Eminor3rd

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jun 28, 2013 -> 10:47 AM) The problem is that we are building this system with a lot of all or nothing hitters. Raw power is great, Juan Francisco has a ton of it, but he is on his third franchise in the last three years because the cannot make enough contact for that raw power to play. I think that the approach needs to be more balanced that going after Courtney Hawkins one year and then going after virtually the same player the next year. I just want to see more guys that are consistent contact hitters in the system that can set the table for the power hitters. I agree with your premise about the danger of too many low contact guys, I'm just saying I don't think it's fair to call him an "all or nothing" hitter at age 16. Right now, he's nothing but a 16 year old kid with tools, he hasn't even developed his skills yet. No one knows what type of player he will become.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 1, 2013 -> 02:26 PM) Eminor, a couple of people have alluded to it, not just me. I happen to think he's a 'loser' like the one poster's comments on Dunn. I personally think he dogs it. He was our best player last year. This year he's got decent numbers that are dropping. He had that one abysmal year after immediately sucking after the Sox acquired him. I don't know if I'm allowed to bash players, so let's just say I don't like his style. If Rios is a great player and I'm being unfair, then I guess I am a bad fan. I just don't understand what you want out of this team. You hate even thinking about the team rebuilding, yet you are in favor of driving one of its only good players out of town because you don't like his style.

QUOTE (Paulstar @ Jul 1, 2013 -> 12:19 PM) I suppose it is also a coincidence that Dunn finally starts to hit once the White Sox are one of the worst teams in baseball? I didn't say it was Dunn's fault for the Reds being bad. However, I don't think it is a surprise that both the Reds and Nationals let him go and then both teams proceeded to become much better. Of course there are other reasons for their turnarounds as well, but I don't think you can ignore the Dunn effect. Honestly, I think Dunn is a loser because of two main reasons. The first reason is because he is not a very clutch hitter and that leads to reason number 2, he thrives in non-pressure situations. He is notorious for putting up big numbers when it doesn't matter. This line of thinking is ridiculous. There's just no evidence for this at all.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 30, 2013 -> 09:41 PM) I can't believe so many teams want Rios. I hope he's the first dealt. Never been a Rios fan. Don't like his game. Don't like his style. Just get a fair offer and deal him, Hahn. Why wait any longer?? Greg, you're impossible. He's the best position player on our team, and has been for two years now. He hits homeruns, plays good defense, steals bases, and hits for average. What do you want?

QUOTE (Jbabs34 @ Jun 29, 2013 -> 08:11 AM) I'm with Bernstein on this one. Look at it rationally...if the Sox go with a complete rebuilding mode, the EARLIEST they would be relevant would probably be in 5 years, and that's being generous considering how thin the farm system is. So, let's say in those 5 years Sale averages 190 innings a season - that's almost 1,000 innings pitched. Do you think his mechanics can hold up that long and still be as effective as he is today? It's certainly possible that he can, but I wouldn't put my money on it. So, if some GM called Hahn today and is willing to overpay - say 3 or 4 very solid prospects - how do you not entertain that idea? The problem is that there's no reason at all to assume we're five years from contention. How can you even plan for more than five years out? If you can't imagine a 24 year old will still be young enough to contribute the next time you have a shot to contend, you're saying that no one in your entire organization will save your team at any point. If you're talking about guys more than five years away, you're talking about guys in high school and college.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 29, 2013 -> 02:31 PM) Do fans of all horrible teams always talk about falling closer to the top draft pick in baseball? The sport with the most boring, worst draft, biggest crapshoot draft of all sports? My guess is you'd get laughed out of a bar or the Cell if you brought up this topic with most Sox fans. Who gives a frick about the draft? I care more about free agency and putting wins on the board and getting the best possible manager and hitting coaches as soon as possible. Have fun talking about the draft all the way til next June when we take some high school kid who may or may not make the bigs. Then don't f***ing post. Go talk to the fans at the bar at the cell about how the s*** season is the hitting coach's fault. Go pretend that that free agency can build you a winner by just continually signing the most expensive post-prime RBI monsters to ten year deals. Rejoice at every bad contract because "it's not my money, who cares?!?!" then call into boers & Bernstein and tell them about your ideas.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Jun 28, 2013 -> 12:29 PM) It's important to make sure you have 3 third basemen on the roster for a doubleheader. Probably just a courtesy to the jetlagged Gillaspie and a chance to get Morel a couple more at bats. Given his strong AAA performance, I think everyone know he'd be up there getting a shot if not for Gillaspie's success.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jun 28, 2013 -> 01:40 PM) Mitchell wasn't a high ceiling prospect. He was a guy that struggled with contact in college that KW thought would all of the sudden learn how to hit when he got to the pros. He was a high floor prospect because he was close to being finished when he came out of college and you knew what you were getting, good speed, solid defense and power to the gaps, and he struggled to recognize breaking balls. KW was infatuated with athletes when drafting hitters over baseball players. Yeah I think you have a fundamentally different definition of "ceiling." Guys with raw tools who are successful despite a lack of advanced skills have the highest ceiling of all because they have the potential to get a lot better with the development of said skills. The way you just described Mitchell is pretty much the textbook definition of low floor/high ceiling. Boom or bust.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Jun 28, 2013 -> 01:50 PM) C Phegley 1B Viciedo 2B Keppinger SS Beckham 3B Gillaspie LF CF Danks RF Thompson DH Konerko IF IF OF Mitchell BC #1 Sale #2 Danks #3 Quintana #4 Santiago #5 CL Reed SU Jones SU Webb MR Lindstrom MR Heath MR LR BOLD! Predicting Konerko is here but Dunn is gone.

I don't understand why we want Granderson. He's a LF masquerading in CF, he strikes out 25%+, and is becoming old and injury prone. Used to be really good, but now he'd just be a bad contract.

This is awesome. I'm not going to quote any passages because it's all in the context of the visuals: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/pitcher-spotlight-chris-sale/ This is the guy that did that Yu Darvish gif that got famous, but now he's doing analysis.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 07:46 PM) When will we get a hitter that we don't have to wait 4+ years to hopefully develop When we sign a big name free agent like Adam Dun... wait. This is the price we pay for having a s*** system. The idea is if you keep doing stuff like this continually, you have wave after wave of guys popping in. But it's going to take some time to build from the s***pile we currently have.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 28, 2013 -> 01:29 AM) 2 1 •Reply•Share › Josh Conn • 6 days ago − If I am the Pirates, I should be interested in both Ramirez and Thornton. Jordy Mercer might be the answer at SS, or might not, but Ramirez would be an upgrade for this year for sure. Pirates need another lefty in the pen besides Watson. •Reply•Share › Honey Badger GM • 6 days ago I feel like the O's will be the team most involved in trading with the ChiSox, with Peavy as a TOR starter, and Beckham/Ramirez better than whatever we throw out there at second on a daily basis. Then again, the O's say that they don't want to give up much (maybe Arrieta), so I don't see how they think they are gonna get anything done. •Reply•Share › PursueYourDream • 6 days ago Alan Hanson, Nick Kingham, Andy Oliver, Alex Presley, and James McDonald for Rios and Ramirez. Pirates would be dangerous with those two in the lineup. •Reply•Share › jwsox PursueYourDream • 5 days ago To get rios AND alexi. I would have to assume Hahn would try to get (Jameson) Tallion. Even if it meant the sox eating a chunk of both contracts. Lol Taillon

That idiot Bernstein was talking about this on the radio a little earlier. He was acting like it was stupid not to trade Sale because "he won't be pitching for a White Sox World Series team anytime soon and the pieces you'd get might be on the next winner." Sale is 24 years old and signed through freaking 2019 to a team-friendly deal? How the f*** does this guy get paid to analyze sports?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 05:49 PM) IMO, if Konerko isn't on the block, it's because the Sox asked and he said he didn't want to be moved. This was my thought too.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jun 24, 2013 -> 09:25 AM) Based on those scouting reports, I would pass on Zapata, as it seems we are flush with hitters with batting practice power that are projects when it comes to making contact and pitch recognition. Instead I would use the money to go after Diaz, Devers, and Almonte. All say they have good pitch recognition and can make consistent contact, something that this system really needs to complement all the toolsy players we have drafted. He's 16 though -- what does good "pitch recognition" really mean at that level? I remember the jump from D3 HS baseball to American Legion. It was like the pitchers were 200% better. The whole game was different at that point, I was seeing stuff I never even knew existed. I was good at "pitch recognition" until that. And I was 18 then. I mean I think you can pretty much only look at tools at that point. They kid will have to spend 6-9 years learning baseball skills before he sees the show.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 02:02 PM) Carlos Sanchez, last year. Oh, lol.

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 05:03 PM) Pardon me guys as I haven't been watching a lot of games this year and I have a few questions about Beckham: 1) Is Gordon's .309 batting average in roughly 100 AB's anything to get excited about? 2) Has he lost some of his power with the new stroke (0 HR's so far) 3) Dare we consider some team friendly extension and hope he continues to progress? No -- 100 at bats isn't enough to make meaningful predictions. He's looked good so far, we'll see if he can do it over 400-500 at bats.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 03:29 PM) This thread is about Addison Reed. If he doesn't have value, why trade a guy who has a WHIP below 1.00 and strikes out more than one an inning, while making next to minimum? I never said that Addison Reed did or didn't have value. I was trying to explain to Greg that I don't think it makes sense to say something like "we should trade pitching because it's the only good thing we have."

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 02:54 PM) I don't know why you guys want to trade pitching. It's like you want us to be out of the race in April the next several years. You know how long it's going to take to rebuild if all facets of our team suck? It's not about trading pitching or hitting or whatever, it's about trading assets that don't have long term value. Like it or not, this combination of players blows and they won't win. You need to find the weakest points and replace them with something that will good for more than a few months. I cannot grasp the desire for people to argue that the team should stay committed to "winning now" by continuing to run the same s***ty players out year after year as they get older and worse.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-06...te-andre-rienzo Nice. Who was the last of our guys to play?

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 12:19 PM) I am always weary of BOS/NYY products. I would much rather prefer Iglesias but I feel Middlebrooks is a much more likely trade candidate. I wish Iglesias never went on this tear because he could be had. With Drew holding SS for the year and Bogarets for the future there is no spot for Iglesias except 3B. I can't really see Boston putting a guy with a minimal power at 3rd though. I really think they supplanting Alexei with Iglesias will not lose any production and perhaps improve defense. Then we can move Alexei and whatever we get back is gravy. Yeah, I agree. I like Alexei, but we could use a longer-term, less expensive solution. Obviously Anderson is far away and might bust, and it looks like they think Sanchez is a 2B.

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 11:54 AM) I know there's been talk about acquiring Iglesias and honestly I love the kid's defense. If we could get him at SS that would be a huge plus in the future and he doesn't hit arbitration years til '16. I don't like buying high on him but either him or Middlebrooks don't have a spot in Boston. While obviously you can't be sure, you have to think one of them is on their way out. I would guess Middlebrooks since they are having great success with Iglesias at 3B right now. I think Reed is a fit there but does anyone think they'd give up either Iglesias or Middlebrooks for him? I would love picking up either. I doubt Boston wants to have an Andrew Bailey part 2 but at the same time they are sitting atop the AL east with a back end of the bullpen that could use a solid closer. Andrew Bailey's 1.4 WHIP is nothing to instill confidence during a pennant race. IMO, Middlebrooks is one of the most overrated players in the game. His success last year was propped by a .330ish BABIP despite a 25% K rate and a 4% walk rate. His rates are nearly the same this year (K's up to 27%) but with a 90 point BABIP drop, and he has performed to the tune of .192/.228./.389. Disgusting. If you guys hate watching Adam Dunn, imagine Adam Dunn with a 4% walk rate and way less power. I want nothing to do with Middlebrooks, especially not for Reed.

QUOTE (pettie4sox @ Jun 27, 2013 -> 10:13 AM) Lo and behold the SOX do it again... make a crappy pitcher look elite. I'm ready for some Football! vomit

QUOTE (The Ultimate Champion @ Jun 26, 2013 -> 03:45 PM) See I view that trade totally differently. The Teahen trade & extension itself was dumb, but the second Jackson deal was KW taking advantage of the Jays desire for Rasmus. The Cards wanted EJax & weren't going to make that deal without him, so Kenny rightfully got a good prospect out of them (Stewart was a good, highly rated prospect with a nice arm who busted, as is typical, let's not rewrite history) and then Kenny made them eat Teahen's deal. Frasor was the add-on kind of piece there. That was actually a huge haul for Kenny for a 1/2 season of Jackson, and an excellent example of him taking advantage of a very unique situation. The lamenting of the Jackson-Hudson deal just needs to disappear from these boards. We tried to win, we didn't, oh well. We didn't miss a beat in the SP department, we actually got better even without anyone we were talking about at the time coming through. Still the biggest & most hurtful move during that time period was the one we didn't make, where JR blocked KW from firing Ozzie's ass. +1