Lip Man 1

Valid point to be sure but just for discussion sake let's say the four guys are OK offensively...surround them with crap for the other five lineup spots (which is what the Sox had) and the four guys would each have to put up MVP-type numbers for said offense to be any good. Obviously that didn't happen. Sox had way to many automatic outs in the lineup.

The dumpster diving world which what the Sox generally do.

Isn't there a complete section for talking non-Sox baseball? That's where you go to laugh at the Cubs collapse, or talk about the Rangers, Orioles, Cardinals or anybody else in MLB. This section is for talking Sox baseball and you are exactly correct, they are terrible.

Different players have different roles. Guys in the middle of a good batting order are expected to drive in runs, getting on base a lot, and note I said a lot, shouldn't be the primary focus. That's ideally for the numbers 1-2-7-8-9 in a good lineup. Guys hitting 3-4-5-6 should be driving in runs be it with a home run or an extra base hit or getting guys home with less than two outs productively. .

JR is probably going to form his own network with the Bulls and hawks when the NBC Sports Chicago contract ends next year. He'll join organizations like the Yankees/Nets (YES) and the Cubs (Marquee)

Without RBI's, you don't score...without scoring you don't win.

I believe Chuck said that was the only thing he could think off to rationalize why they weren't playing. It was clear from his other comments and demeanor that he felt they should have played.

Jimenez needs to be traded. Guy is an injury waiting to happen and any thought he'll ever have a 35-40 home run season is delusional. Keep Vaughn (for now.)

October 4, 1948 - Chuck Comiskey III was named vice president of the White Sox. He refused to see the team continue to be the laughingstock of the American League and immediately began to take steps to change things on and off the field. Those changes started to bear fruit during the 1951 season as the Sox vaulted into contention in the American League. For the next 17 seasons, through the end of the 1967 campaign, the White Sox produced a winning record and were usually in the running for the pennant winning it in 1959. October 4, 1981 - Jerry Hairston’s grand slam helped beat the Twins 13-12 setting off Bill Veeck’s original exploding scoreboard for the last time. The blast came off future White Sox pitching coach Don Cooper. The Sox trailed in the game 12-5 before scoring eight unanswered runs in the final two innings with Hairston driving home the game winner. The victory gave the Sox their first winning year since 1977 at 54-52. The game also marked the end of broadcaster Harry Caray’s association with the Sox after 11 seasons. October 4, 2005 – The White Sox opened the divisional playoffs against the Red Sox at home in U.S. Cellular Field before a capacity crowd…and they did it with a bang, blasting Boston 14-2. The White Sox hit five home runs in the game, an A.L.D.S. record. The home runs were hit by Paul Konerko, Juan Uribe, Scott Podsednik and two by A.J. Pierzynski.

Takes aim at the organization, Grifol and the players who sat out the "fan appreciation" day game Sunday among other topics:

I'd argue they had legit chances to win during the time period from 1951-1967 too.

Historically that isn't true. It is since 2007 but the time period from 1951-1967 was excellent. The time period from 2000-2006 wasn't bad either.

It always comes down to ownership and for a century or so Chicago sports teams owners have been less than willing to go all in, regardless of consequence, less than willing to hire the best and the brightest and less then willing to put personal beliefs aside in the interest of winning. It always starts at the top folks.

The 19 thousand surprised me as well but it's in the middle of the day on a work day. What did you expect?

The guy has barely pitched in what three years? Something like that. This isn't even a long shot.

More flotsam and jetsam. As if this bad bullpen doesn't already have a slew of those types. How did that work out this year?

https://soxmachine.com/2023/10/report-white-sox-coaching-changes-include-firing-daryl-boston-jose-castro/

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bears/2023/10/3/23902121/chicago-bears-cubs-white-sox-bulls-blackhawks

Hemond supercharged the Sox rebuild after the 1970 disaster by being able to make deals where the Sox would trade a player and get two back or trade two guys and get three back. They weren't as good individually as the player the Sox traded like Aparicio and Berry but they were solid returns. I don't think this current front office has the moxie to be able to duplicate what Roland did.

You can try to trade some of the guys who are at least decent but I don't think the current front office has the expertise of say Roland Hemond.

They wouldn't be held responsible until the trade deadline. If (when) the Sox get off to a bad start next year you can't trade the team in May...you can fire the manager by Memorial Day (a la Gene Lamont) and frankly that is what I expect to happen. https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/10/3/23901805/daryl-boston-jose-castro-out-as-white-sox-coaches

October 3, 1906 - The White Sox clinched the pennant while in their hotel room in Cleveland on an off day after the New York Highlanders (Yankees) lost a game to the Philadelphia A’s. Frank “Yip” Owen shut out St. Louis the day before 4-0 putting the Sox on the cusp for the pennant. That year the Sox would go 93-58-3 beating the Highlanders by three games. Then then would upset the Cubs in the only all-Chicago World Series. October 3, 1965 - By pitching the eighth inning and giving up only one hit and earning his fourth hold, Eddie Fisher set an American League record for most games in one year, with 82. The White Sox beat Kansas City 3-2. Fisher would be named A.L. Relief Pitcher of the year in 1965 with 15 wins, 24 saves, an ERA of 2.40 and 60 games finished. The Sox would win 95 games that season. October 3, 1972 – Terry Forster was one of a trio of hard throwing, young White Sox fireballers coming out of the bullpen in the early 1970’s. He along with Bart Johnson and Rich “Goose” Gossage struck fear in the hearts of hitters because of how hard they threw a baseball. But Forster was also a terrific hitter. For the 1972 season the 20-year-old batted .526, 10 for 19, with three RBI’s and one run scored. The Sox trailed Minnesota 4-3 in the ninth inning with two out in the next to last game of the year. Tony Muser was on third and pinch runner Jim Geddes on first. Hank Allen was due up but manager Chuck Tanner called of Forster to pinch hit. He promptly ripped a single to center tying the score and sending Geddes to third. Then incredibly Forster was given the steal sign and took off for second. When Twins catcher George Mitterwald’s throw sailed into center field Geddes scored, Forster had the only stolen base of his career and the Sox led 5-4. That would turn out to be the final and the 87th win on the year for the “Outhouse to Penthouse” White Sox. October 3, 1993 - The Sox rung down the curtain at old Municipal Stadium in Cleveland by beating the Indians 4-0. Jason Bere got the last win in the cavernous stadium which was replaced in 1994 by Jacobs Field. October 3, 2005 - As baseball was wrapping up the regular season, the Sox Paul Konerko appeared on the cover of Sports Illustrated sliding into second base in a game against Cleveland. The cover’s caption read, “Playoff Scramble. Who’s Out, Who’s In? White Sox vs. Indians. Yankees vs. Red Sox. 4 teams, 3 Spots” October 3, 2010 - She was beloved by Sox fans for generations as the organist at White Sox ballparks. Nancy Faust played her last White Sox game as the team beat Cleveland 6-5. Nancy took over as Sox organist in 1970 and in the ensuing 40 years rarely missed a game. Her lasting contribution was unearthing a little-known rock song in 1977 which turned into an anthem used by numerous pro and college teams. Nancy started playing Steam’s, “Na Na Hey Hey Kiss Him Goodbye” when an opposing pitcher was being removed from the game. It caught on like wildfire with Sox fans and became one of the things identified with the franchise. When she was hired by then vice-president Stu Holcomb her position was out in the center field bleachers near the scoreboard. After a few years though she was moved behind home plate in the upper deck to be surrounded by fans and closer to where the action was taking place. Eventually that positioning led to a professional relationship with broadcaster Harry Caray. Then Sox owner Bill Veeck heard Caray singing “Take Me Out to the Ballgame” one day, secretly positioned a microphone and had Caray’s voice piped through the stadium P.A. system so fans could sing along with him. It was Faust who supplied the organ music to the song and like with the “Na Na Hey Hey” song Harry’s ‘Seventh Inning Stretch’ became a part of Comiskey Park lore. October 3, 2022 – It caught the baseball world by surprise, it elicited everything from derision to head-scratching and it was a risky move perpetrated by White Sox owner Jerry Reinsdorf as he convinced his friend Tony LaRussa to come out of retirement to try to lead the Sox to a World Series. LaRussa was in his late 70’s, had been out of a dugout for almost 10 years, had already been elected to the Hall of Fame, and had some personal issues but Reinsdorf, against his front office, got his way. The move seemed solid when LaRussa led a beat-up team to 93 wins, a Central Division title and a spot in the playoffs in back-to-back seasons for the first time in franchise history. The 2022 season though was a different story. With talk of World Series by the front office and the players, the Sox stumbled out of the gate, seemed to show little emotion or urgency, lost a dozen games where they led in the seventh inning or later, had a pair of eight game losing streaks and were never able to put things together. For LaRussa, the situation was worse. His on-field decisions were bizarre, his press conferences saw him stumble and mumble seemingly forgetting things at times and he was caught looking like he was asleep in the dugout. It turned out he was having health issues which resulted in a pacemaker being implanted in February without common knowledge and then an issue with it which caused him to leave the club on August 28, never to return to the dugout because of doctor’s orders. It was also later revealed he had cancer. On this day, in a press conference at Guaranteed Rate Field, LaRussa retired with a year to go on his contract. He managed the Sox the first time from August 1979 through June 1986 and then from the 2021 season to the 2022 year. He won two divisional titles in that time in 1983 and 2021 but his post season White Sox mark was a dismal 2-6. Most baseball people felt the move in total, was counter-productive to the White Sox rebuild but Jerry Reinsdorf insisted and got what he wanted…it simply did not work out the way he was expecting it to.

A.J. Pollock wanted out so bad he left money on the table to do so to cite one example.

While Oscar Colás was struggling, you routinely talked to us about what was bothering you about the way he was playing. Fans see, or have the perception of, similar mistakes being made by other players, specifically a lightning rod this year was Tim Anderson with the numbers that he put up. We didn’t hear the same kind of language from you in regards to him or some other players. Fans want to know: What is the difference? “The difference is that Tim Anderson’s been in the league for a long time and he’s done it over and over and over again. And he got ample time in the minor leagues to develop. Oscar hasn’t. ?

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2023/10/2/23900562/white-sox-2023-season-could-not-have-been-much-worse