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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 02:48 PM) It depends. Money changes the way you operate. Andrew Friedman seems to be a different type of deal maker with the Dodgers than he was with the Rays. He can throw money everywhere and if it doesn't work out, no big deal. I think the biggest advantage with money vs. small market is not necessarily being able to sign the $200 million guys. IMO, it is the ability to hang on to your guys. The teams in perpetual rebuilding develop guys, then they get good so they can't pay them, so they are traded and they have to start the cycle again. That's why I don't understand the people complaining about it being 7 years since the Sox were last in the playoffs, so trade Chris Sale. That suggests waiting another 7. One thing you're missing, IMO, is that he can take on bad contracts in lieu of giving up talent as well. As far as the Sox and Sale, I think they'll probably have to deal some of their major league ready pitching if they truly want to be able to compete next year, but I have a hard time believing there's a Sale deal out there that remotely makes sense.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 02:52 PM) According to the last Business of Baseball by Forbes, the White Sox were 20th in MLB in total revenues. 20th is also where the White Sox finished in overall record this year. 1 team that finished behind them in total revenue made the playoffs this year. 9 of the 19 teams in front of them made it. 5 of the top 10 teams in total revenue from the 2015 list made the playoffs. I believe there is more to a business than just revenue. But, even ignoring all of that, the White Sox seem to have no problem putting up a very competitive payroll. It shouldn't be surprising that teams who win more generate more revenue?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 02:35 PM) To me it is common sense that the more resources a team has means the more chances it has to be successful and to be able to spend over its mistakes. I wouldn't call that irrational at all. We see it all over baseball in the 21st century. If wanting more resources for the team is irrational, I am OK with being irrational. You ignored the rest of my post, but that's ok. I don't disagree that more money is a good thing. I just realize they already have more than enough to be a good franchise.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 01:33 PM) I have never said anything remotely close to this. Not once. I think too many people are taking the idea that our fans aren't loyal, personally. For me, the numbers are there. The truth is there. I suppose I paraphrased a bit too much with that statement, but you have to have hundreds of posts on here about how more fans = more money = more wins. Like this post here: QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 09:18 AM) The Cubs drew 2.6 million in 2013 and 2014. 2014 attendance was up over the previous year. The White Sox have drawn that much twice in the last twenty years. They drew ONE MILLION MORE FANS then we did in 2014, in their sixth straight year of under .500 baseball. We even had a year in 2012 where we were in first place until the last two weeks of the season, and still got out drawn by 900,000 fans by a Cubs team that went 61-101. Again, that gives them options that the White Sox don't have. And that is my point exactly when talking about "plans". The Royals fan base was decimated, and because of that it took them WAY longer than a team like the Cubs who has a fan base that still shows up. Our fan base is much closer to the Royals in terms of being willing to see out a "plan". That is my point exactly, and I am glad you finally get it. While in general more money is never a bad thing, you conveniently leave out the fact that the White Sox payroll is squarely in the middle of the pack ( If you want to direct your irrational anger towards the fans instead of Ventura, KW, RH or any of the people actually partially responsible for why we are bad, that's your prerogative.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 01:10 PM) It is unrealistic to want the owner to sell and everyone in the organization fired. I also will never understand the need to have the team win something before baseball is worth watching. It is like some deep seeded insecurity that needs filling with something artificial like sports. Honestly, their rationale isn't hard to comprehend. Losing feels bad. People don't like feeling bad. So, people do something else with their time. Maybe they deserve to be called out on it as often as you call them out on it, but this idea you have that our bad fans are the only reason we suck right now is hilarious to me.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 09:18 AM) The Cubs drew 2.6 million in 2013 and 2014. 2014 attendance was up over the previous year. The White Sox have drawn that much twice in the last twenty years. They drew ONE MILLION MORE FANS then we did in 2014, in their sixth straight year of under .500 baseball. We even had a year in 2012 where we were in first place until the last two weeks of the season, and still got out drawn by 900,000 fans by a Cubs team that went 61-101. Again, that gives them options that the White Sox don't have. And that is my point exactly when talking about "plans". The Royals fan base was decimated, and because of that it took them WAY longer than a team like the Cubs who has a fan base that still shows up. Our fan base is much closer to the Royals in terms of being willing to see out a "plan". That is my point exactly, and I am glad you finally get it. The SS2K5 rebuilding plan: Step 1: get better fans Step 2: ??? Step 3: win more baseball games

QUOTE (dasox24 @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 08:09 PM) Last year I was touting Illinois to fire Beckman and go after Justin Fuente from Memphis. Well, that ship has sailed. Fuente is going to be in very high demand. Illinois should go after Dino Babers. He gets the Midwest culture and recruiting. He's an Art Briles disciple, but he has adapted his offense at Bowling Green to be more cold-weather friendly (for example: Bowling Green goes under center in some formations whereas Baylor is pretty much shotgun formation all of the time). From what I heard, Fuente wasn't interested in the Illinois job last year.

I still wonder what we could have gotten for Shark back then and if it would be better than a comp pick. There were some deals rumored to be in place, but I don't remember anything coming out about them.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Sep 2, 2015 -> 11:11 AM) "Blackhawks were suffering of weak team spirit" Ha, it seemed like a completely normal thing to say until you pointed it out.

The problem I have with using ERA as a measuring stick of "what actually happened" is that it's already trying to correct out all the runs given up as a result of errors. If you're going to try to adjust numbers to get a better idea of how a pitcher performed, why not just use the better metric in FIP?

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Sep 2, 2015 -> 10:51 AM) That translation is pretty awesome. I assumed the windmills part was a Don Quixote reference, but I'm not sure even that makes sense in the context of what he was saying.

Gotta think the AD will be brushing up his resume pretty soon.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Aug 22, 2015 -> 01:37 AM) Sometime I roll my eyes when reading assessments like this . It's just such an easy thing to say. Montas has come a long way from where he was when the Sox acquired him. The right thing to do is build his arm strength and if he follows the same developmental curve he's been on there are good things ahead . Trading him at this point would be foolish because return would be minimal. If he develops more he's a huge asset. Imagine Rodon, Fulmer , Montas , Eric Johnson , Sale , Quintana all being good and the leverage the Sox would have. 1 more year with all of them and see where they are. Failed starters can always be turned into relievers so lets keep them all starting. Montas is the most obvious trade candidate in the system. His loud tools make him a sexy prospect, and it's dubious if he'll be able to continue starting down the road. But, right now you can sell him as being a starter with a big fastball.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Aug 21, 2015 -> 08:16 PM) That's the thing, it won't be easy for him to maximize total dollars with the plethora of pitching available combined with the season he's had and will be 31. In a sense he has already screwed himself by rejecting the cubs offer and going for FA all the while s***ting the bed in his last year before FA. I guess what I'm saying is, his value is already in the process of being destroyed. The best hope he has at maximizing his value is to take the QO and hope like hell he can rebound and hit paydirt after the 2016 season. That said, I really hope he rejects the QO and is able to sign elsewhere. I cannot wait to be done with Samardzija. This I can agree with. However, even if he could only get something like 4/50, that to me would be worth more than a QO. Of course, he's been expecting a big payday, so who knows what's going through his mind.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Aug 21, 2015 -> 05:06 PM) With so many quality FA pitchers available, Samardzija just might need to take the QO in an effort to rebuild his value to get the big contract he seeks. Right now, he's not even worth the 5/90M he rejected from the cubs. He's still a >2 WAR pitcher. He still has value even if it's not worth what he thinks it is. He could just as easily destroy his value next year by sucking as he could rebuild it by rebounding a bit. For a guy who will turn 31 next year, it would be crazy not to take the maximum total dollars he can get this off season IMO.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 21, 2015 -> 03:52 PM) My guess is he takes the one year QO, unless he goes on a hella run the last two months. Even if it's lower AAV, I can't imagine a guy in his 30's wouldn't take the guaranteed money he would get with a multi year contract.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 20, 2015 -> 04:50 PM) Colleen Kane ‏@ChiTribKane 59s59 seconds ago White Sox's Ken Williams: "The only thing in my future is a 9:05 p.m. game against the Angels." http://fw.to/4eLknmB He gone.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Aug 18, 2015 -> 05:05 PM) They're a bubble team, outside looking in. Same as the last 2 seasons. Look at the teams above them: Maryland, Indiana, MSU, Purdue, Michigan, Wisconsin, OSU. Maybe even Iowa. Then Illinois/NW/Minn. Not having Abrams sucks. Not having Paul sucks. You're asking a team to be better without Rice and Egwu. Hill has to make an impressive jump and put the team on his back. Nunn can't take 10 games off at a time like he did last year. Tate has to be able to shoot at least a little. Thorne has to be better than average. Black has to make a sophmore leap. And yeah, you gotta hope JCL isn't out for a long time and that he can contribute. Too many ifs. They'll win 20 games, go .500 in the Big Ten and be in the NIT. That's my guess. I think Hill can fill Rice's shoes, and while we won't be able to replace Egwu defensively, if we could have an average player on both ends of the floor, the added offense should be enough to balance out the lost defense. Also, without looking at the schedule too closely, going .500 in this Big Ten should be a tournament team. That being said, I'm sure they'll find a way to be a s***ty disappointing team, even with their low expectations.

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Aug 18, 2015 -> 03:58 PM) I've got this feeling that the Illini are going to suck this year, like end .500 overall bad. But then again I had a feeling last year that we were a sweet 16 team so hopefully it just goes to the inverse. PG is still a black hole and front court depth is lacking, but they have good talent at the wings with Nunn, Hill, and Coleman-Lands. If Thorne can be a solid starter and they can get Black to stop playing dirty, they should definitely be good enough to get into the tournament IMO. Should be interesting to see what they can do with front court players who can do something offensively at least.

Looks like Darius Paul was suspended again. Got sent home early from the Europe trip.

QUOTE (LDF @ Aug 11, 2015 -> 02:43 PM) why, it is a healthy debate. at least for me. It was a bad joke about how often outrage based words were being used in the last few posts.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 11, 2015 -> 02:33 PM) Because you aren't passing judgement or anything... Outrage at outrage, is still outrage. And yes, I think if we as a society have gotten to the point where a sports teams standing is more important than a rape case, we should all be outraged. If you feel the need to judge me for that, please do. I am perfectly comfortable with that as well. This thread has gotten outrageous.

QUOTE (bmags @ Aug 10, 2015 -> 04:25 PM) Since we have nothing else to talk about, anyone want to explain what the spreads on baseball mean? Does that mean you are betting sox win by 2 runs or more, or angels at 1 run or win? Not a huge gambler myself, but I believe that means you need to bet $131 to win $100 (as opposed to +131 which would mean you'd have to bet $100 to win $131).

Maybe we should wait for like any facts to come out before we start making any sort of judgement based on what could be...

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Aug 2, 2015 -> 05:40 PM) But if you stop and think, the question isn't "Should we re-sign Samardzija?", it's "At what price would the White Sox sign Jeff Samardzija?" as well as "Is there a chance he'll be on the market for that value?" So you start by looking at the usual suspects. Yankees, Red Sox are likely to aim higher. So are the Cubs. Angels maybe? Do they think Jeff Samardzija is worth that kind of money? Probably not. As an approximation, teams are roughly paying $6 million per WAR on the open market. Since Shark is about a 3 WAR player, his market value should be something like $18 million per year. Whether or not he actually gets this market value is obviously open to interpretation, but even getting him at a discount might not actually be that cheap. This is also not mentioning the fact that nothing he has done up to this point indicates he is interested in taking any sort of discount. Then, when you add in the fact that the Sox have Erik Johnson ready for another shot and a guy like Carson Fulmer potentially not too far off, it makes even less sense. Considering how much we need offense, how little we need pitching, and how much he's worth on the open market, I'm not sure there's a realistic scenario in which I would actually be in favor of the Sox signing Shark. Edit: removed picture