[2012 White Sox Catch-All thread]

These Ozzie fights are ruining the board. Please keep it to the Marlins thread, which is ruined already.

I agree but it's hard to ignore Greg's Ozzie ignorence.

[The Pierre-Viciedo Debate]

Stay classy.

Lol...keep ignoring my questions

[2012 White Sox Catch-All thread]

Alex Rios should not be praised for finally earning his money. Give me a break. It's on him for being a piece of crap last year and the other years he sucked. Kudos to him for this year, though. Must be nice to earn the kind of money Rios earns. Critics can say a new manager brought it out of him. That pisses me off. It's ALL ON THE MILLIONAIRE RIOS, not his f***ing coaches.

Rios isn't be praised, Robin is and rightfully so. Guess what? A big part of a manager's job in any profession is to motivate his employees. Money only goes so far, especially when we're talking about a player with a $55 million guaranteed contract. The fact is a lot of major leagues get lazy and/or stop caring as much once they get that big payday. A good manager will find some way to motivate them anyways and prevent a poor effort from happening. Robin has clearly done something to get Rios going. For whatever reason, Ozzie couldn't do it.

[The Pierre-Viciedo Debate]

The idea that you would tie an apology to something as silly as a "logical explanation" for my opinion that Juan Pierre will be better than Viciedo for the remaining 2 months of the season against right-handers does not reflect well on you.

Lol...I'm not going to apologize to someone I think is purposely going out of their way to get a rise out of people. If my conditional apology hurts my Internet reputation so be it.

 

If you can counter the flaws I pointed out in your "opinion", then I'd at least know you were trying to be objective with your Juan Pierre idea. However, the fact that you continue ignoring my previous questions shows you don't have logical explanations.

[The Pierre-Viciedo Debate]

It takes a big man to offer a conditional apology.

So you have no logical explanations then? Didn't think so.

[The Pierre-Viciedo Debate]

A respectable player is going to cost a respectable return. Pierre might come cheaply which was the whole point of the idea. A cheap insurance policy.

Viciedo's OPS against RHP this year is .673. That's higher than the .621 and .642 OPSs Pierre had in the 1,000 ABs against RHP prior to this year. I want you to tell me why Pierre is doing so much better this year against RHP and why I should expect his 2nd performance against RHP (for us) to be better than what he did in 2011 & 2010. If you can provide logical reasons, I will actually apologize for my comment earlier. Otherwise, you are completely ignoring his recent trends and overlooking what should be obvious regression for him in the 2nd half.

[The Pierre-Viciedo Debate]

I think he will continue to get on base at a far greater clip than Viciedo against RH'ers for the rest of the year.

You're a f***ing joke if you're honestly suggesting Pierre over Viciedo in any capacity. Pierre put up .621 and .642 OPSs against RHP the last two years. Unless you think he's suddenly found the fountain of youth, he's going to regress significantly in the 2nd half. On the other hand, Viciedo has a decent chance to improve in the 2nd half. There is no debate here.

 

Had you chosen a respectable player for your platoon idea, people would have been more willing to listen, but most would have ultimately disagreed. However, you're clearly trolling and went with the idea that would cause the most anger on this board.

 

 

[Lilibridge to be DFA'd]

As for Hudson, I am pleasantly surprised with how he has handled his benching...not that he could argue, but he doesn't seem to be pouting. Probably happy just to have a spot on the roster of a winning team.

He's very professional about his change in roles, but hopefully he won't be on the team much longer. We really need a right-handed bat off the bench, preferably one that can play some CF. Reed Johnson would be the perfect acquisition for the role. He'd basically be in the lineup anytime De Aza or Dunn needed a rest, with Viciedo moving to the DH spot on Dunn's off-days.

 

That would leave Danks as the primary backup for Rios & Viciedo and Escobar for 3B, SS, and 2B. There wouldn't be a reason to keep Hudson around at that point.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

White Sox scouts were at the Cubs game last night looking at Sanchez and will be there again tonight to scout Johnson.

 

I hope we don't make a trade for Johnson, his velocity has been falling this year.

Josh Johnson? He's an intriguing name, although the injury concerns are scary.

 

Glad to see the Sox are exploring all options and trying to make the best deal and not just overpay for their favorite.

[Dempster to Rangers]

The only way the White Sox get Greinke is through trading from the current roster, there just isn't a headliner in the minors. Does the Brewers moving Greinke result in a full blown rebuild or do they think they can contend next year with the pieces they get back in this trade? If they think they can re-tool, then guys like Dyan Viciedo, Nate Jones, Gordon Beckham and Jose Quintana are on the block. Gavin Floyd, if healthy, could be in the mix as well as an innings eater type who could have some value in a package deal, but only if Milwaukee wants to re-tool, not rebuild.

 

If the White Sox moved Quintana, Viciedo Floyd, and a minor league is that enough or Quintana, Viciedo, Jones and one of the better prospects? I'm also assuming the White Sox don't trade for Greinke without signing him to a new deal, 4 or 5 years for $20 million per or is that too little/too much? He could replace Peavy's spot in the rotation for next year.

 

If the White Sox made a deal like this, who plays LF?

 

The rotation would be Sale, Peavy, Greinke, Humber??, and Alexrod?? Floyd is obviously part if he's here and healthy, Danks could be a factor at some point....Is that enough with basically a 3 man rotation and occasionally a good 4th/5th start? Can they move both Quintana and Floyd?

 

While Quintana may be having a great year, I do think it's smoke and mirror's, and now is the time to cash in on him. 2 of 3 starts have been bad (the Texas start was great), but another bad start, and then people start wondering if the league has figured out his magic.

You're f***ing crazy if you think they'd get Floyd, Viciedo, Quintana, and a prospect for 2 months of Greinke. That's about the same as was given up for Latos, who was under control for several seasons.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

It's funny how one loss to the Red Sox has people talking about selling and White Flag 2.0. Take a breath. Let's see how this series goes, and then maybe the series with Detroit goes before we give up.

We're 2-2 since the break and both of our losses happened late in games, yet people are acting like we haven't won in weeks. Detroit is playing well, but we are still in first place. I can't even believe someone would suggest selling at this point. There is still a ton of baseball left. I think this is going to be a great race and can't wait to see it unhold.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

Padres always pitch guys like that. For some reason, I've thought all along that local boy Gregorson would be Kenny's relief acquisition. After seeing Volquez's terrible walk numbers this year, I want nothing to do with him.

Gregerson would be a great pickup, but he's probably going to cost a ton.

 

I'd rather find a cheaper reliever and save my best trade chips for a starter.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

Probably about as dumb as the people who think Viciedo is a lock to turn into a 35-40 HR hitter and Quintana is a sub 3 ERA pitcher..

 

Clearly, you're the one who doesn't watch much baseball.

Lol...I don't think Quintana is a sub 3.00 ERA pitcher, but I do think he's cheap and can be a solid 4th/5th starter. Young, cost-controlled players is the key to long-term success and you think trading two of them for a 2 month rental is somehow a steal.

 

You obviously haven't followed Viciedo at all, so I'm not sure why I'm wasting my time here, but he could hit 30 home runs as a 23 year old in his first full major league season. To think he may reach 35 or even 40 as he gets closer to his prime is not crazy in the least. The only thing that's absurd is to think he won't get better.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

3 more lefties in this series probably means ADA won't be breaking out of his slump anytime soon. Still wish the Sox could dump Hudson for a back-up outfielder than can hit LHP. I think Reed Johnson would be an incredible fit for this team.

I agree with completely. He'd be a perfect fit for us.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

He just sat for several days last week (ASB).

I honestly think some people on this site have never watched baseball. Some guys are cold coming off the break. All players will have slumps throughout the season. We don't need to over-analyze every pitch and at-bat.

 

Outside of the injuries to the rotation, I think our biggest concern right now is Konerko. His slump is not ending and there is reason to think it's due to his hand. If that's the case, who knows when it will get better. The problem is that him batting third everyday and providing no production is really f***ing our offense up. I doubt Ventura will move him down in the order temporarily until he gets things straightened out. That's going to continue hurting us.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

Gimme a break, Viciedo is a .275 hitter who is gonna hit 25-30 homeruns, doesn't walk, doesn't hit doubles, and strikes out a lot..

 

Its crazy that people think Viciedo is some untouchable prize, yet Jared Mitchell who is having a solid season in Double A is horses*** and worthless..

 

Ide rather win now, and ide not only be up for trading Viciedo but Quintana as well.. Hell maybe you could sucker someone into taking Viciedo and Quintana as the only return for one of these top pitchers.. Wed STEAL that deal, easy

Viciedo is 23 years old and actually younger than Jared Mitchell. I like Mitchell a lot, but come on now, he's got a ways to go before he reaches Viciedo's level.

 

Also, trading five years of Viciedo for a rental is idiotic. You must not watch a lot of baseball, because power is extremely valuable nowadays. Guys that can hit 30 home runs aren't easy to come by. Trading both Viciedo and Quintana for a rental is one of the dumber suggestions I've seen on this board in my time.

[Trade Deadline Top Pitching Targets]

Have you read how bad Betances has been this year? Scouts pretty much have him pegged as a pen arm.

Oh I saw how bad his stats were in AAA. I'm just assuming if trade for Betances, then some team out there must still like and want him as part of a trade. I see no reason why we'd trading any assets for a struggling minor league starter otherwise.

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

Did you not watch his previous outting when he let a guy walk to 2nd and 3rd practically and got him home on a wild pitch.... he is also 27 and we are in a playoff chase so with Septimo no I do not have patience for a guy that can't throw strikes or get lefties out which is his only role on the team.

I don't care about him being 27 and I don't care if he's had a couple bad outings. He's a rookie pitching under intense circumstances. Give him more than a handful of outings before you write him off.

 

Would you prefer Ohman? I'll take my chances on the lefty with the plus fastball. He may not pan out, but now's the time to find out.

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

Jhan Marinez

Brian Omogrosso

Leyson Septimo

Marinez replaced Heath who replaced Bruney who replaced Stewart.

 

Septimo replaced Ohman.

 

Omogrosso replaced Crainz.

 

Seems like more change than there has really been an the only guy we're really missing right now is Crain. Ohman and Stewart weren't good.

 

The problem is that Crain is a critical part of our bullpen. We need him and Thornton for the 8th, which then puts less pressure on Jones.

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

I'm not making it off this decision... the guy isn't good. He can't throw strikes and in the bullpen that makes you useless.

He's a f***ing rookie. Maybe he's feeling a little pressure pitching in the 8th inning of a tie game at Fenway in the middle of a pennant race. I'm pissed as anyone about the HR, but rookies are going s*** the bed occasionally. He clearly has some nasty stuff when his command is on. If you can't accept the growing pains, I don't know how you ever expect to develop young talent.

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

The real question is why is a rookie who has VERY questionable control on this roster? Kenny shouldnt have let it get this far.

We've had one major injury to our bullpen and cut our worst reliever. How far has it really gotten?

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

He left a guy who is our lefty specialist in against 3 lefties and everyone is screaming bloody murder lol.... the fault isn't on Robin it's on Septimo who needs to be demoted.

Lol...he needs to be demoted? Overreact much? Also, Robin is the one to blame. Septimo told the world he didn't have it this inning by walking the first two batters. Robin should have listened and taken him out.

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

I like Septimo and was cool with bringing him out to start the 8th, but my god you don't let him face a third batter after two straight walks. It's one thing to show confidence in your players and quite another to knowingly let him fail.

[Red Sox vs White Sox]

Focus on Ortiz or this will be a 3-1 game soon.

[2012 Minor League Catch All thread]

Big Dirty's back in the 'Ham!

How has his stuff looked?

 

I know it's only been 9 innings, but he's got a 0 ERA, .44 WHIP, and 8 Ks across four levels. It's shocking to see a guy just converted to a pitcher move so damn fast.