Lip Man 1

QUOTE (greg775 @ Feb 21, 2017 -> 10:56 PM) Baseball has a serious problem with length of games. Depends on who you talk to. I don't have a problem with it at all and yet again ask the question why is this a "problem" for baseball but no one, NO ONE complains when an NFL game (which has just as little action between plays) often runs 3:15 to 3:30...and in the post season it runs longer. And if baseball has an issue with fan support (including kids) why do they keep setting attendance records every year? Mark

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Feb 21, 2017 -> 09:09 PM) I don't like this, but for a different reason. There are very rare cases where a pitcher is attempting to intentionally walk a batter, but instead throws a wild pitch, or the hitter swings, or somebody (ex: Miguel Cabrera, 2006) gets an RBI knock off an attempted intentional walk. Sure, these cases happen very rarely, but they impact the games greatly when they do happen; eliminating the formality of throwing the four balls prevents them from ever happening, which, in my opinion, is wrong. Examples: Johnny Bench 1972 World Series and Rod Carew. Just a stupid idea. Mark

Mark Gonzales told me the perfect Swisher story. When he was struggling in the second half with the Sox and Ken Griffey Jr. tried to help him around the batting cage, he blew him off. Ken Griffey... Mark

This will be very interesting to watch. Mark

QUOTE (Two-Gun Pete @ Feb 12, 2017 -> 11:40 AM) (Look, I respect you, & I think you're a good poster, but) nor Ilitch deserve praise as owners of their MLB clubs, in all honesty, IMO. I disagree with this comment. Ilitch did everything he could to get the Tigers into position to get to and win the World Series. They had a very nice run for five or six years under him. Paid top dollar to get the best players and was aggressive in many facets of trying to get the best talent. Mark

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 12, 2017 -> 09:41 AM) JR isn't a saint he is not by far the best owner in the league but he isn't evil incarnate who has single handedly destroyed the White sox organization either. What he did is not a felony crime. What he has done is try different ways to keep baseball from becoming a "he has the most money wins." And again it wasn't Ed DeBartolo who committed a felony crime. Just saying. Regarding the most money comment, JR's desire to destroy the MLBPA and impose his idea of a salary structure failed miserably, cost MLB a lot in 94-95 and neutered his own team's chances of potentially getting to the World Series. To me that doesn't sound like a solid business plan. But that's just me. JR like everyone has had an interesting life and controversial run as owner. He's done some things everyone can be proud of (including his substantial charitable contributions) but he's also done some things that make you wonder 'what was he thinking?' This comment when he took over the team turned out to be very prophetic: Jerry Reinsdorf was a “source of intrigue” and in the future could become a “source of controversy.” –From a story by reporter Linda Kay, Chicago Tribune January 30, 1981. Mark

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 11, 2017 -> 06:19 PM) Was there already a plan for the future of the Tigers and Wings? The trainer here at Idaho State is from Michigan and is a huge Tigers / Red Wings fan. He told me today that the son was already basically running the Red Wings in a transitional period and that he figured to do the same with the Tigers. It will be interesting to see where those two franchises go moving forward. Detroit still has a few major, monster contracts to players who are still productive but getting older. Mark

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 11, 2017 -> 08:10 PM) Is this the same DeBartolo who was forced to give up the 49ers due to being convicted of a felony for bribing government officials for gambling licenses? One thing sure sure is that the ownership wouldn't have lasted long as he would've been forced to sell the sox as well. Maybe the MLB owners knew enough not to allow him to buy it. That was his son. The sale to the father was turned down for some reasons that were a little nebulous at best. The owners and commissioner Bowie Kuhn felt that DeBartolo had "connections" to underworld characters, had gambling /interests, wasn't actually living in Chicago and couldn't be relied upon in their opinions. In fact the Galbraith family who owned the Pirates and George Steinbrenner had horse racing interests and owned race tracks. DeBartolo said he would move 20% of his business interests to Chicago and promised he would spend a certain amount of time in the city. That fell on deaf ears. Later after the Sox signed Floyd Bannister to what was considered a huge contract for it's time, Steinbrenner publicly said that he "regretted" not voting for DeBartolo. So the dad then used his resources to buy the 49'ers...and win a bunch of Super Bowls. Mark

He certainly did everything he could to win the World Series for the Tigers. Remember he also owned the Red Wings and they were very successful too. Seemed like everything you wanted in an owner...money was never an issue, excuse or impediment. Mark

Hard to predict anything right now with guys still out there to be traded before opening day. So for right now, as of this moment, 73 wins. Mark

QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Feb 8, 2017 -> 11:51 AM) That was the most losses, but not the lowest winning percentage. Depends on what you consider "the worst season" I guess. Mark

QUOTE (greg775 @ Feb 7, 2017 -> 11:39 PM) I wonder what the worst record in franchise history is. I think we'll be right around the worst team in Sox history this year and next. Next year will probably be the low water mark of the rebuild. I'd say 59 wins? Then maybe 57 the following year? In 1970 the Sox went 56-106, most losses ever in a season and they drew 495,000 fans for it. Had three managers that season. Mark

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 31, 2017 -> 10:02 AM) Paul Goldschmidt couldn't turn the DBacks into contenders on his own. I think the setup with Moncada is this: if he were to bust or get injured, it is a 2 year setback in rebuilding at the very least. You name guys like Collins, Joel Booker - those are guys who are 2 or more years behind Moncada, who should be tearing up AAA this year and hopefully ready for a brief stint at the end of the season. The other guys will be in A-ball and AA, and if they're up in 2019 that means they were pushed rapidly through levels and you probably expect them to need more big league development time. Hopefully we'll add some more big league ready pieces when Quintana goes, but if Moncada does not become a top of the league player, we will be unlikely to have the ability to find equivalent talent out of our system any time soon. How will we come up with that? 2 ways - wait 2-3 years longer so that other draft picks can work their way through, or....move Rodon and start this again. I'd be very, very surprised if Rodon isn't moved in a few years. His agent is going to take him to free agency when the time comes and the Sox probably (unless their is new ownership in place) aren't going to be willing to meet the price he will be demanding. Mark

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Jan 30, 2017 -> 06:19 PM) There will be some benefits to having them gone, plus Robin. Now it wont make up for their on field production but in some ways the Sox will be better next year just because they got rid of those two. It's called "addition by subtraction" but in all fairness those are two very, very good players who were traded. Unfortunate situation brought on by the front office's inability to put a competitive team around them but under the circumstances they didn't have much of a choice, they had to do something to get out of the rut. Mark

Nice solid recap of the events and a good way to summarize the "plan" going forward. Mark

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Jan 25, 2017 -> 06:48 PM) Uh, noooooooo. Not ready to "trust" the Sox' brain trust just yet. Don't forget, the reason for the need for this rebuild is the abject failure of the team at both the Major and minor league level the past eight years for which the current front office is responsible. "Trust" is the last thing they've earned. Now "guarded optimism", based on the encouraging early results of the rebuild, that feels the more appropriate approach to take with this front office. Reasonable comment and way to look at things in my opinion. Mark

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 10:16 AM) This is going to be a strange rebuild. I know this board has people who love prospects and the process of rebuilding, but the reality is that very few people care about stuff like that until the team actually starts winning. At major league prices I would imagine attendance will be at an all time low the next few seasons. The Sox have been among the bottom feeding teams in MLB attendance-wise for the past several years. This won't be an issue (especially not with the money pouring in to teams from various means). Seriously in my mind there is no difference between being 27th in the league in attendance or 29th. If you aren't in the top 10 or top 15 it really doesn't matter, your attendance simply is not good. But another point is if you think attendance would improve if the Sox trotted out the same philosophy and stunk up the joint by July again. And nothing, NOTHING will beat the Sox drawing 495,000 fans FOR THE SEASON in 1970 after three straight terrible years and the social unrest of the 1960's (which led to the belief that Comiskey Park was in a "dangerous place...") If the Sox could survive that, they can survive anything. And coincidentally what did they do as soon as that season ended? They traded their two best players and went into a rebuild mold. (Granted, Roland Hemond can and did run rings around Kenny and Rick as a G.M.) Mark

QUOTE (WBWSF @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 08:02 AM) They can call it a rebuild, I call it a train wreck. They have nobody in the farm system to help their every day lineup at 3B, Catcher, Dh, and all 3 outfield positions. This so called REBUILD has all the potential of lasting for many years. 2013, 2014, 2015 and 2016 were also train wrecks...seven out of the last 10 seasons have been train wrecks. They weren't going to spend 150 million to sign the "best" free agents in poor classes this year and next...not with this ownership. So what EXACTLY did you think they would do or could do? I'd like to hear your plan. And please don't start with the tired notion of "well JR can sell the team..." because in point of fact, (yet again) unless his health suddenly goes south HE IS NOT SELLING in the next few years. Like it or not, that's reality. This was the best option in a difficult situation (created a lot by the Sox themselves...granted.) Can we please move on from this...finally...please????????????????????????????????????????? Oh, here's a hint for you..."rebuilds" usually DO take years. Better get used to it. Mark

I asked Bill specifically about that game and he said he kept getting guys out, kept going back to the dugout where Al would ask him how he was feeling and if he was OK. Bill said he felt fine and thought he could keep getting guys out...and he did. Mark

QUOTE (flavum @ Jan 20, 2017 -> 11:07 AM) Two bad things about the 1959 White Sox: Billy Pierce had a down year by his standard. Minnie Minoso was on the Indians. Billy had a hip injury that season which forced him to miss about a month if I remember correctly. Mark

Paul Konerko was a very good player for a long time but in my opinion is simply not a Hall of Famer. I'd put Mark Buehrle in that same category. The former White Sox players who deserve to be in the Hall and aren't are: 1. Billy Pierce. A DOMINANT pitcher for over a decade and along with Whitey Ford and Warren Spann the best left handed pitchers in baseball in the 1950's. 2. Minnie Minoso. A great outfielder both offensively and defensively. The Jackie Robinson of Latin players who unlike Jackie, also had the language barrier to overcome. 3. Tommy John 4. Jim Kaat 5. Dick Allen The following are the stories that I wrote for the Chicago Baseball Museum going into the numbers and explaining why some of those I listed should be in: http://www.chicagobaseballmuseum.org/files...ce-20141121.pdf http://www.chicagobaseballmuseum.org/files...tt-20141203.pdf Mark

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 9, 2017 -> 09:13 AM) Funny enough while we had more dead last rankings we also had 3 top 5 finishes in the AL for runs scored. 2006, 2008, 2012. Three of the last four winning seasons for the franchise as well. 2010 being the lone exception. Mark

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 5, 2017 -> 06:13 PM) Jeesh, people are down on this guy. I hope scouts don't view the guy the way some folks tend to view him by just looking at his year-end WAR totals. The guy has shown the ability to absolutely mash for extended periods of time, including against elite pitching. The entirety of his body of work has basically included his experience of leaving Cuba and transitioning to life in the US, and to playing professional ball at the highest level. I tend to think he has handled things quite well, all things considered. Jose is absolutely the LAST guy on this team I have a desire to move, considering his skillset, his demeanor, the way he goes about his business, etc. He is a consummate professional and an outstanding role model for our young players, particularly our young spanish-speaking players. That being said, should the guy pick up where he left off in the second half last year, one would think he should absolutely bring back a few top prospects should bats be in demand come July. Jose has a lot of good things going for him. However he needs to be a fulltime DH (regardless of if he likes it or not) and stay off the field. Guy is an absolute butcher with a glove. However with the Sox rebuilding it doesn't really matter. If he is still around when the Sox become contenders, he needs to make that move. Mark

QUOTE (kwill @ Jan 5, 2017 -> 05:22 PM) I've seen rumors around every White Sox big name player except Jose Abreu. I know most on this forum believe the right approach would be to hold onto him until the All Star Break and swap him in another large trade for prospects. What do you believe his value is currently? Abreu's War has decreased all three years from 5.3 WAR-2014,3.0 WAR-2015, and 1.6-2016. Obviously, He had a terrible first half of the year but it did seem like he figured some things out in the later half. There is some good things too like his K% dropped last year by 3 points and his walk rate went up 1.6% from 2015. He is only 30 years old at the beginning of the season so one would think that he would have 4-5 above average years left in his bat. He is under team control for 3 year but still in arbitration so probably something like 3/38. It is interesting as you can compare like Edwin Encarcion get a 3/60 million dollar deal with the Indians at the age of 34. To be fair, Encarcion has been a 4 win player for 5 years in a row. One would think though that Abreu has close to the same value as a decrease in production should be expected for Encarcion. To go along with my question, Do you think if Abreu hit the free agent market this year he would have received a higher or lower offer than Encarcion? The second thought I had when reading the New CBA is it could be valuable to have Abreu around as a recruiting source for Cuban players. if I am reading correctly ( please correct if not), each ream will be allowed 5-6 million dollars and will be capped. If this is the case this will prevent teams like the Dodgers and Yankees from hoarding the best international players with money. It could be valuable to have both the best young player( Moncada) and another respected Cuban on the same team. http://www.sbnation.com/2016/12/1/13806488...ment-luxury-tax What would you expect in a trade back for Abreu if traded right now? Mine would be 1-top 50 prospect, 1-Top 150 prospect and 1 lottery ticket. I think there was reported interest from the Rockies at one time before they signed Desmond. Mark

As someone who is in the business and does play by play (and is also a White Sox fan / historian) I can certainly appreciate Hawk's passion and love for the team. However its clear at 75 he is no longer sharp, certainly not what he was even 10 years ago. That's not his fault, its the human condition. However Hawk's ego I think refuses to understand that time waits for no one. He needs to call it a well deserved day, appreciate what he's done for the franchise and step aside gracefully. Over and above the diminished skills, there's the long periods of silence when things are going bad (even though the game is still going on), the uneasy relationships with a number (not just Stone) of his broadcast partners over the years (let's not forget why Paciorek left), the haranguing of umpires (certainly deserved at times but very unprofessional. You can get the point across about bad calls, bad umpires without being petty and vindictive) Hawk can't or won't recognize these shortcoming. He won't even try to adjust and correct them. It comes down to ego and he's got a big one. And to be fair there are very few folks in the business who don't have some ego, that's one of the reasons they got into it in the first place. Bottom line though is that for good or bad, like him or not, as long as JR owns the team and as long as he wants to work, he'll have a job. I just hope that I've got the good sense to know when its my time, to face it honestly and admit I simply don't have it anymore on the level that I work. Mark