Thad Bosley

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 06:42 AM) Eh, I'd buy it if history didn't tell me otherwise. Even years when they have met the winning criteria, the other complaints problems pop up, such as weather, school, cost, location, transportation, who they don't like, white flag, seat color, seat location, angle of the upper deck, parking cost, the cost of beer, the cost of food, too far away from the park. The two observations I have left on this topic are -I think a lot of Sox fans were fooled by the 05/06 attendance #'s into thinking there were a lot of new fans at the ballpark. I don't think there were. I think they were fans of winning, and not the team. I think you have seen a mix of the #'s settling into the historical norms, which is why you still have seen down years, even when the team has won. Whether it was company's snapping up desirable tickets to give out, ticket-brokers, scalpers, whatever, I think a huge chunk of that number wasn't Sox fans, but opportunistic buyers. -The decibel level at which a person voices complaints about the teams attendance is usually directly related to how far away from the ballpark they live. I'm not quite sure why that is, but it sure seems to be true. The closer people live, the less they complain about it. You rarely see these things coming from someone in the city or suburbs of Chicago. "Decibel level"? Oh, for heaven's sake. Stop with that. Whether I'm voicing my opinion from the ChiSox Bar and Grill (which I was at a couple of weeks ago when I was in town prior to watching Sale's outstanding start against the Padres) or from the moon is irrelevant to the discussion. As a former season ticket holder in Comiskey Parks Old and New and who still makes it to 2-3 games a year when I'm in town, I am more than qualified to speak on this subject. Fact remains the Sox have an attendance problem. It's because they don't have enough season ticket holders. They don't have enough season ticket holders because they don't win enough and get into the playoffs enough to generate the kind of interest it takes for people to justify spending money on season tickets. The Sox haven't gotten into the playoffs enough times because White Sox management simply hasn't put together teams that have managed to get the job done. I'm not saying they haven't tried, but the record of performance is what it is over the past few decades, which is not very good. And from an accountability perspective, that's not the fan's fault. That's on Sox management, and ultimately, the buck stops on Mr. Reinsdorf's desk.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 08:02 PM) Almost as insightful as it being the owners fault that Sox fans can't be bothered to go to games for pretty much any reason except the World Series. Not insightful as much as common sense. If you fail over and over and over again to field a team that can crack the postseason in a meaningful way, then one shouldn't be surprised when fans can't be bothered to go to games. That's the way I look at it, and why I place the accountability of the chronic attendance problem primarily on ownership. You see it differently, which I respect, but it stand firmly in this point of view.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 05:53 PM) 4/12 was a close to packed house, yet was 29k in the box score. 4/26 had a small paid number, but A lot of people came in and out for the free minoso statues. These things happen , Debbie downer. Get off your f***ing high horse and quit your b****ing, out of state fan Close to a packed house on 4/12, and last year the Sox outdrew the 1970 Sox. You do make a compelling argument for why the Sox' attendance issues aren't as bad as they seem. Thanks for your insights!

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 08:39 AM) I just noticed you're in NYC. Do you ever come to Staten Island Yankees games? You should come one night and argue with me about attendance Ha! I've reached my quota in terms of talking about poor attendance. I simply cannot take on another team's problems. But I'll join you anytime for a game out there, and at least help the S.I. Yanks with their attendance issues!

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 04:07 AM) Also of note: The sox gave out a TON of tickets this year. Two surveys in the offseason, plus the kids club having four free tix handed put per member, AND they gave out April tix on fan appreciation day last year. Comps do not count in the attendance rolls, so the sox' goodwill gesture is not as obvious. If you're telling us that these tiny crowds we see at the ballpark everyday include a whole bunch of freebies, then the problem is worse than I thought.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 08:15 PM) It is more of a statement on the fans than anything else. We play in a town where the other team never wins, yet is always way ahead of us in attendance, so it isn't just WINNING. We have a bandwagon fan base that is better at making excuses than actually showing up. A bandwagon fan base that has only seen said bandwagon five times in the first 33 years of the current ownership's reign.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 12:10 PM) The Sox either break even or turn a profit most years. They HAVE "figured it out" financially at least. The attendance issue affects only the fans and the ticket sales staff for the sox. Well I'm very glad to hear that they have figured it out financially for themselves. I'm not sure why you or I as fans really care about that, but whatever. Aren't you a tad more interested in the product on the field, though? Wouldn't you like to see the team make it to the playoffs more than once every seven or eight years? Because that's all we've gotten during the last 34 years, and that's why there's only a bandwagon fan base (and not even a very good one at that!), and why the park is more than half empty every single day. But hey - they "HAVE figured it out financially at least" so who am I to complain!

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 12:06 PM) Actually, the fact that the sox drew more in 2013 than 1970 is impressive, considering that tickets were MUCH cheaper in 1970, and all games are on tv and online. Oh, and the red line was shut down for most of the year. So you are "impressed" that the Sox drew more than 495,000 fans in 2013, which is what they drew in that magical season of 1970. Ok then!

Just a nice, all-around victory!

Nice at bat for Big 'Un

Sacks packed with Cubans!

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 06:03 PM) If the story is that Sox fans are bandwagon fans, you missed the last 115 years of the teams history. Nope, haven't missed the history. What I have missed is current ownership, after 34 years of trying their hand at this, figuring out a way to turn this thing around. To win on something at least remotely resembling a consistent basis, because that's the only way to get those "bandwagon fans" to the ballpark. Outside of '05, there are all of four postseason wins in the Jerry Reinsdorf era. Four. Four in the other 33 years of his ownership of the ball club. Part of the reason there was only $18K "paid" attendance on a lovely summer night at a game featuring Sale v. Scherzer, with Abreu and Cabrera also in the house.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 04:36 PM) And ignoring that attendance at the ballpark has doubled since Jerry and Eddie took over. Doubled to what? We're currently 28th in attendance on our way to the third straight year of drawing less than two million, which is pathetic for a big market team. That's the story, not that Reinsdorf's teams are outdrawing the Veeck and Allyn teams of yesteryear.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 03:42 PM) And here WE are, still pretending that nothing has changed regarding how people consume baseball over that 34 year period. I guess the fans of the 27 teams in front of us in attendance are still consuming baseball the 'ol fashioned way of actually going to the ballpark much more so than our fan base is.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 14, 2014 -> 01:31 PM) If you want to measure it historically, the JR era is the most successful in franchise history, really by any measure. Well, I don't want to measure it historically because it's just flat out irrelevant. It is rather feint praise to conclude that Jerry Reinsdorf has somehow been a great owner because his record of success is better than that of John Allyn. That's just silly! No, where I'm coming from is that here we are, in 2014, essentially still having the same conversations about attendance that were going on when Reinsdorf and Einhorn (remember him?) first bought the ball club way back in '81. Jerry is so often referred to as one of the smartest owners in the game, and yet after 34 years, he still hasn't solved the most fundamental problem of his own franchise. As Hawk likes to say in the broadcasts "It's just that simple!".

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Jun 14, 2014 -> 05:21 AM) The Sox have NEVER made two consecutive postseason appearnaces. It's not a Jerry thing. Never happened under veeck, comiskey, or either allyn brother. No, it "is" a Jerry thing, just as it "was" a Comiskey, Veeck, and Allyn thing when they were the owners. You're correct, though: no owner of the Sox has been able to build sustainable success, which is why the franchise has had these attendance problems for decades upon decades. But Reinsdorf is the owner now, so the spotlight and microscope is on him. And my point in responding to a poster before, who rightfully pointed out that the solution to the attendance problem was to build a ball club capable of sustainable success, was suggesting we try a new owner. The current one has been at this for 34 years now, and has proven, to date, incapable of building such a consistent winner.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 13, 2014 -> 09:14 AM) I think the mentality will eventually change. But it is going to take a lot of winning, for a decent period of time. Then that might require new ownership, because Mr. Reinsdorf & Co. are in Year #34 of their control of this team, and they have yet to build a sustainable winning ballclub in that period of time. No White Sox team under their rule has made it to the playoffs in consecutive years. And outside of 2005, there have only been four other playoff appearances since 1981 when they took over, and the combined number of victories in those four appearances is four. An absolutely dreadful record of performance. So if improving attendance is predicated on sustainable success, then perhaps its time to bring in an ownership group that could actually figure out how to make that happen.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:56 PM) Trap where is the ump? Great question - that shouldn't have been that difficult a call for the 2nd base umpire to make. Has the umpiring really been this bad all these years? It's never felt that way. But with the advent of the replay review, it seems like there are many more blown calls than you'd expect.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:53 PM) Just go catch a cab, Hawk. Shush! That was a nice gesture.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:39 PM) Tyler Flowers 2 for his last 37, with 19 strikeouts Rick Hahn knows full well that, as part of the reshaping of the ball club, he'll have to make changes at both catcher and in left. That may or may not happen this season, but it's coming.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:30 PM) Hawk and Stone in full defense mod for RV pitching to Miggy, they know fans are not happy with him. Well, I will say this. I love the Hawk, I think he's a very smart and sound baseball man based on his many years in this game. But in this instance, he cannot have it both ways, IMO. He can't continue saying Cabrera is one of the best hitters of all time, and then turn around and justify not putting him on first base in that situation. I don't care who's hitting behind him.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:27 PM) Why not walk Miggy I do not understand RV? Yep.

QUOTE (Bigsoxhurt35 @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:22 PM) Yup f*** this game. Time for bed Not going to stick around til the 9th, when our Sox usually work their magic?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jun 12, 2014 -> 08:16 PM) That half inning may have lasted less than 2 minutes. Holy f*** this is frustrating to watch. The challenge of the previous inning took twice as long as the bottom of the 7th tonight.

Three full innings to try and score. Let's go Sox!