Chicago White Sox

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 12:11 PM) Let me be clear: I'm not rationalizing away the decisions that were made or excusing accountability. I think this organization was presented with a very bad set of choices this season and that it made some poor decisions when presented with those choices. However, the greatest impact on the season seems to be the 4-18 stretch that put us 11 games out and in last place, perpetually crawling back at a snail's pace. How much of Ozzie and Kenny was that stretch? In my mind it was the bullpen problems for most games, a little Pierre and a little Dunn and Rios. There's never just one cause for not making the playoffs, so there's no reason to try and pick just one. I agree that the players are the most responsible for us being down six games, but that doesn't mean we couldn't have a better record right now had Ozzie and KW done their jobs better. The fact is that Ozzie could have managed the lineup better and KW could have managed our roster (during the season) better Their poor decisions have cost us games in addition to certain players underperforming or having terrible stretches. Everyone, the players, the coaches, and the front office should be held accountable for the area they control. There is no reason to try and just pin it one one group.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Aug 29, 2011 -> 11:44 AM) Again, we had options this year to lessen the blow (i.e., start batting Dunn lower in the lineup, bring up De Aza & Viciedo, etc.) Exactly. There is no excuse for Dunn batting 4th once it could be dermined that something was significantly wrong with him. I don't blame Ozzie for giving the guy an extended opportunity to come out of his slump, but at some point he should have moved him down the lineup. Him batting 4th, given other offensive struggles, totally killed our lineup. That's 100% on Ozzie and it could very well cost us the division in the end. Additionally, there's no excuse whatsoever for not calling Viciedo up earlier this season. Our offense has been struggling all year and he would have most likely been our third best hitter on arrival. Again, you had to give Dunn an opportunity to bounce back, but by the all-star break is was clear he most likely was unfixable this year. Viciedo could have slid in DH most of time and spelled Quentin/Pierre once or twice a week. This is 100% on KW. He's in charge of the roster and should have forced Guillen's hand. If we lose this division by a game or two, Viciedo over Dunn from July forward probably would have made up that difference.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 21, 2011 -> 06:27 PM) I find that almost impossible to believe...you're saying the State of Illinois (or whomever the entity is that we lease US Cellular from, will actually compensate the White Sox at the average ticket price for every ticket less than 2 million that they do not sell? No way...maybe that would trigger a clause which would allow them to terminate their lease early...but compensate them? No way... I'm sure it's just a reduction in rent. If we draw less than 2 million fans, we just pay the state less money.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 20, 2011 -> 10:15 AM) Maybe I'm just in an uncomfortable position because I've heard too much "personal" stuff about Hahn from his former Harvard Law classmates for me to ever have a positive opinion about him. Maybe he's changed as a person since he was 22-25. I sincerely hope so. First off, how many of his former Harvard Law classmates could you possibly know. Second, why in god's name would you judge someone for their actions when they were 22 - 25. Short of rape or murder, I think it's absolutely insane to hold someone's behavior when they were young against them years after the fact.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Aug 20, 2011 -> 09:42 AM) Who negotiated Dunn's contract, the richest, longest DH contract of all time, Kenny or Hahn? I don't get why people keep bringing up free agent contracts as a sign of his negotiating abilities. 90% of free agents go to the place offering the most money. Unless you pay well over what the next offer is, like the Rangers did with A-Rod or the Cubs did with Soriano, the price you get a free agent for has little do with negotiations (at least from the team's perspective) but rather what the market bears. If you want to judge him, I'd look more at extensions, arbitration matters, and draft pick signings. Those are the areas where I see his negotiating skills coming into play. Eventually as a GM, his ability to negotiate with other GMs would be critical, but I doubt he's had much exposure to that in his current role.

Unless you know the guy, I think it's wrong to question his hunger and heart. Hahn is a guy who spent 10 years trying to get into a baseball front office. With his credentials, I'm sure he passed up on a lot of money to do so. I would never doubt his hunger...the guy definitely wants to a GM and has worked his ass off to be in a position to become one. As for his heart, who really knows. I'm sure he's somewhat excited about the Cubs opening, but at the same time Reinsdorf is the man that first gave him a chance and by all accounts is one of the best owners to work for in sports. He'd probably have better job security working for Reinsdorf than he would for Ricketts. And I'm sure Hahn has some loyalty for Reinsdorf despite growing up a Cubs fan. That's not to say that the Cubs position isn't his dream job, none of us really know, but I honestly he'd feel somewhat guilty going to his current team's market rival. If you want to question his lack of scouting experience that's more than fair, but by all accounts Hahn is a smart, driven, loyal, and good-hearted person. His character is definitely not an issue.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 19, 2011 -> 01:37 PM) I really want to see Reinsdorf do what he did with the Bulls, when he moved Pax up and Forman became GM. Especially since Pax and Kenny are so similar, as are Hahn and Forman. How so? Forman has a scouting background with college coaching experience. Sounds nothing like Hahn to me.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 19, 2011 -> 05:46 PM) When you have guys on the dl it gives you maneuvers around that rule. I thought the rule allows the 25 man roster as of August 31st + Humber to be playoff eligible. Is that not the case?

Seems to me that I'd call up the minor leaguer with the best chance of helping in the playoffs since he'll be playoff eligible if he stays on the roster through the end of August. Josh Kinney is definitely not that guy. My guess is he won't be on the roster come August 31st. Hopefully Viciedo can get healthy soon, because this would be a great way to make him playoff eligible and allow us a little more roster flexibility come playoff time.

Every great GM has started off as an unknown quantity, just with different backgrounds and levels of experience. Hahn may not have a scouting or player development background, but he's got 11 years experience in a major league front office. Furthermore, he's incredibly intelligent with graduate degrees from both Harvard Law and Kellogg. He's got the business background that's becoming more common with new GM hires, and let's be honest, those guys have been doing a tremendous job so far. On top of that, he's a tremendous negotiator, which is a great skill to have in the current baseball environment. Beyond his resume, he's been rated as a top two GM candidate by Baseball America two years in a row. Those rankings are based on feedback from executives around the league. Plus he's been asked to interview for several GM openings in the past few years. I can't recall which positions, maybe the Pirates and Mets, but I do know the guy has turned some interviews down. So not only do other organizations value him, he must think pretty highly of himself to pass on available opportunities when there are only 30 positions in total. There's obviously a lot of risk in hiring Hahn, but not any more than hiring any other rookie GM candidate. Surround him with the right baseball people and I think he could build a quality organization. Unfortunately for us, we might have to make a decision on him this off-season, since I have a feeling the Cubs will be calling and that's one of the few jobs he's probably holding out for. So if we do make the playoffs, JR may have to make a tough decision between Hahn and KW. It's never easy going with an unknown quantity at the GM position while trying to compete, but other organizations have done so recently and successfully. If Reinsdorf thinks as highly of Hahn as those around the league do, then he very well could knock KW out of the GM position in the off-season even if we make the playoffs this year.

I don't care if we make the playoffs or not, there has to be changes at the end of the year. Ozzie and KW can simply not co-exist long-term. There is just too much bad blood and philosophical differences between the two. At least one of them has to go. IMO, Ozzie has warn out his welcome here with his constant drama and has done a below average job managing the team the last few years. If he stays, he'd have an even stronger stranglehold on the organization and that's really scary. If do we get rid of KW, then the new GM should be able to pick his own guy. I'm actually starting to like the idea of Hahn as GM. He's incredibly intelligent and it seems like the game is starting to value that more than previous baseball experience. Guys like Friedman and Epstein are proof of that. He seems like a pretty popular name around the league and my guess is if we don't offer him the job, he'll be the next GM of the Cubs. I think you got to make a long-term decision on KW this offseason and if he's the not the guy, offer Hahn the job and maybe KW a John Paxson type position, although I'm not sure he'll go for that. Regardless, do not force a manger on our GM. If KW, Hahn or whomever wants Larussa, then so be it, but I don't want any more power struggles and lack of accountability.

Side Show Bob / Cape Fear episode.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jul 30, 2011 -> 07:53 AM) Well, maybe it's more feasible than would appear at first glance. Remember, McLouth will be a free agent at the end of the season, and the Braves would have to spend almost as much in exercising the 2012 option for $10.65 Million, as the $12 million owed Rios next year. In the meantime, the Braves would have their defensive replacement for McClouth while he's on the DL. When he comes back they could platoon him with Rios. Next year, their outfield could be pretty good with Heyward, Rios and Quentin. With the offensive production from the corners, they could get buy with Rios is CF. Hey, if they want Quentin, make them pay. Take Rios' contract and give us one really good pitching prospect. Otherwise, go ahead and pursue Coco Crisp. I don't see how that would make the Braves competitive in the N. L East, do you? Quentin is an impact bat, and that is what they need. I respectfully disagree with the comparisons to Hunter Pence in this thread. Hunter Pence is no Carlos Quentin. When TCQ is healthy, he is a 40 HR hitter and a big run producer. I will tell you right now, no team will want Carlos Quentin if they have to take Rios. That's just not happening, unless we eat 50% or more of his contract. Even then, we'd get no prospects back. So your idea is simply not logical. At this point, we have to accept the fact that we're stuck with Rios for another year unless Jerry is willing to eat a lot of money. Maybe De Aza taking playing time from him the rest of the way will motivate him to get his s*** together next year. If Guillen leaves for Florida in the offseason, maybe a new manager lights a fire under his ass. Regardless, Rios still posesses the physical talent to be a quality CF. We just need to hope for a solid 2012 from him, so we can move him quickly while eating as little money as possible. The goal here is to get rid of this lazy coward in a way that minimizes the damage to the organization.

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jul 29, 2011 -> 03:57 PM) They are looking for young, cost controlled players, not guys who are old (Thor) or close to FA (Quentin). And they'd get plenty of cost controlled players when then spun these three guys off prior to the deadline or during the offseason.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 28, 2011 -> 11:07 PM) BS. He can still trade Quentin and Thornton and Danks and Floyd in the offseason. And get much smaller returns, especially for Quentin. I honestly believe we can trade him and Thornton right now and still compete. If we trade a starter, we are definitely conceeding.

QUOTE (Real @ Jul 28, 2011 -> 12:33 PM) Forgive me for thinking Kenny screws this up and we end up with marginal talent I just don't see that happening. Quentin is one of the best hitters on the market at position that several contenders need. We are still technically in the playoff hunt ourselves and cutting salary in the Jackson/Teahen allows us to afford him the rest of the way if we choose. Teams will really have to entice us to move him. I think there will be less BS offers too, which will allow KW to really gauge Quentin's value. Therefore, if he decides to move him, I think we'll get a very nice return. The question will come down to which package he should accept. I just don't see how you can pass up on a Brown-centered deal. He and Viciedo would look great in LF and RF for the next six years. Having said that, I'd be happy to take some young pitching prospects from the Braves, although that's got a higher chance of busting.

For some reason, I think there's a decent chance a Quentin/Brown deal gets done. I'm sure other pieces would have to be involved, but the Sox are in a great spot with Quentin. Remember, any team that trades for him will likely get type A/B after the 2012 season, so those picks need to be factored into his price.

QUOTE (Paulie4Pres @ Jul 25, 2011 -> 10:42 PM) Why would you get rid of Quentin, even if you ARE rebuilding? I don't understand the logic. He's 28. He is one of the best hitters the Sox have. He seems to have bounced back pretty well from the injury issues. Trade away a known commodity, for unknown prospects that may or may not be as good as the guy they are trading away? Sounds pretty stupid to me. See what he's looking for as far as salary when the season is over, and go from there. At the very least, you bring up DV and see what he can do before trading away one of the very few power hitters the Sox have. If the salary he is going to command is an issue, get Rios the f*** out of here first and foremost. Trading CQ away will be just one more position the Sox need to fill next season. I just don't get it. OMG, for the last f***ing time we can't get rid of Rios right now. Why in god's name would any team want him at the moment? He sucks and makes a s***load of money! Plain and simple, we're stuck with him for the foreseeable future. Please no more "let's dump Rios" proposals, because he'd already be long gone if we could move him.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 23, 2011 -> 05:31 PM) Jackson is a little over two months away from free agency. And he's league-average to begin with. Nobody is raping their farm for him. Except for the fact that pitching always costs a ton at the deadline and be may be the best pitcher on the market. I don't care if he's a league average pither, this is a supply and demand issue, and that's what will dictate his price. The fact that whoever trades for him also gets a supplemental pick will only help our cause. We should be able to get something of value for him. Not Hudson/Holmberg valuable, but perhaps a nice prospect that could help us in a year or two. Why do you think otherwise?

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 08:52 AM) Who has the minor league contacts to know when a player is coming up? I heard a rumor that this may actually be happening. Any idea on the corresponding roster move if this happens?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 22, 2011 -> 11:48 AM) Kenny is in a holding pattern on the off chance they win their next 6. You really want us to sell huh?

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 21, 2011 -> 09:05 AM) So did D Lee last season for the exact same reasons(family). Then an actual playoff team came calling and magically D Lee left town. If the deal is right, ARam will agree to it. He doesnt want to go to Anaheim only to watch the Rangers run away with it Yeah, this is exactly right IMO.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 21, 2011 -> 08:19 AM) He's already repeatedly been reported to be uninterested in being traded. Weren't the same things said about Derek Lee? Sometimes when an actual trade is agreed upon, a player will change his tune about not wanting to leave. If I had to guess, Ramirez would be willing to play for us, because he wouldn't have to move his family until he found a long-term home in the off-season. Plus it would give him a chance to win and possibly improve his value in free agency. Obviously some guys are stubborn, but there are too many reasons not to accept a trade to us in this case.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 21, 2011 -> 07:25 AM) Do you really want to pay Aramis Ramirez $16 million next season? No thanks. Of course not, but I think he'd be willing to waive the option to come across town. Otherwise, I don't make the deal.

If we're throwing random ideas, why not the following moves: Quentin to Braves for Beachy Jackson to highest bidder for prospects, those prospects to Cubs for Ramirez Viciedo called up, Morel sent down New team: LF Pierre SS Ramirez 1B Konerko 3B Ramirez RF Viciedo C Pierzynski 2B Beckham DH Dunn CF Rios IF Vizquel OF Lillibridge UT Teahen C Flowers #1 Buerhle #2 Humber #3 Danks #4 Floyd #5 Beachy/Peavy CL Santos SU Thornton SU Crain RP Sale RP Peavy/Beachy RP Ohman RP Bruney Better offense and better bullpen. Rotation may or may not be better, but that's cause you're going from a six man to a five man rotation. Overall, I think these moves make us better this year and give another young starter to build around in the future.