Eminor3rd

QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 02:11 PM) But what about his post drug production? None of his supporters are looking at the inevitable decline after a player stops using drugs. Actually, SS2K5 and I have exchanged several posts about just that, I assume it'll drop off -- but it would have to fall a LONG way to make the contract bad. The free agent market pays $5-6m per WAR on average. Braun will make between $16-19m per year for the rest of the contract, so he's being paid like a 3-4 WAR player from here on out. His last two full seasons came in at between 7-8 WAR. So even if he got 25-30% worse and lost like 2 WAR, he'd still be worth something like $10m more than his contract each year in comparison to what else we could get with that money. So, from a purely baseball perspective, you can assume he drops of a ton and it would stil be a boon. The point you made remains, however, that he's a total slime bag. So which outcome you root for depends on what you value more.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 01:59 PM) Going all in with a low pair (if we are assuming preflop here) is a much better gamble than long term free agent deals. I was assuming post-flop where you caught your pair in the flop. SHould have explained that more. Regardless, the point remains

QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 02:07 PM) https://twitter.com/CST_soxvan/status/403252792615112704 Anybody know anything about Elmore? I BELIEVE the book on him is decent bat, no glove.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 02:01 PM) That'd be amazing to grab him if Milwaukee picked up a good chunk of his contract, but yeah, not happening. I imagine that the only way Milwaukee would actually move him would be to NOT have to pick up much or any of his contract. But that's the thing, it's a BIG contract but it isn't necessarily a BAD contract. His production has been so high that he has been more than worth the money. Whether the contract is good or bad depends on how you think he'll age. But right now, pending an implosion, it's not an unreasonable price.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 01:54 PM) Wait, the possibility of a team taking on a bad contract giving up next to nothing in return never happens. No, the possibility of a team giving you prospects to entice you to accept a bad contract for next to nothing in return never happens. And never will. EDIT: Because it's nonsensical for everyone involved.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 01:53 PM) Assuming of course that he wasn't cheating at that time as well. I assume that he WAS. I'm just saying that he could drop 2 WAR and still be a good deal.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 01:49 PM) I'd love to hear your plan. Add players with surplus value that can be retained for several years. Only add market rate talent when it pushes you over the edge. The current state of free agency is that years are in demand more than dollars in some cases -- making market-rate acquisitions ALWAYS buys present value at the cost of future value, whether that's in terms of dollars or other players. Asking them to exhaust future resources on a team most likely destined for mediocrity is a recipe for short and long term disaster. It's like going all in on a low pair, hoping the river gives you three of a kind. It's a bad gamble.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 01:48 PM) Just so it's said, I'd hate cheering for him to the point that I'd consume significantly less baseball. That'd be real good motivation to cancel my extra innings package. I don't like him either, but man talk about a move that could speed up a rebuild...

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 12:33 PM) The question is, are you willing to bet $110+ million on where that production will be with no steroids? I say yes, because the pre-suspension version of Braun VASTLY overproduced that pay rate. He's been a 7-8 WAR player being paid like a 4 WAR player.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 12:36 PM) I think Hector's value will never be higher. He is a year away from arbitration, and is about to get much more expensive, with no real idea what kind of player he will end up being. I agree. His peripherals were also substantially worse than his ERA last year, suggesting that there's a good chance he's a regression candidate.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 01:07 PM) If they do both they add years to the rebuild. I don't think you understand how team rebuild their cores.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 12:15 PM) I wouldn't even trade Tyler Flowers for him straight up. The Brewers can keep that cheating clown. I understand where you're coming from as a fan, but I'm continually shocked at how often people on this site value the personal likability of players over winning. I'm not judging you for it, just saying it surprises me.

Um, yeah. We should send Dunn and Viciedo and a toss in and no money changes hands. Dude's a jerk but he's an absolute monster hitter that you just don't get the chance to acquire at a fixed rate.

I'd love to send Alexei for Piscotty. Gives us a prospect for the corner that we need badly and opens up a job for Garcia/Semien. Would be a huge win for both teams, IMO.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 20, 2013 -> 09:05 AM) They could have just had a nominal "couple million dollars in case no one else offers anything to him" offer on the table thinking he's a guy who could be traded at the deadline if healthy. Yeah, I imagine Hahn is involved on a few guys as a "price enforcer" -- that if there's someone way undervalued, we'll be in on him and find a way to fit it all together later.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 03:49 PM) And even if you want to point to Madoff, it is worth pointing out that the Mets are FAR from the only team to experience non-baseball related payroll raiding. There are professional franchises that have ended up in bankruptcy. Heck take a look at what happened to the Dodgers before they were sold. But those franchises are billion dollar assets, money should be no object!

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 03:44 PM) It's cool . We're arguing about the tallest midget here. I think Flowers had his shot and he'll never be able to hit. I'll go with the younger guy until Phegley has had his comparative shot . I wouldn't be upset at all about Flowers being a backup (again) while Phegs get more AB's in the minors as long as we have a LH catcher for most of the AB's against righties . Right, they have both been extra bad. If you have to choose between them, you should choose the one you think has more upside. Flowers has the better body and had the better prospect profile, but Phegley is younger and has experienced less failure.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 03:37 PM) Funny thing is, no one will know if you are being facetious here or not. Sure they will -- if I was, it would be green

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 03:18 PM) I don't know about going young. Phegley is only 2 years younger than Flowers. Which is a huge difference.

Interesting comparison: http://www.fangraphs.com/graphsw.aspx?players=242,319 LOL, also: http://www.fangraphs.com/graphsw.aspx?players=319,242,255

QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 02:59 PM) I just don't see how anybody could be anything but dismayed at having Dunn on the team. At least Paulie has a history of excellence. Same with Robin as much as I detest him as a manager. Dunn on the other hand has sort of trainwrecked this franchise cause of his salary and performance IMO. We all like Paulie way more than Dunn, but the fact is that the current version of Dunn is a more productive player than the current version of Paulie. So if you want to do everything you can to win, you have to choose Dunn. If you'd still rather have Konerko, that's fine, but know that you're choosing to make the team worse next year based on the information we have now.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 12:26 PM) I still come down to "If Phegley has a 1% chance of being a long term solution for the Sox at catcher...that is still better than the chances of AJ Pierzynski being a long term solution at catcher". I understand the Sox signing a catcher, or even trading for one, but it would have to be a guy who would fit well with about 200 PA's if they're not shooting for a high-valued one. It makes zero sense to sign a guy who we know won't be a solution in a year or two. Agreed

QUOTE (Iwritecode @ Nov 19, 2013 -> 11:55 AM) You seem pretty sure about this. It's not often you see a player retire in the middle of a season. It also wouldn't be a non-issue at all -- if you committed to Konerko and gave him a role that subsequently ended in his midseason retirement, you'd likely also have made some roster moves that led to being completely irrelevant very early in the season.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 18, 2013 -> 07:07 PM) If I had a billion dollar asset I would not sweat an additional $10M expenditure. Which is probably the best reason that you DON'T have a billion dollar asset.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Nov 18, 2013 -> 04:47 PM) Let's just say we disagree about how to run a business. If you are advocating throwing $10m around willy-nilly simply because your business is worth a lot, I'd say that you disagree with practically everyone on how to run a business.