective prospect obessions in perspective. Elite talent is essential, but depth is important also. Klaw (1:31 PM) Depth is huge. It takes 8 or 9 starters to get through a season unless you're the 2005 White Sox. See Law doesn't in fact hate the Sox. Haha

Here is Keith Law's chat transcript pertaining to a question about Semien. Nate (Chicago) Keith, Marcus Semien was promoted to AAA Charlotte this week. He is having a pretty impressive year statistically. How do his tools project in the major leagues? Solid everyday guy, utility, or np? Klaw (1:40 PM) Average regular at 2b. Don't believe he can be an everyday SS defensively, although that's based on a somewhat dated look at him in the field.

Many of us on this board have discussed the pros/cons of Dayan Viciedo moving to 1B. Well Mark Gonzalez had a couple of tweets that mentioned Viciedo taking balls at 1st Base today. Mark Gonzales ‏@MDGonzales 10m VIciedo getting early work at first base: pic.twitter.com/uIvGmDBXlm Mark Gonzales ‏@MDGonzales 8m Viciedo took some grounders at third base in Toronto in April. Today's work at first looks more serious, with throws to 2b, flips to 1b What do you guys think? Just a way to plan ahead for Garcia coming up soon? Something on the horizon with Dunn or PK? It tells me initially that Garcia will be the CF when he comes up possibly with De Aza going to LF.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/pros...tros-avalanche/

QUOTE (Jake @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 12:37 PM) I did not get the message that we are trying to rebuild. As a matter of fact, I got the impression that that is the last thing he wants to happen. He isn't about to drop $50 million in free agency to make sure we compete, but he certainly wants to make this team good as quickly as possible. There is a reason he didn't mention the draft as part of our future, only mentioning that better drafting in the past couple years has already built up our system. There won't be any all-in next year, but I'd expect to see a new veteran or two around and a team that expects to finish better than last. He's going to try to get maximum value for our players and if that means Rios turns into young but good prospects, he's okay with that. He's going for as much Avisail Garcia type guys as possible and even suggested that Avisail has already begun to shorten our rebuilding window. He said he is fully willing to hold on to our veterans if we don't get fair deals because we can always go out and win next year. He also repeatedly talked about the pitching and how the rebuild is already partially done because of how good our pitching is. He's right about that. Read between the lines. He knows that it is fairly evident that they will not be in a position to win next year. They should be better but they will not have the talent to win a division. I thought he was pretty clear about that.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 11:59 AM) More specifically, he would not be in my top 15. Sorry but that's just stupid and insane in my opinion. It's not always just about numbers. It's about what a player projects to be and his floor and ceiling. Now could Hawkins completely bust and not make it out of High A? I guess that is possible. It's just as possible that he figures it out and becomes an All Star RF for the White Sox years down the road. He still has the highest ceiling in the entire system. Whether or not he reaches that is up to him but not having him in the top 10-15 prospects in a bottom 5 farm system in baseball is just ludicrous.

Law has worked for a team before. He has a cake job right now. Working for ESPN doing what he does gives him great flexibility. He gets to scout, write, and still spend time with his family. I don't always agree with Keith Law but it's just another opinion that helps shape the thought process on a player. Kevin Goldstein was a guy that I really liked. He scouted for Baseball Prospectus and is a local guy. He took a position with the Houston Astros under Jeff Lunhow. It's about opportunity. Would Goldstein have taken the same position under a GM whose premise and philosophy he didn't agree with? Maybe. But maybe it's about actually enjoying your job and what you are doing. Keith Law does not hate the White Sox. He hates teams that value what the Sox have always valued. He does not understand not spending money on the draft and taking the process seriously. KW wanted high impact toolsy players but JR did not want to spend money. That is how you end up with the Jared Mitchells and Keenyn Walkers of the world. Law didn't like Sale or Tyler Danish because of the delivery. There are many other people equivalent to Keith Law who disagree and liked both players though. It's just a matter of preference. Law would have disliked the Danish pick for anyone not just the White Sox. When the Sox start drafting better, Keith Law's opinion of the front office will change. He praised the Tim Anderson pick this year and the Hawkins pick last year. He also liked the Andrew Mitchell pick this year. Law is a pompous asshole a lot of times but he does put in a large enough amount of time to validate him having an opinion.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 10:34 AM) I don't need to watch bad baseball to follow those young players, that's what Soxtalk & Twitter are for. If it's convenient I will go or watch, but if a team tells me winning doesn't matter this year, then I don't care to invest as much time in that team either. That's fine too if that is your preference. I am sure the White Sox would welcome you back with open arms as soon as they are ready to win again.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 10:41 AM) Just to remind, teams can't do this any more. There's really diminishing returns on how many scouts you send to see the same 3-4 players, and spending on international players is now capped. I am aware of this. They will spend their entire pool though. They will have upwards of $10 million to spend on the draft. That is still their own money that they are spending though. I would expect that they use all of their allotted amount in the international market as well.

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 03:50 AM) This thread is ridiculous. With our market/payroll, you play to win every year. I can't believe I'm reading people say, "I want to lose next year." I refer you all to the Pirates/Royals/Padres of the late 90s/00's. Handfuls of early 1st round picks, nothing to show for it. Look at 1st rounds in the last ten years. Your first five picks will produce 2-3 MLB starters and then the last 25 picks of the round will give you 4-5 major league starters. You play to win the game. Picking #7 as opposed to #17 rarely makes a difference. This isn't the NBA/NFL. I respect the fact that you want to win. I do as well. I am just willing to wait to win. They don't have the offense to win next year and it will not be easily acquired. The only direction to go is back to move forward. 2014 will be a development year. I would not count on free agent signings because it just is not going to happen. We can argue all day about the draft. I think if you are going to be bad it's a good thing to give your scouts and evaluators one of the top 5 picks in each round to work with. If you draft properly that gives you the best chance at acquiring the best talent. I don't want to argue with you but they have dug themselves such a hole that next year is a wash regardless of the size of the market where the team lies.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 10:04 AM) So the Sox are gonna be the Cubs in 2014? Great, another baseball-less summer. That's not entirely true. They will hopefully be developing talent. Go to the ballpark for other reasons. Go to the park to see Avisail Garcia. Go check out Sale, Santiago, Quintana, Johnson, Rienzo starts. Follow the club's minor league system. There is a good chance that guys like Marcus Semien, Trayce Thompson and others make their ML debuts next season. You just have to change the way you view the team as a fan. The White Sox have always said that they want sustained long term success. Now they actually mean it instead of just giving it lip service.

Many of you need to read the new thread I created about Rick Hahn on with Spiegel and Finfer this morning. Those of you that want free agents this offseason are going to be disappointed. Many will be spent on the draft and on the international market. Maybe a free agent here and there. 2014 is a wash.

Rick Hahn was on the McNeil and Spiegel Show this morning. I will try to paraphrase some of it. He was reluctant to say the word "rebuild". However, he made it very clear that this will be a rebuilding situation. He noted that the toughest thing to find during a rebuild is starting pitching and the White Sox have it. He mentioned that his excess of money will be redistributed in the organization in the draft and on the international market. That is a big emphasis going forward. Mentioned that he could sign free agents "if it made sense". He basically said to pay attention to the moves that are made rather than hearing him make some giant proclamation about a rebuild. Made it sound like he wanted to make deals but was basically only offered deals in a salary dump like scenario. He said that twitter and other avenues are so crazy because he saw guys that he offered, were offered, or turned down that was just completely off base. He also said there is a very good chance that he will make waiver trades or deals in the offseason. I loved hearing Rick Hahn this morning. They do still cater to the lowest denominator of the fanbase by not saying the word "rebuild". Smart fans can handle it. I love the direction though and I love the man who is in charge. He is a very smart, articulate guy and he has quite the mess in front of him. I am happy with the direction. I recommend all of you go and find the interview whenever it's posted on McNeil and Spiegel's website.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 1, 2013 -> 12:10 AM) What happened to Mr. Optimism Jake? I guess we'll just agree to disagree on this. I truly believe adding one super star to the mix turns this whole thing around. My little paragraph in my last post just made so much sense to me lol but I guess that's why I've been called quite the optimist on several occasions. BTW Rios is batting .315 vs fastballs this year to go along with the .371 last year...You put him in front of Cano and he'll see A LOT more fastballs thus being an even better hitter. You do realize that Cano is going to get like a 10 year deal for $250 million right? It's just not gonna happen. There will be 2 teams interested: Dodgers and Yankees.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 06:49 PM) Adam has value and actually has been really good the last couple of months. The problem is his value isn't as high as his salary. If he put 6 months together like the last 2 he would be worth it. I would just go into next season with Dunn. He's going to hit 40 homers this year. There's a chance that Dunn has a ton of homers in the 1st half next year and they will be able to get something for him at next year's deadline. I don't think Rios is on next year's team though.

I don't think so. I expect Danks to be a lot better next year. On top of that, after next season Rios and Dunn are definitely gone. Danks at $15 million per isn't too bad at that point and you may be able to actually gets something. I really just don't want to sell low on Danks when his salary isn't really hampering the White Sox in the case of making moves.

QUOTE (HeGone7 @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 04:11 PM) I understand I am likely in the minority here but this is a failure in my eyes on Hahn and the Sox. I am all for getting a fair deal, and that may not be "the best deal", but you cannot fall on your face as we did. 2nd to last in baseball, big contracts on books and players clogging positions you hoped to clear for young guys to audition. I just can't fathom that of all the years we see major players moving for major prospects, this is the year they do not. There is still time to deal some guys in August, and the offseason obviously, but in my eyes things have delayed our recovery time. I get we didn't want garbage or a guy just to have one, but creativity, as we saw with Boston is key in these situations. I can't help but be grossly disappointed and maybe that disappointment is being channeled incorrectly onto Hahn, but where else do we put the blame? Their big contracts aren't killing them though. Next Year's Commitments: Danks $15,750,000, Dunn $15 mil, Rios $13 mil, Ramirez $9.5 mil, Keppinger $4 mil, Sale $3.5 mil, and Lindstrom's $400k buyout. I wanted Rios and Ramirez gone as bad as anyone else but the contracts are definitely not killing the White Sox. That's a total of $60, 4000,000 not including art guys and guys on cost controlled deals. A lot of financial flexibility.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 04:30 PM) Robinson. Cano. The team that gives Cano close to $300 million is going to regret it.

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 04:10 PM) A 4-5 of Dunn and Hart could generate more power than most 4-5's in baseball. If one of Garcia or Viciedo takes off were in business. The idea wasn't to knock people out of the park, the idea is to give us a competitive line up with young players playing for their future AND real MLB hitters. Our pitching is good enough to be top 5 in the AL, if our offense is competitive we can surprise teams. I would rather try 3-4 guys who may be a part of the future and be competitive then play a bunch of minor leaguers and waste our pitching. I may sign a couple guys in the offseason for the sole purpose of turning around and trading them for prospects. I don't want to "compete" next year. Trying to be decent and hoping for a break here and there is why the Sox have had 1 playoff appearance and 1 playoff win since 2005. They are not contending next year. I don't want them to finish in 3rd place in the central. If the team is not good enough to win the division then I want them to finish last. Two successive years of top 5 draft picks in each round and shrewd financial and personnel decision making can turn this team around for sustained success starting in 2015 or 2016.

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 04:04 PM) Our payroll for the 2014 season is now 61.25 million. Plus 25 million for the new TV deal. Our payroll coming into the 2013 season was 118.9 million. So we would have to tack on 57-58 million to get the same payroll as '13. That doesn't include any of the arbitration players or guys under team control. But yes, they should have a lot of money.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 04:07 PM) If the plan is to compete next year, and I'm not sure it is, I'd go with Granderson. Trade Rios or Viciedo for a 3b piece. Sign AJ and a couple relievers. Still have tons of cash to blow on another nice piece. Still not the best team, but something I can see them doing. I would bet a lot of $$ that AJ will not be back here as long as Robin Ventura is the manager. Pretty sure most people don't want AJ to return. Just give the at-bats to Phegley. Find out what you have.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 03:39 PM) Tell me about him? Well by that quote I meant picking #2 or #3. I'd obviously rather have Rodon. Gatewood is a 6'5 190 LB HS SS from Clovis HS in California. He is committed to USC. He has big power potential, has been compared to Carlos Correa, and may have to move to 3rd base in the future. I have seen him in home run derby's and bp put on huge power displays. I'd be fine with many of the college pitchers or HS bats like Gatewood or Alex Jackson. Obviously, these guys have another season to play and the draft is almost a year away. I have attached a scouting report on Gatewood. http://sbb.scout.com/2/1310090.html