ChiSox59

Things are never worse than you thought they were going to be. Stop kidding yourself.

Gleyber is just more of what we have though. Right handed hitting below average defender that isn't great against RHP. I'd be fine with Gleyber if they also spent $ to fix the OF, but in a vaccum, I don't like him as a target at all. We are also in no position to be trading away Sean Burke who is the closest thing we have to SP depth after Martin.

I just don’t think the Sox really have many trade candidates on the MLB roster. Most of the guys are either at their lowest value after a poor or injury plagued season (Moncada, Eloy, Robert, Giolito), are major contributors to the MLB club (TA, Hendriks, Cease), or just have no value (Grandal, Kelly, Leury). Feels more like a Sox pushing their beat non-Montgomery and Colas minor league chips into the pot and trying to get the best LH OF bat they can find for it kinda off-season.

The fact that Clevinger has been a meaningfully better pitcher in his career than Boyd. Clevinger made 22 starts last year, Boyd 0. Expecting Boyd to provide 125+ innings in 23 after pitching 13 in 2022 is nuts.

Well thought out plan. I dig it. I too would prefer a different name in LF, but switch that to Conforto and I like it alot.

THis is not directed at you SS2k, but people comping the Clevinger and Boyd deals in terms of "value" are nuts. Boyd and Clevinger are exact same age. Boyd's career: 4.90 ERA, 4.66 FIP, 9.3 fWAR (797 IP)...only pitched 13 innigns in 2022, and zero starts. Has made only 27 starts since 2019. Clevinger career: 3.39 ERA, 4.0 FIP, 12.1 fWAR (656 IP)...pitched 113 innings in 2022 of with 4.33 ERA coming of 2nd TJS. Clevinger at $12M >>>>> Boyd at $10M

$10M for Boyd!?! Holy moly. Know he was good in SSS last year, but that’s crazy $.

Same people that are passionate about the 6 weeks we got from Elvis Andrus.

Really clinging to that Sox are maxed out bit, eh? Would that essentially be the offseason in your mind? That would result in Sox slashing payroll $25-30M from 2022.

I am in less of a hurry to trade our best reliever than others seem to be. Liams $14M is not exactly handicapping this team. If they turned around and signed Nimmo I could perhaps get behind it, but feels very robbing Peter to pay Paul. I certainly would want a lot more than a 26 YO outfielder who isn’t that highly regarded. Outman would be a solid secondary piece in that deal. That said, Liam’s elbow does concern me some and with what relief arms have gone for so far and there being no elite closers available, if you can get a nice package for him that solves other needs, it’d be hard to say no.

I am expecting a big trade this WM.

Covey. Then Adrian Nieto before that.

Yeah, but but but. He doesn’t respond to facts.

Cueto was literally awful since 2016. The Sox got incredibly lucky with him. Betting on him to repeat that success is insanely stupid. If we could sign him on the cheap, ya sure. But he’s probably going to get at least $7-10M, and rightfully so - he earned it. But adding him now is not in the budget and would have been an awful gamble. I’d much rather bet on Clevinger for 23 than Johnny.

Eloy hardly played any LF once Tony went away. When he did, he was run on at will. Hahn has already made comments about Eloy accepting his fate as being the primary DH moving forward. And the Sox aren’t going to nothing. They may not sign one of the LH OFs, but they’ll definitely acquire one somehow. They’re not just going to run it back with awful lineup balance and OF defense as you’re suggesting.

I am not missing any points. I don't really care that the Astros wanted Abreu. He's a fit there. They have a gaping hole at first base and payroll space. The Sox have neither. I won't sit here and say that I think the Sox have deployed their payroll in the most intelligent way, but they're payroll was higher than the Astros last year and they will be very comparable in 2023. Its not a matter of not spending money. The Sox have spent plenty. What lead us to this situation is sort of irrelevant at this point. The day the Sox draft Andrew Vaughn, they decided that AV was going to be their 1B of the future. When the Sox signed Abreu to the 3 year deal before 2020, they decided that they'd have to make things work in the interim. And they did; but it become obvious in 2022 that playing AV in the OF was not something they could continue to do. I am not defending the Sox FO. I think they've largely botched every major decision over the past 26 months. I also absolutely adore Jose Abreu. But the two just didn't fit any longer. The fact that the best team in the AL wanted him because he fit their roster better than ours doesn't really change any of that.

FIFY

I do not agree in the slightest. This team is not better paying Abreu $20M in his decline phase and playing a comparable bat that is an awful OF in the OF to keep Abreu on the roster. If you want to ignore the reality of the situation, sure having Abreu is better than not. But, circumstance is fairly important in this instance.

Fair enough. But AV in his natural position at $700k >>>>>>>>>>> Abreu on a 3/$58.5M deal for this team, all things considered. I struggle to understand how anyone could disagree with that.

I was responding to this post from @T R U. But yes, you're right. Its not fascinating because it makes little sense when you take a step back and put everything into consideration. The FO put themselves in a position that retaining Abreu simply was not a realistic option. Be mad at them for that, if you'd like. But once the bed was made, Abreu just had no role on this team moving forward. We couldn't spend our limited budget in 23 and another RH hitting 1B/DH. Its not hard to wrap your head around.

For 27.85x the cost. That is what matters. The Sox can get similar production for 3.5% of the cost AND improve their OF defense measurably while doing it by putting AV at his natural position. The "I don't understand how the Sox can move on from Abreu" crowd is fascinating to me.

So what do you suggest, Mr Logan?

Did the video review guy get canned or reassigned? Hope so cuz that dude is awful at his job.

We also don't solve a lack of lineup balance at all, Gleyber is not a good 2B, and we now have a horrific bullpen. Gleyber also is due around $10M in arb, so not exactly cheap either. I guess if you turn around and sign Nimmo I like it a bit better, but removing our best 2 relievers and then a guy that at least has a great arm and track record and should rebound to at least being serviceable....the pen would be awful.

Well, he's gone. So there's that.