thxfrthmmrs

for those of you who wanted beckham sent down, you should be ashamed for yourself.

jenks wont be back next season, too expensive. But guys didn't I just say we will sent some money and Juan Pierre's 8 million contract over in this hypothetical situation? we will be looking at around $60 million committed if thats the case. Historically, the Sox are known to make moves to add on salaries during mid season and push the payroll over 100 million. Also, someone on the forum mentioned that Sox management hinted there are money available to spent. If sox do acquire Crawford, would it surprise you if Reinsdorf is willing to spent a couple million more to retain him? Plus, the sox do have some major league ready prospects to fill the void of the departing role players, Torres, Hudson, Morel, De Aza. If you haven't notice, the Sox have been moving away from the home run hitting type, station to station type of lineup to a speedy, and more athletic, and defense oriented type of lineup. Shredding Konerko's contract and signing Crawford is well within the team's philosophy. Then perhaps target a good defensive first basemen, with some power, and cheap salary player like LaRoche to replace some of the power lost. All these are just hypothetical, but they are well within the team's philosophy.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 25, 2010 -> 11:56 AM) The Rays will receive draft pick compensation for Crawford, John Jaso and Kelly Shoppach will serve just fine as a catching duo, first base is a very easy position to fix, especially when Pena, even as powerful as he is, is putting up a .737 OPS, and they have Desmond Jennings waiting in the minor leagues to help attempt to fill the void should Crawford leave for free agency this offseason. The Sox also have like $70 million already committed to next years roster, and that's not including raises through arbitration and any other free agent signings, so the Sox wouldn't have room to lock Crawford up long term if they were to bring him in through this hypothetical scenario, which still won't happen. The Rays won't be trading Carl Crawford. Mind you that the sox have only $65 millions committed, I believe they will only offer abritration to Danks and CQ, with team option to Thorton and Castro. So the Sox do have some money to spend next season.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 25, 2010 -> 11:36 AM) The Rays are 14 games over .500 and Crawford's been a huge part of that. He won't be traded. crawford is a free agent at the end of the season, and despite their success the Rays are still a small market team. They would risk losing him for nothing (or a few compensational picks i believe) if he bolts for a bigger contract. The smart move for them is to trade him for major league ready prospects (viceido and flowers) to replace Pena (FA next season) and whoever their catcher is, and to have a short term leadoff hitter or fourth outfielder in Pierre. This is at least help them stay competitive from this season and beyond. oh yea, and with konerko and AJ contract due at the end of the season, we have a really good chance of retaining him, especially if we go on and make the playoffs with Crawford at the helm.

carl crawfrod anyone? he is available as we speak, and a natural LF to replace pierre unlike McCutchen or Bourn. We could send Viceido, Flowers, Pierre and some cash to Tampa for Crawford?

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jun 24, 2010 -> 04:27 PM) For those wondering Assuming a 56.1 million dollar cap, and the Bulls sign one max guy: Max Guy: $16,568,908 Luol Deng $11,345,000 Derrick Rose $5,546,160 Joakim Noah $3,128,536 James Johnson $1,713,600 Taj Gibson $1,117,680 Roster hold $473,604 Roster hold $473,604 Roster hold $473,604 Roster hold $473,604 Roster hold $473,604 Total $41,787,904 Remaining for final FA: $14,312,096 That falls right in line with Johnson's reported 4yr/60M deal. What I want to happen is they trade Deng + The Bobcats Pick + A Future Pick for the Clips 8th (I think about a $2.3M cap hold) pick to bring the remaining $$$ in addition to one max guy to: $23,357,096 Subtract the money for Bosh ($16,568,908) and you get: $6,788,188 Using that money you could probably get Ray Allen here if he doesn't want to resign with the Celtics, and depending on his price, possibly have Brad return to further tutor the big men. Edit: To fill out that roster, you'd probably bring back Law/Kurz/Byars/Alexander at the minimum. And with the 8th pick, I'd draft Henry to get: PG - Rose/Law SG - Allen/Henry/Byars SF - LeBron/Johnson/Alexander PF - Bosh/Gibson/Kurz C - Noah/Miller/Asik correct me if i am wrong, isn't roster hold only apply for 8 spots, and no more holds if you have 8 guys already?

just imagine if we dominated the Cleveland Indians like we are suppose to, then we would be the best team in MLB.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Jun 23, 2010 -> 04:00 PM) Gio Gonzalez - supplemental pick of the White Sox in 2004 having a very nice season for the A's. That's about it dating back to Kip Wells and Aaron Rowand in 1998. his numbers prior to this season was beyond terrible. Besides, I was more or less talking about a first round pick position players having success coming from a white sox farm system, gio has gone to the phillies and to the A's before reaching the majors. yes, beckham did have the highest batting average of all the recent sox first rounder last season, but that is his calling card. Fields had 23 hrs in 2007 and became totally irrelevant next season. We may be witnessing the same thing with becks now, and if he doesn't get demoted soon, it's really going to affect his success from now on.

hello brian anderson, joe borchard, josh fields. who was the last Sox first round pick to come through their farm system and have success in the majors? can't think of any recent ones if they don't send beckham down soon, I am afraid we will see his name in that infamous group soon.

lets hope Peavy feels alright after going the distance but you gotta respect the guy, sore shoulder and all, but he goes out and gives everything he's got. You can see while throwing the last few pitches and walking off the mound, his face is grimacing a bit. but i am glad that he's able to finish up what he started.

here is a genius idea for Bud Selig and other baseball people. Since we have the designated hitter, why don't we add the designated fielder as well, where a guy only plays defense and does not take swings. If we can combine Teahen's bat with Vizquel's defense, third base should not be much to concern with.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 5, 2010 -> 03:29 PM) First of all, this thread belongs in the Diamond club. Second of all...this strikes me as totally unusual for a winning team that just opened up a new ballpark. i didn't say this was unusual, but kind of unexpected for such a high attendance rate winning or not, they have sold out most of the home games this season. would say you expected them to have an attendance like this and sell out most of the home games before the season starts?

the minnesota twins, as we are speaking, are 18-9, tied for the third best record in the league, have the best 1-2 punch in the AL, morneau and mauer ,and they are both lefties. they also play in a lefty friendly ball park with a plethora with lefties in the lineup according to ESPN http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance they also happen to have the 3rd best attendance rate in baseball with close 98% full for their 12 home games thus far, and their attendance average of 38,600 really scares me. even the monday and tuesday game with the tigers had attendance over 38,000. i tried to look for their tickets online and most of their home games had already sold out this season. Their tickets are also some of the highest priced this year in baseball. while our attendance is averaging little bit over 23,000 thus far, and has declined each of the past 3 seasons. Now i know the twins have spent over 100 millions themselves to fund their new ballpark, but looking and their tickets sales and their payroll in the recent years, i think it's safe to say that they have moved out of the small market team label? could we see in the coming years that their payroll scorching up to 100 millions while we fall back to 75-80 millions? the twins' management has been known for being able to build a competitive team with a small payroll. just imagine what they can do with a higher payroll. as it stands now, in the next 5-10 years twins will be very, very, very competitive. that is something sox fans should be concerned about.

QUOTE (soxfan-kwman @ May 5, 2010 -> 02:00 PM) he got a couple of walks last night & a nice hit later in the game last night but Beckham is hitting different...Beckham has widened his natural stance & swing. I'm not saying Greg Walker is to blame, but someone should tell him to start with his feet closer together. Watch tonight, he takes a practice cut with his regular swing & then he moves into the batters box with his legs bent & almost pigeon toed. Anyone else notice? his new 3/4th stance when he was doing the practice cuts and the regular swings reminds me of iguchi back in the days. perhaps they both took it from walker?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 3, 2010 -> 11:38 AM) Baseball is a different situation. It's really hard to compare total salary from 1 league to another. Baseball has 2x the number of games that the NBA has, baseball stadiums typically hold 2x the number of people of NBA stadiums, the NBA has a soft cap while MLB has none. One mistaken contract in baseball and you're in trouble, but you can get out of it if the owner is willing to pay more or if you can trade the guy to the Red Sox/Yankees/Cubs. One mistaken contract in basketball, and you've got no options. You try to spend around that contract and you wind up in tax territory. You can't trade that contract for salary relief except in very rare circumstances, and you often have to take on even worse contracts. It's really interesting to see how much a single bad contract does in each league. In the NFL, a single bad contract only really hurts you if you keep playing the guy. The Redskins and Raiders have handed out so much idiotic money it's not funny, but the Redskins look competitive every year and the Raiders might look competitive if Russel wasn't a tool, and then they hand out another large contract the next year. In MLB, a single bad contract can hurt a team, but they can still win with it if they develop guys around it, or they can find ways to dump other salaries around it (see; the Padres, Blue Jays, Pirates). In the NBA, it really is a killer, because that bad max deal eats up 1/3 of your salary. i think you're twisting the truth a bit here. since when do the yankees and the red sox take on players who are busts do not worth the money they make? had the tigers been successful in trading dontrelle willis, jeremy bonderman to them? did the braves trade mike hampton's 20 mil/year contract to them? would the yankees and red sox show any interest in alfonso soriano now for his contract? no. the yankees and red sox trade for productive players who are worth their contract 95% of the time. I am looking at the yankees and red sox roster right now, and i do not see that they have taken on anybody who makes big money and yet at the time the teams got them, they are already busts. the point is, no matter what the sport is, if the player signs a big contract, but turns out to be a bust and is no longer productive, teams aren't going to take them, unless you pay them extra money, give them your top prospect. it's the same in any in any sports, baseball is no exception. i am glad that you brought up jamarcus russel, the guy has done like 1% of what david lee did in the nba, and yet he already got 40 million in guaranteed money, and guess what? he sucked ass. there was a great article about him this weekend on ESPN of how the raider fans hated him by burning his jersey, creating hate groups on facebook, blogs, whatever, because he absolute stole money from the raiders!! do you see that in the nba? oh and by the way, he makes 1/10th of the teams salary cap, and the team still have to pay 52 other players, now isn't that more screwed up. you see big moneys thrown around more loosely in other sports, such as baseball and football, and teams always have to take repercussion for it. there is no way out. but u see money is thrown around more easily in baseball and football, so i am not sure why you call basketball screw up. baseball and football pays players for their potential, where a first round draft pick like stratsburg demands a certain amount of money, a unknown guys like viceido gets 10 million and haven't been to the U.S. yet, a guy like jeremy bonderman gets huge contract after one decent year because the teams thought he is finally scratching the surface of his potential. in the nfl, what happens if russels doesn't help the raiders out, and they end up having the 3rd overall pick next draft and have to pay another 40 million guaranteed to a rookie? that is 80 million guaranteed right there. but the NBA rarely pays for potential alone, but they pay for performance. a guy like kawame brown was the first overall pick, or darko a second overall pick, they didn't make much money their first couples years in the league, when he is a proven bust, people won't pay them. now i come to think of it, the nba salary system is actually pretty fair.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 3, 2010 -> 10:22 AM) Which says more about how screwed up the NBA's current system is than it does about either player. that's why he is not getting a max contract at 16 million a year maybe he would get a 5 year 55-60 million contract at least he is an all star, if you want to talk about screw up, then look at pitchers in mlb, like Jeremy Bonderman and Kris Benson, guys are not even all stars, but get 10-12 million a year. or look at nfl rookies, guys haven't even taken a snap but gets a 60 million contract and 40 million guaranteed. if you want to talk about screw sports. the nba is not on top of the list

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 2, 2010 -> 05:35 PM) 1) Beckham has proven he can successfully adapt and transition defensively to 2B (his third position in a year), and only needs a few more weeks to get things straightened out mentally. If he's still struggling at the end of May, we can always send him to Charlotte and we have capable replacements in Nix and Vizquel to hold down the fort in the meantime. 2) Sergio Santos...watching him well up in THE CLUB preview is perhaps the coolest thing to happen this year, along with #5 and #8 on this list. 3) Alex Rios is the player who we're no longer worrying about carrying that long-term contract anymore. 4) Andruw Jones has been better than anyone could ever have expected in his role. 5) John Danks has become one of the two three lefty starters in baseball. 6) Matt Thornton, despite his occasional glitches, has been one of the top 2-3 lefty set-up guys in baseball, and would fetch us as much as any player on this team at the moment if KW placed him on the market. 7) Bobby Jenks has gotten the job done, just look at his Saves/SO stat, the back of his TOPPS baseball card begins and ends there. 8) Paul Konerko is the AL Offensive Player of the Month, giving KW flexibility to trade him if necessary in order to clear salary space. Even if traded, there's a better than 50/50 chance KW could bring him back to the White Sox for a 2-3 year extension if they decided Viciedo wasn't ready to go at season's end. 9) Pena and Putz have acquitted themselves well, and Putz will only get better (as he builds his fastball and splitter back up to previous "closer form" each day removed from surgery). Along with Andruw Jones and Konerko, Putz will be among the most sought-after pitchers on our roster due to KW's insightful contract. Pena's making the minor league guys forget about Brandon Allen. 10) We have immediate, impactful prospects at the AA/AAA level in D2, Flowers (murdering the ball), Viciedo, Hudson, Santeliz, Shelby and CJ Retherford. 11) Trayce Thompson has a better than 50/50 chance of becoming one of the Top 20 prospects in baseball, and a dominant offensive force that you build an organization around, to go along with Beckham, Danks and Quentin as franchise centerpieces. 12) Biting the bullet and trading Buehrle to the Cardinals nets us a boatload of prospects....and they'll be willing to pay a "premium" to acquire him. 13) We stayed afloat on this road trip and can start to do some damage in the standings to the Twins'/Tigers' hot starts with a good 5-2 or 6-1 streak, led by the starting pitching all winning and each performance building on the previous one like in 2005 and 2008. They're simply too talented to not get it figured out for at least a 2-3 month stretch in a season. Just like the 2001 team that started 14-29 only to get to 8 games over .500, or the 1983 team that stumbled to 16-24 and ended up winning the division going away, by 30 games. Shall I go on? some interesting points, but i strongly disagree with you on number 5 and 10. danks had a great april, but so did 11 other pitchers, he is only 12 in the ERA list, look at guys like zito, fister, silva, livan hernandez, cj wilson, jamie garcia, do you call them cy young candidates? if he has 16 wins, and a sub 3.00 ERA in september, then it's debatable whether he is a top 5 lefty starter. i can think of guys like lester, sabathia, santana, cliff lee, and even a renewed liriano off the top of my head as better lefties than danks most of the prospects we have down in AAA/AA are not ready, even D2, flowers, viciedo, just look at their K/AB, those are josh fields numbers in the majors, and i do not want to see 3 josh fields on the team right now. our team is the worse contact team in the league, and we do not need to rush guys up who will strike out twice every game. PK, danks, and jones has been sensational thus far, but expect them to come back to earth the next month or two. the only trends i see that could continue are Santos being a dominant reliever, and Rios continues to hit. Santos has really great stuff, reminds me of a young Bobby jenks or a poor man's jonathan broxton. If he continues to do well in the 7th or 8th inning, expect the Sox to trade jenks away at the deadline to avoid arbitration next year and put him or putz at closer spot. one thing that bothers me and hasn't really receive enough attention is buehrle's struggle. he has really gone down hill since the opening day, recording one 1 QS since, and opponents are just teeing off him like it's T ball. if not for that great opening day start, his ERA would be topping 6.00 now. Going back to last season, you can see his struggles really started after the perfect game, and he struggled to finish the season, and the trend continues now. perhaps the hitters are finally figuring out how to hit his soft stuff after all these year? i mean not even the cardinals would be into him now for that money and the mighty struggles.

QUOTE (knightni @ May 2, 2010 -> 06:07 PM) I think you're overvaluing the Bulls versus lower level teams. The Knicks only lost 12 more than the Bulls this year. Outside of Rose and maybe Noah, there's nothing that screams "Championship" about the Bulls that would make a free agent player accept a pay cut to join them. Sure, they could win 10 more games and get deeper into the playoffs maybe, but it's going to take more than Nowitzki, Boozer, or Lee to get anything more than that. They'd need a scoring threat from the guard position AND a power rebounder both to even sniff the Eastern Conference Finals. There's no way that Nowitzki leaves Dallas to #1 take a pay cut or #2 be part of a rebuild job. He'll want to go to a team that has more of a veteran presence where he can win it all sooner, rather than later. If the Bulls get Wade or LeBron PLUS one of Boozer/Bosh/A'mare, they can get there. Anyone less, doubtful. dude, knightni, i am in shock, i do not even know how to respond to that. how can you compare the bulls to the knicks talent. the best players suiting up for them is toney douglass and eddy curry? while we have d rose, noah, and deng? there is no guarantee that lebron would go to new york, and if he doesn't, no one in their right mind would go there to win a championship, and even if he does, the knicks were interested in pairing up lebron with bosh or dwade. miami could be a possible destination, but the bulls and heat has about the same record the past two years, and rose and noah is getting better, wade is in his prime, we have noah and gibson to take defensive assignments from dirk, the heat has beasley? and the pat riley has rumored to deal for boozer and amare before the trade deadline, and i assume they are more interested in them. the bulls, knicks, and heat are the only ones who can throw out big money and still offer a competitive team, given that knicks does sign lebron and heats keep wade. so am I making an overstatement to say the bulls are one of dirk's top choice if he opts out? and keep in mind, dirk is 31, he can still make a lot of money, you can't expect him to take a $10 mil pay cut to sign with a team like lakers, jazz, or nuggets for $8 million who are already true contenders. it's realistic to expect him to get a $18 mil contract if he wants to sign here. and i am not sure where you were during the bulls playoff run. derrick rose is still improving his perimeter game, yet he can already average 28 ppg against the Lebrons, noah avgs like 15 rpg, and gibson can easily get 7-8 rebounds, and we still need more scoring from the guard position, and rebounding from big men. if we do sign a big name free agent, we wont be stop there, we can still get a decent scoring guard for the right price. p.s. i was at game 3 at UC, the MVP chants were rose was pretty loud and sweet, that might be an overstatement right now, but ESPN already has him, along with durant and wade as challengers to lebron's reign next year.

QUOTE (knightni @ May 2, 2010 -> 05:45 PM) I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but rebounding is a skill that is primarily affected by who you play against, not what team you play for. This is why Rodman could rebound, not because he was on a good or bad team, but because his technique was better than anyone else's. Rodman was on the same team as David Robinson - a top rebounder himself - yet he out-rebounded him. He also out rebounded Rick Mahorn with the Pistons and anyone on the Bulls when he was in Chicago. Troy Murphy gets double-doubles with Danny Granger in Indiana, the same way he did with the guys in Golden State. David Lee and Carlos Boozer can get similar levels of rebounds and points with any team in the league just by playing the same way they always do. Ten to 12 rebounds and 12-15 points in garbage scoring is available to any big player with good technique that will put in the work on the court. i was not talking about his rebounding, i know that he is one of the top rebounders in the league. i was talking about his passing and scoring. he does not have a great post game, though he has developed a 18-20 foot jumper this season, and gets alot of baskets from offensive putbacks, ala noah. if he was to play for any team other than the knicks, he would not get 21-11-4 per game, i see more of a 14-9-2.5 for the bulls. he is not a true low post scorer like boozer, and if you are talking about defense, he might actually make boozer look like a dennis rodman. the bulls do not need a big man who has no post game, and get 12-14 points from garbage baskets, they already have noah, and to some extent taj gibson, boozer is the true low post scorer they are looking for.

QUOTE (WilliamTell @ May 2, 2010 -> 05:29 PM) I don't think Nowtizki leaves Dallas this offseason. Who's going to turn down 21 million if he's not getting 21 million from someone else? he has made plenty of $$ over his career, he is at the stage where he wants to win, and he wants to be at a place where he can have the best chance to win, yet still pays him a decent amount of money, dallas has proven not to be that place, and the bulls is one of the few teams that fits the bill. you can plenty of veterans taking a pay cut just to be on a championship caliber team, and with dirk, the bulls would be one. there is a chance he stays put, but according to his post game interview, he is really giving a though about leaving dallas.

QUOTE (knightni @ May 2, 2010 -> 05:25 PM) So, you'd be happy with 20 and 8 from a 35-36 year old guy making 20 mil a year and taking up cap space that could keep the Bulls from extending Noah and/or Rose? He'll be 32 this summer and 37 at the end of a 5 year deal. i am just speculating on his contract, he will probably get 18-20 mil a year the first year, with declining salary each salary, to like 15 mil a year in the final year. Why would the celtics take on garnett's contract for 15 mil a year for 14 and 8? and 15 mil for paul pierce for 18 and 4? if they play individually, they can get way better numbers, but they are surrounded by talents in which they dont have to do it all, but can get it done when call upon. as a bull, dirk would play with a perennial 22 ppg pg in rose, and 12 rpg center in noah, so he doesn't need to put up big numbers, in fact, anybody's number would be reduced if they are paired up with great players, look at kobe himself and kobe with shaq or gasol. plus, he fits the bill for what the bulls are looking for, so what is not to like about him?

but lee plays for the knicks, the east coast version of the warriors, it not hard to put up big numbers for them, look at monte ellis or al harrington for example. boozer may suck as D against a bynum or gasol, but that's because the jazz center is okur, who is equally as awful on defense, if boozer comes to the bulls, he doesn't need to take on the toughest big man assignment, we got noah and taj who are very solid big men defender in their own rite. reduced defensive assignment can also increase his offensive efficiency. this is a guy who shoots 52-53% regularly in his career, the bulls need a player who can get easy baskets, what is not to like about boozer.

QUOTE (knightni @ May 2, 2010 -> 04:59 PM) Productive, possibly. All-Star salary level? No. If he goes to free agency, some team is going to be on the hook for a 5 year deal worth so much that Hinrich and Deng will look like steals. If he's even averaging 20 points a game when he enters the 4th year of his deal, I'd be surprised. what would change if he is 34 years old? he is still 7 footer who plays the perimeter, a matchup nightmare for most teams, he can still shoot 90% from the foul line and 40% from threes, his game does not require him to outquick anybody, but use a variety of moves and pump fakes to get his shot off. look at his pal steve nash at age 36 still flying high with phoenix, larry bird still averages 20 and 10 at age 36, those are the types of player that ages well. if the bulls indeed gets dirk, all we need from him is 20 and 8 a night, hit some threes and get to the foul line. think about it, if the bulls had dirk in this playoffs, the cavs can not afford double rose and leave dirk open at the perimeter, or have no one to box out noah in the paint who eats the glass like a cookie monster, their only option is to run lebron at rose all game, which would definitely fatigue him and affect his efficiency on the offensive end. if dirk opts out this summer, he is the first player i will call up this summer if i were paxson, forget the wade, bosh (maybe not bron), and joe johnson is the second player i am after. give me dirk, and a player like matt barnes or martell webster who has the length and size to bang with lebron and can also shoot from distance, i really like our chances of knocking the cavs off in the playoffs.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 2, 2010 -> 04:36 PM) Here's my biggest worry with everyone other than Bosh, Lebron, and maybe maybe Wade (although he's already taken a beating) or Amare... "The team might not win championships immediately" If you sign Nowitzki, Boozer, the soon to be 29 year old Joe Johnson...then if your team doesn't win championships immediately...how long until they're on the road down hill? It's a couple years before Rose, Noah, Gibson are approaching/at "Peak Age" in the 25-27 range. Ditto Deng, who we're flat-out stuck with for now. by immediately i meant not immediately next year, but perhaps the season after the next. it takes time to develop chemistry, unless your the boston celtics. and rose and noah still needs a year to mature. dirk is a player whose skill set ages well, same goes for a shooter like JJ. because he relies on finesse not athleticism, there is no reason that dirk, noah, rose and deng can not win in 2012. but wade on the other hand turns 29 next season, relies much on athleticism and is and injury waiting to happen. so if i am the bulls, wade would not be my primary target, because he doesn't not fit in better than JJ or dirk does, and i wouldn't be discouraged at all if he stays put.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 2, 2010 -> 04:15 PM) If I added Duncan, Jordan, Shaq, and Hakeem to that list, from their primes...and then Isiah, Bird, Magic, and Dr. J, I think the only counter-example you can give me from the last 30 years...where a team won a title without a guy who legitimately should have been paid a max deal and more, without a guy you could consider in the top 10 in the league, is the 2004 Pistons. hat is not the point. I am just referring to your previous post that teams should not spend big money on second or even third options. i am not saying that teams don't need superstars to win, but superstars can't do it themselves, jordan needed pippen, duncan first won in 1999 when david robinson still makes tons of money, shaq had kobe then wade, bird had a great core around him, and you need to pay for for those players. of course d rose and lebron together will win a couple of titles, but if lebron is not available, then should the bulls really stop pursuing other players like you said because they can't win on their own, like JJ, amare, boozer, dirk? no. you still take your chance with a guy like JJ because he is a great player, perennial all star, he doesn't need to be a superstar, derrick rose is the face of the franchise. a team of rose, noah, and dirk or joe johnson will help the bull make a deep run every year. there is nothing wrong with paying JJ $15 mil a year and dirk $18-20 mil a year.