Lip Man 1

Better yet DFA him ?

COVID had nothing to do with them cancelling last winter, seven months ago.

A.J. on his podcast today brought up the fact that they cancelled it last year without any real reasons.

Have been listening to A.J.'s podcast the past few days. You can tell he's really shocked and pissed off at what is going on. Had both Rosenthal and Rogers on to talk about the situation and how it has turned to chaos.

Ed Herrmann told me the story at being at Sox Fantasy Camp in 2004. JR was there have a discussion with the campers. Let's just say those campers were so angry at him that things started to get heated and physical. Ed said Bill Melton had to get between them and cool things down.

"If there’s one thing we know about Reinsdorf, it’s not just that he sticks to his guns. It’s that he thinks he invented guns. His way, then, is always the right way." https://chicago.suntimes.com/2023/8/9/23826210/on-white-sox-jerry-reinsdorf-when-an-owner-doesnt-want-to-own-up-to-anything-rick-hahn-tim-anderson

September 26, 2011 – He was considered the face of the franchise for eight seasons but on this night after a 4-3 win over Toronto, manager Ozzie Guillen announced he was leaving after owner Jerry Reinsdorf agreed to let him out of the final year of his contract. Guillen, who was the 1985 A.L. Rookie of the Year with the White Sox, won the World Series in 2005 and also got the club into the playoffs in 2008. He had five winning seasons in the eight years as manager and was named Manager of the Year for his work in 2005. In that magical season of 2005, “Ozzie Ball” resulted in the Sox getting off to the best start in their history and with a perfect blend of pitching, speed, power and the ability to execute the fundamentals the Sox were in first place from wire to wire. Then they blitzed through the post season putting together an 11-1 record that was the third best post season record in baseball history. Guillen’s passion and enthusiasm for the franchise was unparalleled but at times he was his own worst enemy. Over his final years in Chicago, he became increasingly thin-skinned and defensive when criticism was directed his way and he lashed out at Sox fans on more than one occasion. Among his famous rants against the fans were one where he said that they could ‘‘Turn off their TVs and stop watching the game if they don’t like the [bleep]ing lineup’’ and another in May 2011 where he claimed Sox fans would not remember him, “As soon as you leave the ballpark, they don’t care about you. They don’t. The monuments, the statues…they pee on them when they get drunk.” On the afternoon of the day he left the team Guillen told reporters that he would not want to return to fulfill his 2012 contract unless he got an extension and more money. Ozzie’s relationship with G.M. Kenny Williams also deteriorated over the final few years because the two men appeared to have different viewpoints over how the roster should be constructed and the style to which the Sox should play. The Jim Thome/DH controversy was an example of the different ideas. Guillen’s family didn’t help the situation with social media comments derogatory to Williams. Many felt when Ozzie was hired in November 2003 that he was the right man for the right team at the right time and for a few years he was. Unfortunately, the manager with the longest tenure since Al Lopez let some personal foibles override a good situation and it was best for all that a parting of the ways took place.

Supposedly that's on the table when MLB expands but it is not likely to go away.

August 9, 1977 - In a game at Comiskey Park, the Sox crushed Seattle 13-3. In the game the “South Side Hit Men” clouted six home runs, three in the third inning alone. Third baseman Eric Soderholm had two. August 9, 2000 - The Sox had one of their highest scoring games in history as they buried the Mariners 19-3 at Comiskey Park. Pitcher Mike Sirotka was the recipient of the onslaught and got the easy win. Frank Thomas went 3 for 4 on the night with two home runs and five RBI’s. August 9, 2021 – One night after Sox outfielder/DH Eloy Jimenez homered twice and drove in five runs at Wrigley Field, he did it again at Target Field in Minnesota as part of the Sox 11-1 win. He became the first player in franchise history to have two home runs and five RBI’s in consecutive games. The pair of long balls also brought Jimenez to 50 in his career in just 187 games, which was the fastest in team history. August 9, 2022 – The White Sox injury situation which had gutted the organization at all levels since around 2016 turned from the sublime to the ridiculous as between games of a double header in Kansas City, the Sox announced that All-Star shortstop Tim Anderson would miss six weeks, in the middle of a divisional race, after he suffered a sagittal band tear on the middle finger of his left (non-throwing) hand and would need surgery. He suffered the injury on a checked swing in Texas a few days before, in his last at-bat, in an 8-0 blowout loss. Anderson, one of the most talented players in the game, like many of the White Sox players, just hadn’t been able to escape injuries, going on the injured list every season he’s been with the team often times more than once in a season.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/five-reasons-the-al-central-has-become-mlbs-weakest-division-from-player-development-to-payrolls/

He does want to win but as I've pointed out before he wants to win HIS WAY. Big difference and the results show it.

A combination of a terrible offense that doesn't score a lot and a pitching staff that gives up big innings.

You're assuming Hahn is telling the truth about it being a position player. He very well may be; but Middleton's comment specifically said 'pitcher in the bullpen' and since he's usually there all the time (since he isn't a starter) he should know. The two comments simply don't add up, somebody is lying.

A pretty good recap quoting the different people involved in the chaos: https://www.southsidesox.com/2023/8/8/23824191/time-anderson-suspended-six-games-amid-day-of-chaos-white-sox-organization-keynan-middleton-rogers

Speaking of Ozzie. Some interesting and direct quotes: https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/white-sox/ct-chicago-white-sox-ozzie-guillen-pedro-grifol-20230808-7mt3ixfsrbhdzgo4lgr65lerj4-story.html

Absolutely...BUT it's no longer "make or break" like it was back in the 1950's, 60's and 70's, It's a part of the overall health of a franchise but it is no longer the main part, not any longer.

More like thigh pads.

Again attendance is important but not as important as it was the outside revenue sources both domestic and international have never been higher now that MLB is a 10 billion dollar industry.

August 8, 1914 - The Sox purchased the contract of outfielder Oscar “Happy” Felsch from Milwaukee for $19,000 dollars. Felsch, an outstanding glove man and hitter, would become part of history by his participation in the 1919 “Black Sox” scandal which ended his career when he was banned for life due to his involvement in it. August 8, 1976 - With the Sox in last place and going nowhere owner Bill Veeck pulled out another wacky promotion. For the first time a Major League team played a game wearing shorts as the Sox beat the Royals 5-2 at Comiskey Park in the first game of a double header. The Sox would wear shorts two other times, both against the Orioles on August 21 and 22. The Sox record in the three games was 2-1; maybe they should have worn them more often since they finished the season with 97 losses! No other big-league team has worn them since. August 8, 1977 – He was arguably the best manager in the history of the franchise. Al Lopez took his place in the Hall of Fame on this day. Lopez managed the Sox from 1957 to 1965 coming over after the Indians fired him. He also managed in parts of the 1968 and 1969 seasons. Lopez compiled 840 wins and a win percentage of .564. He won the 1959 A.L. pennant, had three consecutive seasons from 1963 to 1965 where the Sox averaged 96 wins and had five second place finishes. He worked a game through his assistant coaches and emphasized fundamentals and if a player didn’t perform… he didn’t play… period. August 8, 1994 - With time running out for labor peace, Sports Illustrated put Frank Thomas on the cover along with future Sox outfielder Ken Griffey Jr. The caption stated, “Top Guns. Frank Thomas and Ken Griffey Jr. Two powerful reasons to keep playing ball.” Their plea would fall on deaf ears as the following week, baseball shut down ending the season. August 8, 2021 – The White Sox put on a show for a national TV audience on ABC Sunday Night Baseball by pounding the Cubs 9-3 and sweeping the weekend series at Wrigley Field. The game marked the first regular season baseball broadcast by that network since August 1995. The Sox jumped out early hammering three first inning home runs by Tim Anderson, Eloy Jimenez and Andrew Vaughn. It was the first time the Sox hit three first inning home runs on the road in franchise history. Jimenez would go 3 for 4 with two runs scored, five RBI’s and a pair of home runs against his old organization.

I posted links from stories that have his quotes in the thread titled recapping the day.

And finally Jim Margalus of Sox machine with his usual detailed in-depth analysis: https://soxmachine.com/2023/08/keynan-middleton-blasts-white-sox-and-he-cant-be-ignored/

True but this year he seems to have gotten worse, I mean seven more tonight.

Exactly and Middleton doubled down on his comments tonight, he didn't back away from them.

And Paul Sullivan of the Tribune takes a look at the strangeness today: https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/white-sox/ct-chicago-white-sox-culture-jerry-reinsdorf-rick-hahn-20230808-r7evzirz5fdkrhozekttilmp4i-story.html

That remains to be seen doesn't it? If I had to bet, I'd wager he returns for next year which is supposedly the final year of his deal again as G.M.