Eminor3rd

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2011 -> 03:23 PM) Not at all. I think he's a .750-.800 OPS outfielder and a giant upgrade from Juan Pierre. I'd think more like .725, but I agree, he'll strike out more but he's got a ton more pop. Let's not forget that Juan Pierre has like 14 career homeruns, which is not typical, even for a leadoff guy. De Aza could hit 10 next year if he's healthy.

Let's talk about something else.

No No No

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Dec 13, 2011 -> 05:13 PM) I wonder if teams are waiting to see who wins the claim on Yu Darvish before anyone commits to a Danks or Floyd trade. Wishful thinking? Not at all, and it's one of the reasons I don't understand why people are upset that neither of them has moved already. To maximize return, you have to cater to the market. The best time to move our guys is when they're the best remaining guys on the market.

QUOTE (flavum @ Dec 13, 2011 -> 10:50 AM) I'd rather they just move Quentin for whatever, and stand pat with the rest of the team....all of which have had some success in their careers. Baseball is a funny game. Career years happen. Injuries plague other teams. I'd rather they just play it out, and see where they're at at the all-star break. If that means they don't get as much for Danks and Floyd, so be it. At least they tried to win in 2012. If they go with a rotation with Axelrod and Stewart in it, then they really don't stand a chance. I'd like to see them go a little bit further and take advantage of the SP market by moving one of Danks/Floyd in addition to CQ. But you're right -- the money to D/R/P is sunk, and they are certainly all still young enough to play at a high level again, so they have much more value to us as potential contributors than as anchors to trash the value of our decent trade chips. Luckily, we're in a bad division, so even as grim as things are now, we still have a legitimate shot in the dark to win it next year. Never buy just to buy or sell just to sell -- just be shrewd and make the best of any opportunity that presents itself.

QUOTE (CyAcosta41 @ Dec 13, 2011 -> 10:57 AM) Of course, the opposite might also be the case -- despite all of the salivating GM's who did their best to CONVINCE Trader Kenny that he had overestimated the market for Danks/Floyd, THIS TIME Kenny remained patient, stuck to the plan, waited for the free agents to sign and some of the other attractive trade candidates to be moved, and will find himself with some truly valuable trading chips for pitching hungry teams in the weeks before pitchers and catchers are set to report! Any way you look at it, this was always the likeliest scenario to get max benefit for Danks/Floyd. Sure, they might still be with us because Kenny actually tried hard to move them already, but to no avail. I'm just hoping that this isn't the case and that we're holding firm and waiting for the seller's market to emerge. Hey, even a cynical Sox fan can hope now and then, right? This is exactly how I see it. KW might have made a mistake, but we have absolutely no way of knowing at this point. Even though we're all bored and want news, it makes absolutely ZERO sense to judge any 'non-moves' in the middle of December. We can't judge KW's offseason until the end of the offseason.

The latter: get big prospects. The veteran contracts will ironically help us if we're rebuilding, because we'll have veteran players to fill spots while the young guys get ready on the farm. If you think attendance is bad now, imagine what it would be like if we lost 100 games for a couple years.

See? This is the influence this man has. So glad we're rid of Guillen

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 12, 2011 -> 04:37 PM) I'm cool with Sheppers, Loux, Banuelos, Betances, or Montero. Seriously, get some of those. I'm guessing Montero is completely off-limits, and Banuelos isn't far behind. I think Betances is probably a bit overrated, so I can see Cashman ultimately dealing him. Scheppers seems reasonable too. Not familiar with Loux. People said Sanchez is off-limits, but isn't he just a worse, further off version of Montero? If I'm Cashman, I have to at least consider Betances + Sanchez for Danks. I mean, I know he only has one year of control, but picking up Danks would solve a ton of problems for NYY next year, and he'd be giving up a redundant future DH and a pitcher with an injury history that he hopes turns into Danks. Right? Am I out in left field?

QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Dec 12, 2011 -> 03:16 PM) FWIW, KW is talking to TEX about Sheppers and Loux. What's the source for this?

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 12, 2011 -> 03:32 PM) I don't think Hamels re-signs with the Phillies and I'd be surprised if they just lets him walk away. If they trade him, it would be at the deadline after a disaster of a 2012 season. It's a tough bind, but winning next year for them is top priority.

MLBTR says that the Blue Jays are focused on snatching up Gio. If AA pulls him off the market, that's good news for Danks' trade value to the big name contenders. Then again, if AA fleeces someone, it could set a low precedent...

I'd actually be alright with a package around Noesi. Noesi + Romine or Sanchez + 2 longshots would be adequate, though not exciting, for me. Although I could really use a package that made me say "GOOD JOB KENNY!" about now

Guys, the AL central sucks. The Tigers played way over their heads all year. The Royals are starting to become a mild threat, nothing more at this point until they get some real pitching. We could win the division any year, literally. With the exception of a good run by the Twins, the AL Central has been won by whichever mediocre team had a the hottest season in practically any given year. Let's make good long-term moves and see what happens. We need a farm system.

Too bad Milwaukee has one of the most barren farms around

QUOTE (TheHugeUnit @ Dec 10, 2011 -> 07:18 AM) I would think that means they're more likely to deal Gio. Beane will deal him if he gets what he wants. I think thats a piss poor return for Cahill tho. I love Parker but I thought they could of gotten more. Man, I disagree. Parker is LEGIT. One of the top SP prospects in the majors. If you consider Breslow a salary move, I think that's a solid package.

But that's the advantage of the large market. You don't to develop an entire roster of star young guys, you just need a good core. You can make two or three big free agent signings at any offseason. It's totally plausible that it's a 2 or 3 year thing. And don't forget that futher off guys are valuable even if you don't wait for them... you trade for veterans whe n you're ready to make the move. But what you CAN'T do is have a bunch of old guys on big contracts laying around. Your core has to be cost-controlled so you have the flexibility to add premier guys when you make your move. That's why it would have been BAD for all of us if they signed Buerhle. You guys say it's kick in the face of the fans, and that's NOT true. You'd feel the kick in the face when in three years, we ended up one bat short of going all the way because we were paying 35-year old Buerhle $15m to be our 4th starter and couldn't afford to acquire another star.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 01:06 PM) That's the sentiment I'm hearing a lot. "Somebody will close." Unless the guy is an instant sensation, that means 2-3 guys will each blow 2-3 saves before they are replaced. That's considered a mild disaster in closer-land. The 'proven closer' thing is a fallacy. The Rays prove it literally every year. Our bullpen last year had a ton of bad breaks and performed poorly, but that doesn't mean that all RPs will perform poorly just because they're trying to close.

QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 12:04 PM) I think Martinez will be a good SS for the Sox. Ahhh I forgot about him. That's a good point. Perhaps Alexei should be on the block.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 11:54 AM) Then he'd be one step closer to actually being Khalil Greene. Haha.

QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 11:50 AM) I would send Alexei to the Braves for Beachy and Minor. I really like the idea of getting a future SS back, since all we have in the wings is Escobar. Minor might be better than Vizcaino though. Although, one does wonder if Backham could handle SS in the majors, his natural position in the first place. His arm and glove would play, the only question would be his range. If he could do that, all of a sudden he's way more valuable even if his bat doesn't come around.

QUOTE (knightni @ Dec 8, 2011 -> 05:13 PM) I ask because Alex Gonzalez is going to Milwaukee. Do the Braves have an in-house SS solution, or are they going to bid-up Jimmy Rollins/trade for Hanley? Tyler Pastornicky is the current guy, though there are many who believe he isn't quite ready yet. It might make a ton of sense to move Alexei for a package that includes a pitcher and Pastornicky for the Sox, who window for needing a good SS is a couple years later than the Braves. I'd imagine you couldn't get both Teheran AND Pastornicky. Maybe Vizcaino + Pastorinicky though?

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 11:18 AM) We entered the Winter meetings largely needing to trade Danks, Floyd, Thornton and Quentin. We accomplished none of this. I think that's a really short-sighted view. In order to maximize the return for those guys, we needed to let the market develop. Basically, you strike quick if there's more supply than demand, and you are patient if there's more demand than supply. In the case of SP this year, it is the latter. Wilson and Buerhle dropped, and now we have several big market teams fighting for Darvish. Whoever doesn't get him has to pony up for Gio or Danks.

Good perspective, Marty. Even if you think we could have gotten more out of Santos, we certainly got something we needed by trading from a position of depth. So far, tings are going according to plan, and no Mark Teahen-like disasters have occurred.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Dec 8, 2011 -> 12:39 PM) Outside the box: Danks to the Royals for Montgomery, Melville and Jeffress. Three guys that have struggled but have a lot of ability if Coop can fix'em. Generally trading within the division is bad, but the Royals window to contend will close around the same time the Sox are ready to contend again. I like the idea, but I've heard bad things about Montgoemry's stock as of late. Not familiar with Melville.