Thad Bosley

A potential argument against bringing AJ back on a deal that looked and felt like it was only good for 2014, is that it might take away a little bit from the farewell spotlight for Paulie, which will pick up more and more as we get closer to the end of the season.

QUOTE (TheTruth05 @ Jul 9, 2014 -> 01:45 PM) and retire a sox and immediately come be a team ambassador or whatever he wants to be. Like, maybe, Steve Stone's replacement, whose contract is up at the end of this year, if I'm not mistaken?

Belly flop

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 23, 2014 -> 09:07 PM) When De Aza is your defensive replacement you must suck bad. It does sound like an oxymoron

Great at-bat for Jose as he laid off three of four of those little sliders off the plate. He seemed to recognize them nicely. As Hawk and Stone keep saying, watch out if he learns to lay off those consistently.

A guilty pleasure of White Sox baseball is watching Gordon and Alexi turning two.

God, I love Adam Eaton!

I'm really enjoying watching Conor at the plate this year, but boy, he is just not that good out in the field.

Not the worst start in the world for Noesi. He's given his team a chance to win.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:26 PM) Looks like Sox are done scoring tonight. That may have been true last year, but there is still one more Abreu at bat lurking in this game.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:22 PM) What's the betting we get a pop-up on the first pitch after that at-bat One million dollars?

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:10 PM) Sometimes what look like really nice catches are the result of poor positioning and range not quite being poor enough for the ball to fall Agreed, but that ball was a line drive that got out there in a hurry and was sinking, and he got there and went down and got it. As for positioning on the play, neither of us would have a way of knowing whether he was positioned properly or not on that play.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:06 PM) Viciedo's average down to .243 and OPS is at .683. Hard to imagine he's back next year if he doesn't turn things around. He's a power hitter that doesn't hit a lot of homers and a guy with a great arm that can't catch the ball. He just caught that ball rather nicely.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:03 PM) Hawk may be shocked Alexi may not make all star team. Make that last place team look good Sox, Stone would be shocked, too.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 07:05 PM) Didn't we have a great year defensively during his first year as manager? We sure did.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 04:06 PM) I've got to dispute this. Winning mid-80's numbers of games and missing the psotseason is still a competitive team to me. And I should throw in, I'm not quite sure the 2012 team was "Designed to compete" and yet somehow they pulled it off. We have won mid-80s games and been competitive quite often in the past two decades, but being "competitive" is not enough. You gotta get into those playoffs - it's as simple as that. That's when you really generate interest. Nobody remembers any of the number of 2nd place White Sox teams of the past couple of decades, who were good teams but have nothing to show for it. You obviously can't go to the postseason every year, but a big market team like the Sox should be able to go on a run where they dominate over a three, four, five year period, especially in a division such as ours. And yet they just haven't managed to do so. Hence, attendance problem discussions!

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 03:48 PM) The season ticket base won't grow when a veteran team designed to compete loses 99 games. That's what happened in 2013. Let's. NOT. f***ing. forget. that. And it won't grow when the team goes younger the next offseason. No matter how positive the moves are. And let's not forget the stubhub effect. The benefits of an ST plan are not always good enough for a value shopper on stubhub. I've talked to people that decided against an ST plan(even 7 game plans) because of the cost and commitment to make sure all games are used/sold. And when i say "what about playoff tix?", the respond that they're ok with going on the secondary considering that they saved money earlier in the year not being tied down to a package. Oh, I won't f'ing forget about 2013, bro. I'd like to, but I won't. And you are absolutely, positively correct - last year's team was "designed to compete", but they didn't. Didn't even come close. Every one of KW's eleven teams were designed to compete as well. Only two did. Only two made it to the postseason. That's two in twelve years - not quite enough to energize a fan base and entice them to come out to the ballpark more often.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 02:59 PM) Of course they are not happy about that. But the business side of the sox is set up to withstand attendance decline. It's well documented that the sox are ran more like a sustainable business than a rich man's plaything. All one has to do is look at the quick turnaround this 2014 squad has made vs last year's debacle. Rick and Kenny aren't swimming in a sea of bad debt and horrible contracts like some "geniuses" up north. And they were able to make payroll room for guys like Abreu and make a bid for Tanaka because they were proactive and worked in the boundaries of their budget. I said this before, but the only people that should care about sox attendance are the Sox ticket sales staff. Well, you may choose to not care about attendance, but for those of us who attend the games and/or watch them on TV, seeing the team you love playing in an empty ballpark is downright depressing. Is it not a different experience for you when the park is packed vs. the ghost yard experience we're typically treated to? And as far as payroll goes, we'd be able to cover an even larger payroll if we had more ticket and concession revenue coming in. You do bring up one interesting point, though - the "rich man's plaything". Maybe that approach should be adopted. Could be fun, ya know, and it certainly couldn't render any worse results than the so-called "sustainable business" model you claim they're employing. Go "rich man's plaything", I say! Get wild! Shake this thing up a little bit, and who knows? WE MIGHT START WINNING MORE!!

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:35 AM) If it is only about "winning" why do teams with MUCH worse recent histories consistently out-draw the White Sox? Milwaukee? Colorado? San Diego? The Nats? It doesn't add up. Fair point, SS2K. Fair point. I get where you are coming from, and quite frankly, I can't answer that question, but it's a good one. But let me see to come at my point from a different angle to see if it makes more sense that way. If the Sox could add, say, 10-12K more season ticket holders, then all of a sudden - boom! No more attendance problem! We'd be averaging in the low to mid 30K range in attendance, which would be fine. How do you get those extra season ticket holders? Green seats and Mullet Night aren't getting it done. But if the Sox, say, went on a run the next five years where in three of those years they went deep into the playoffs and it was very exciting and the whole city was watching, I say they generate a new level of interest in the team that would easily translate into new ticket holders over the course of those five years. But to do so you gotta win. Win, win, win - and do so consistently. And if I'm wrong, then what you've been saying all along about the fan base would absolutely be true. But I'd like to try out this winning consistently idea before I have to agree with that conclusion.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 06:42 AM) Eh, I'd buy it if history didn't tell me otherwise. Even years when they have met the winning criteria, the other complaints problems pop up, such as weather, school, cost, location, transportation, who they don't like, white flag, seat color, seat location, angle of the upper deck, parking cost, the cost of beer, the cost of food, too far away from the park. The two observations I have left on this topic are -I think a lot of Sox fans were fooled by the 05/06 attendance #'s into thinking there were a lot of new fans at the ballpark. I don't think there were. I think they were fans of winning, and not the team. I think you have seen a mix of the #'s settling into the historical norms, which is why you still have seen down years, even when the team has won. Whether it was company's snapping up desirable tickets to give out, ticket-brokers, scalpers, whatever, I think a huge chunk of that number wasn't Sox fans, but opportunistic buyers. -The decibel level at which a person voices complaints about the teams attendance is usually directly related to how far away from the ballpark they live. I'm not quite sure why that is, but it sure seems to be true. The closer people live, the less they complain about it. You rarely see these things coming from someone in the city or suburbs of Chicago. "Decibel level"? Oh, for heaven's sake. Stop with that. Whether I'm voicing my opinion from the ChiSox Bar and Grill (which I was at a couple of weeks ago when I was in town prior to watching Sale's outstanding start against the Padres) or from the moon is irrelevant to the discussion. As a former season ticket holder in Comiskey Parks Old and New and who still makes it to 2-3 games a year when I'm in town, I am more than qualified to speak on this subject. Fact remains the Sox have an attendance problem. It's because they don't have enough season ticket holders. They don't have enough season ticket holders because they don't win enough and get into the playoffs enough to generate the kind of interest it takes for people to justify spending money on season tickets. The Sox haven't gotten into the playoffs enough times because White Sox management simply hasn't put together teams that have managed to get the job done. I'm not saying they haven't tried, but the record of performance is what it is over the past few decades, which is not very good. And from an accountability perspective, that's not the fan's fault. That's on Sox management, and ultimately, the buck stops on Mr. Reinsdorf's desk.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 08:02 PM) Almost as insightful as it being the owners fault that Sox fans can't be bothered to go to games for pretty much any reason except the World Series. Not insightful as much as common sense. If you fail over and over and over again to field a team that can crack the postseason in a meaningful way, then one shouldn't be surprised when fans can't be bothered to go to games. That's the way I look at it, and why I place the accountability of the chronic attendance problem primarily on ownership. You see it differently, which I respect, but it stand firmly in this point of view.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 05:53 PM) 4/12 was a close to packed house, yet was 29k in the box score. 4/26 had a small paid number, but A lot of people came in and out for the free minoso statues. These things happen , Debbie downer. Get off your f***ing high horse and quit your b****ing, out of state fan Close to a packed house on 4/12, and last year the Sox outdrew the 1970 Sox. You do make a compelling argument for why the Sox' attendance issues aren't as bad as they seem. Thanks for your insights!

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 08:39 AM) I just noticed you're in NYC. Do you ever come to Staten Island Yankees games? You should come one night and argue with me about attendance Ha! I've reached my quota in terms of talking about poor attendance. I simply cannot take on another team's problems. But I'll join you anytime for a game out there, and at least help the S.I. Yanks with their attendance issues!

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 04:07 AM) Also of note: The sox gave out a TON of tickets this year. Two surveys in the offseason, plus the kids club having four free tix handed put per member, AND they gave out April tix on fan appreciation day last year. Comps do not count in the attendance rolls, so the sox' goodwill gesture is not as obvious. If you're telling us that these tiny crowds we see at the ballpark everyday include a whole bunch of freebies, then the problem is worse than I thought.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 08:15 PM) It is more of a statement on the fans than anything else. We play in a town where the other team never wins, yet is always way ahead of us in attendance, so it isn't just WINNING. We have a bandwagon fan base that is better at making excuses than actually showing up. A bandwagon fan base that has only seen said bandwagon five times in the first 33 years of the current ownership's reign.