ChiSox59

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 23, 2016 -> 11:19 AM) I suspect that a "king's ransom" was never offered; just some FO guy termed a mediocre offer that. I don't see the point in trading Abreu and I think the chances of that happening are close to zero.

QUOTE (HeGone7 @ Jul 22, 2016 -> 11:48 AM) This is the stuff that drives me nuts. You're 100% correct that those two, in particular, suck. But your comment/opinion is so far off-base. If the Sox are selling, you're acquiring "Elite prospects" in my eyes. Guys who are top 10, 20, 30 and in some cases 40 overall in baseball. But something about them is ELITE. Most of them would come from Sale and Q deals, I pray somehow they can max out value on Frazier, Robertson, Abreu and Eaton to at least get 1 guy on that level. Those guys being acquired, in most cases, are guys who have proven success in the minors or college and are ready for the show. Their chances of not panning out are still there but far less. The expectation is this guy's floor is still a serviceable mlb player. Their peak are guys like Bryant, Fernandez, etc. That is the goal here. There is a major difference between the guys up at the top of those lists and the guys at the bottom. You'll always have guys who don't pan out, but if you want to build a real contender...The Trouts, Harpers, Strasberg's etc come from the top. That is what you're attacking when you're selling these types of talents. Davidson was never remotely in that realm. I think his highest ranking was mid-70's. Which is a good prospect but it also tells you a lot. When you talk about Davidson and using him as an example for what the Sox should do, you're comparing the chances at acquiring a Machado to acquiring a Zach Cozart. I used Cozart because he actually is playing well, and that's what you hope when you get a guy like him, but it requires far more development. He'll also never be on the same planet as Machado and there is a higher risk of not panning out - like a Davidson. Garcia is in the same boat. Very flawed prospect. Detroit loved him, which is great, but no one else seemingly did. He reminds me of Lyle Mouton. This big guy with hype and couldn't hit the ball out of the park if he hit from 2nd base. I fully expect the Sox to get several of these types of players if they sell. Which isn't a bad thing if they get a handful of elite prospects. Then you aren't relying on those Davidson's to save your farm/franchise. But the core of what you're acquiring needs to be proven commodities on other teams. Prospects who have dominated, not played well/ok and show promise. Not guys with one pitch and nothing else. You're getting guys like Urias who ceiling is an ace and floor appears to be a middle rotation arm. My biggest fear is the Sox go after the wrong talent at the top. The 5 tool guys that have been a staple of Kenny Williams failures. If you do, his biggest strength better be his bat because we struggle developing offense. Guys who hit the ball with regularity, and do it well, and can play good defense. Load up with bats. I don't care if the guy has an 80 for speed or 80 for an arm. I want the guys who can play. My other concern is you get too young of players who we are forced to develop. Too much can go wrong in that timespan. The younger they are, the less sample size you have, the higher the risk. San Diego did the right thing for them. They dealt a guy who never has thrown 100 innings, cost them nothing to acquire, and they went boom or bust on a young highly talented arm. The Sox need to be acquiring that same caliber arm AFTER he has proven himself, developed secondary stuff and is ready to come up. That is the major difference here. Some of those guys will likely come in trades, but they just can't be what you're banking on to resurrect the franchise. But back to the original point, you can't look at the past failures of the Sox acquisitions because most of them were what they could get for what they dealt. We got Avi for Peavy, who was 32, declining and frankly sucked 3 of 4 years here. We got Davidson for Reed, who was a 1 year wonder basically as a closer. This time is a whole different animal. You're selling very good/star players in their primes for several "can't miss" type guys who will be on your roster in 2016 or 2017. Maybe 2018 latest. The middle-tier Davidsons that round out packages hopefully are guys you hope pan out, or they get moved for an MLB player when the time is right. I didn't read this whole message, but you sort of lost me at trading Eaton and Abreu. That makes literally no sense. Eaton is the kind of guy we need more of, and we have him locked up long term and cheap. Same could have been said about Jose coming into this year, but the man is still a huge bargain and you don't trade him when his value is lowest.

QUOTE (WBWSF @ Jul 22, 2016 -> 11:02 AM) Maybe Hahn will fool us and trade Carlos Rodon for some hitting. I would like to think he would bring something decent in return. I would rather see Rodon traded than Sale or Quintana. He should be able to bring back as equally as touted bat, I would think.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jul 22, 2016 -> 11:20 AM) That's so weird as there were stories 4 years ago that KW wanted to rebuild but JR told him no. This. I think it's always been a JR thing, more than a KW thing.

QUOTE (Dunt @ Jul 20, 2016 -> 09:33 PM) Just so everyone has a clear idea of the value of Quintana, Cole Hamels and Jake Diekman were traded last year for 3 top 100 prospects (Thompson, Williams, and Alfaro), a MLB starting pitcher (Harrison), and a solid young MLB starter (Eickhoff). Since Q has become a full-time starter, he's been worth 2 more fWAR than Hamels and would have an extra years worth of control. That is the baseline for a Q trade. If you want to talk Sale, better be ready to push all your chips into the center of the table. Neither should be or will be cheap and the Sox are in no rush to get rid of either. Plus half the price of Hamels.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 22, 2016 -> 07:11 AM) A 2-1 game in the 7th should be a game that can be suspended if the teams are playing the next day. Rules need to be looked at again. Anyway, if the Sox lose tonight, they go 23-10, then 23-40. Agreed. It's a damn shame to lose a game that way.

I think if you trade Sale, you may as well move Q as well since this team is gonna suck for a while. It's more likely they trade Q and keep Sale, IMO. But I doubt that happens either. Besides those 2, Rodon, Anderson, Eaton and Jones everyone should be on the table - just don't think you're going to get anything earth shattering back, and are likely punting 2017 by doing it.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jul 21, 2016 -> 09:39 PM) Look at the stats. They're ugly. Very ugly. Abreu's OPS+ is 103 this season. He is still a good hitter, but unfortunately a shell of his 2014-self. To call him one of the worst players on the team is just dumb.

I have a hard time seeing the Sox sell off major pieces if they're within a couple games of .500. It's just not their way of doing business. Now, if they continue to play as they have since the ASB, then perhaps they'll make a few moves prior to the deadline.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jul 21, 2016 -> 07:18 PM) It is hard to imagine that they would trade both Sale and Quintana. How would they rebuild a starting rotation, with both of those arms gone? One of them does indeed make sense, if they can fill several holes, in return. I'm still leaning toward trading one of them and a few veteran offensive players, such as Frazier. The Sox would require at least one MLB ready arm in both a Sale and Quintana trade, as well as several other pieces. So they'll plug those spots. If you trade Sale and Q, competing is out the window and you give your new guys a shot.

QUOTE (Soxnfins @ Jul 21, 2016 -> 04:27 PM) You want to know what would be such a White Sox move? Trade Fulmer for Lucroy, whom is conviently out of the lineup for he Brew Crew tonight. Hahn said today he won't be making any short term upgrades to the roster.

QUOTE (miracleon35th @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 01:42 PM) Too much is made about "making the playoffs." I would much rather not make the playoffs than get in as a wold card and lose the elimination game, or make the playoffs and get swept and humiliated in four games by the Mets. Lol, wAt!?!!

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 06:54 PM) I haven't looked at his numbers this season so is he worth Fulmer? Probably. I wouldn't want to give up Fulmer, but I wouldn't lose my s*** if the Sox made that trade. I like Fulmer and all, but I don't see him as a future frontline guy really. I'd try like hell to make a package the Rox would take without him, but Blackmon is a very good player and probably worth 1 top 60 type prospect.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 06:36 PM) I'll be pissed if we're giving up Fulmer for Blackmon. Just doesn't do much for me. I know he doesn't play center but is Blackmon a better option than Reddick? If I'm moving Fulmer, I want an elite bat. Or more impactful than Blackmon. He's better than you're giving him credit for.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 05:27 PM) I'm sad about Jose. Honestly I think he's older than 28. He moves, looks and now hits like he's past 30. Kinda sucks. Jose has been fairly disappointing since 2014, but he remains a very good hitter that is a tremendous bargain. He is paid like a league average player and is much better than that. I hope this isn't the new Abreu and he's just in a funk, but even if it, Abreu isn't the problem.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 03:38 PM) I seriously do not have any clue who is on our roster anymore. he was only on the 40 man.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 02:40 PM) Well, for me if I'm unpacking Fulmer I want a bigger bang for my buck player. Solid, underrated, and under team control for 2.5 years is good but with the limited assets this team has to move I'd be disappointed in that return. Basically ask yourself this - does Fulmer straight up for Blackmon make this team the strongest contender for the Wild Card this year and put them in a position to make a run at Cleveland? If your answer is no, then that's not a good use of Fulmer. The multiple years of control is nice...but they'll be needing to find another pitcher to control for multiple years if they move him so that is a major downside come next offseason. Don't get me wrong, I want the Sox to hold onto Fulmer, but when he's legitimately your only blue chip trade prospect (not including guys on the 25 man), its going to be tough to get an elite offensive player without giving him up. Now, is Blackmon elite? Not really, but he's a very, very good ballplayer. I am not endorsing a Fulmer-Blackmon swap, only stating that I don't see the Rox doing it for less. Hope I am wrong there.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 01:59 PM) Well he's not a good enough performer that you'd unpack Fulmer for him, normally you might think about a guy in the ~5 range in a solid system I'd guess but none of those guys are tradeable for the Sox since they were all just drafted. Maybe you could put together some package of 2-3 guys that the Rockies like who are lower ranked? I see absolutely zero reason why the Rox would trade Blackmon for anything short of Fulmer or Anderson (obviously isn't getting traded). I doubt an Adams, Engel/May, Gurrero type package would be enough to trade a vastly underrated offensive player under control for 2.5 years.

Blackmon would be pretty sweet, but he's not gonna be cheap.

QUOTE (gosoxgo2005 @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 11:05 AM) This guy doesn't seem very credible. You'd be wrong. He's nailed just about everything this year.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 10:58 AM) Maybe the fact that his is making $1.5 million and hasn't dominated AAA makes his getting through waivers pretty simple. Or maybe they keep him around and work him out of the bullpen. That is sorta what I am thinking (regarding bullpen). Or maybe they are happy to save the ~$750k if someone does claim him.

Remember when people wanted to trade Quintana for him? Gah, what a bad trade that would have been.

QUOTE (chisoxfan310 @ Jul 13, 2016 -> 01:31 PM) I like that Gomez idea. Definitely the type of deal this team would make as opposed to signing someone else to a big deal. Me too. Buying Gomez on the cheap would be nice. 1 year deal with an option. Or even 1 year deal, and recoup a pick in a year if he's any good. Doubt the Sox will be the only team doing that though.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 10, 2016 -> 09:23 PM) Morneau didn't play at Charlotte or for BIRM. What happened? Thought he was going to get one final day of AB's on Sunday? Sent him home to spend time with his family one day early...before Friday's action started back up? Planned day off. Will be in action w Birmingham tomorrow.

Need to get these next two. Braves are not a good baseball team. Teheran is tough. Hopefully they get him early.