BlackSox13

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 03:43 PM) What you and a lot of people aren't getting tho is that the sellers never sets the market value. We as fans and even the front office of the Sox can put whatever value on Sale/Q we want, but if no team meets that price it's just an imaginary value. Value is set by the buying teams. Boston's offer was exactly what Sale's value was...obviously because that's the deal we took making it the best offer on the table. Not to mention saying that the deal was a top 20 prospect "light" is absolutely ridiculous. QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 05:08 PM) Yeah that's what I meant. I managed to mess up the 1st sentence of the post somehow... Thanks for clarifying. I do get that the buyers determine the value and in fact agree with it so we're on the same page. I was just trying to point out that surplus value works both ways. Aside from Sale being a damn good pitcher, part of his trade value came from the surplus value of his contract. Similar for Moncada in that the Sox did not have to pay the money Boston spent to sign Moncada so that boosted Moncada's value. Heck, if the Sox offered to reimburse Boston for their investment it likely the Sox would have received another prospect of two. In the end I'm happy with the deal.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 03:43 PM) What you and a lot of people aren't getting tho is that the buyer never sets the market value. We as fans and even the front office of the Sox can put whatever value on Sale/Q we want, but if no team meets that price it's just an imaginary value. Value is set by the buying teams. Boston's offer was exactly what Sale's value was...obviously because that's the deal we took making it the best offer on the table. Not to mention saying that the deal was a top 20 prospect "light" is absolutely ridiculous. I'm a bit confused by your post. Are you saying the buying team does or does not set the market?

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 02:26 PM) Are you at least going to claim to have "sources" to support this info? How can you possibly claim to know that the deal was a player short if you have no idea what any other team offered, or what the Sox asked for from Boston? The Sale deal was only light a prospect like Devers to fans on a message board who were unrealistic to begin with. At first glance the trade does look to be a player lite but I think it's because the money it cost to sign Moncada is not factored in. It cost Boston 31.5M to sign Moncada and paid an additional 31.5M in penalties. I think the missing player(s) in the Sale trade is the 31.5M it did not cost the Sox to acquire Moncada.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 08:55 AM) Recent scouting report? In his early days he was pretty lanky, around 180 lbs. Now he's listed from 210-215 at 21 yrs old and height of 6'4". Probably will fill out even more. And yea he probably will be stepping in for Adrian Gonzalez in a few years.Really good LH power bat . Might be ready as soon as 2018. Look for huge numbers for him this year in AAA. I'd be willing to bet Bellinger is why the Dodgers haven't been able to snag Dozier from the twins. The twins probably insist on Bellinger being apart of the trade deal similar to the Sox insisting on Meadows from the Pirates. Can't say I blame the Dodgers for insisting on keeping Bellinger, I would too. The Dodger front office is rebuilding that organization from the ground up. That team is going to be scary once the high priced vets are gone. A deep farm and even deeper pockets are going to keep them in contention for many years. I really don't like the Dodgers but man they know what they are doing.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 12:19 AM) I thought we already had an idea what the Astros offered ? Keith Law or someone thought it was light and since that was posted many posters have followed along with that viewpoint. Gammons reported the Sox asked for Martes, Tucker and Musgrove but I haven't seen anything about what the Astros have actually offered.

Really curious what the Braves and Astros offered. Hopefully some names come out to give us fans a better idea of what we might expect.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 02:19 PM) How in the world does Rodon have any where close to the value that Quintana has? The Yankees would never do that BlackSox. Just no. Well, in Rodon's short 1.5 years in the majors he's made huge improvements, has five more years of control and the upside of a front line starter. It's not crazy to think a team might value Rodon as much as Q. Depends on the team and what they are after. Take the Yanks for example, Rodon would fit right in with the young core of Severino, Bird, Judge and so on. With the Yanks going young, Rodon would be a better fit for them than Q.

I have no problem with this idea and I speculated last week that the Yanks could desire Rodon and not Q. The smart bet is to hold onto Rodon for another year or two before attempting to trade him but if a team wants to seriously pay for Rodon then I'm in. Question for the board members. Let say the Sox want Torres/Rutherford/Andujar for Q. The Yanks counter offer is they would only trade that package of prospects for Rodon. Would you do it?

http://www.letsgotribe.com/2017/1/3/141485...-league-central Very high praise from an Indians fan. I had no idea Abreu owned the ALC this much.

Yanks- Rutherford, Andujar, Fowler, Clarkin Pitt- Bell, Glasnow, Newman Rockies- Rodgers, Tapia, Murphy Cubs- Happ, Jimenez, Candelario Dodgers- Verdugo, Calhoun, Alvarez, Smith

Definitely want to see more of Saladino in '17. To me he is the White Sox version of Boston's Brock Holt. Would be nice if the Sox found a trade partner for Frazier.

Good breakdown of potential fits for Frazier. http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/01/trad...-white-sox.html

Have not seen his name linked in trade discussions but I would think at some point we will. Gonzalez had a nice bounce back year in '16 and becomes a free agent at the end of '17 so given the shortage of pitching I wonder if teams start kicking the tires now instead of waiting for July. Anyone have an idea of what Gonzalez would be worth in a trade? While I don't expect much, I really have no idea what he could bring back.

Unless the A's plan on spending big in free agency I don't see how a trade for Q makes any sense. That team needs alot of help to be competitive.

C-. Fisk 1B- Konerko 2B- Durham 3B- Crede SS- Aparicio LF- Minoso CF- 1Dog RF- Magglio DH- Thomas SP- Buehrle SP- McDowell SP- Sale SP- Wood SP- Q Closer- Thigpen SU- Howdy SU- Thorton

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jan 1, 2017 -> 09:20 AM) To me it's not even Bell or Meadows. It's just Meadows. Bell may end up a better hitter than Meadows but as a 1st baseman with a defensive reputation about the same as Frank Thomas ( yes worse than Abreu), he just can't be the center piece as much as a good fielding center fielder. Bell types are a dime a dozen as we have seen on the market this year. Agree with ya about Meadows but disagree on Bell. Hitters like Bell (BA/OBP/Power/Switch hitter )are not a dime a dozen, not to mention how much would a hitter like him cost in FA? I don't get the knock on Bell's defense either since from what I've read he made improvements last year defensively. If Abreu can play a passable 1b I see no reason why Bell couldn't, in time. Eh, it's probably all for naught anyway since it really sounds like Pitt wants to keep both Meadows and Bell for the upcoming season and that makes the trade much more difficult to accomplish. I'm hoping another team such as the Rockies, Yanks or Cubs step up as serious trade partners. I really like the hitting prospects those three teams have.

QUOTE (Al Lopez's Ghost @ Dec 31, 2016 -> 01:51 PM) It seems to me that the longer this drags on, the more likely it becomes that the Cubs step in. As others have pointed out, the Cubs don't need a lot from their farmhands, and they have potential problems with their rotation and a payroll that could use Q's affordability. Wouldn't be surprised if they are keeping tabs on Q. Both teams match up really well for a trade. The only potential sticking point I could see would be the Cubs are probably hoping for Jimenez to be their CF of the future with Schwarber in LF and their team albatross Heyward in RF. So I'd guess they would be reluctant to part with Jimenez but who knows. I really like Happ, Jimenez and Candelario. QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 31, 2016 -> 01:52 PM) While Kopech is a fair point, he also has never pitched more than 65 innings if I'm reading this right, and 27 BB in 65 innings for a 19 year old is something I'd call different from 62 walks in 110 innings as a 22 year old even if the rate is only slightly lower. Giolito walked 44 in 110 innings last year, so his BB/9 is about 1/3 lower than Glasnow already, so that's not a particularly good comparison. I see what youre saying, I'm just looking at walk rates over all. If the Sox do acquire Glasnow, I feel pretty good about his chances because I do trust the Sox eye for young pitching. I give the Sox credit, there were games I thought Rodon was hopeless watching him walk batter after batter but he is much better now and still improving. Rodon, the Sox pitching coaches and training staff are the reasons I'm not concerned about pitchers like Giolito, Kopech, Hansen and Glasnow ( if acquired).

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 31, 2016 -> 01:10 PM) The worry with Glasnow remains control. His stuff is serious, his K-rate is serious, but he has one truly substantial issue in that he has more 1 walk every 2 innings or more at basically every one of his minor league stops. That's comparable to Fulmer last year or Rodon as a rookie and almost 3 times the rate of Chris Sale. There's no reason for me to say that he can't improve upon that, but that's because I'm not a major league scout. What I will say is that if you're down on him, it's because your organization believes he will struggle to make progress on that issue. So, there is reason to at least be hesitant on him, if you think that is a problem you can't solve. If you think that's a problem you can solve, go for it. Add Giolito and Kopech to the list of pitchers with walk issues. That's what I don't understand why people are down on Glasnow due to his walk rates when we've already been through it with Rodon, going through it now with Fulmer, Giolito had problems in his pro debut and Kopech had problems in the minors. Heck, my concern isn't over Glasnow's walk rates, it more about getting a few solid hitting prospects in any trade for Q. For me, one of Bell or Meadows has to be in the deal with Glasnow.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 31, 2016 -> 12:58 PM) This article seems to disagree with you. Are you including arbitration and minimum salary obligations? And remember, the luxury tax is based on the AAV of all contracts and not just their current rate. This would most definitely increase their total payroll from a tax perspective. http://www.mccoveychronicles.com/2016/12/6...tinez#undefined Looks like Sportrac is behind on the '17 payroll obligations. I'll take it that McCovey Chronicals knows their team so their numbers are probably more accurate. Thanks for the link. For now, I think it's safe to say that Melky and Frazier aren't going to the NLW if they are traded this winter.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 31, 2016 -> 09:04 AM) The problem is they are over the cap and would pay a 30% tax on any incremental payroll. Now, that doesn't necessary rule out an addition, as it seems like they still made a hefty profit last year despite paying the tax, but it does make a move less probable. The only plus is it does sound like 2018 is the bigger concern, so guys on one year deals would be attractive to them. I really wish I knew how eating money affected tax considerations. The 2017 luxury tax threshold is 195M so the Giants have almost 40M in space to fill out the balance of their roster. This doesn't mean they would trade for Frazier and/or Melky, just that they have room to play with.

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/payroll/ For anyone curious about where the Giants payroll currently stands. Looks like they have some room play with. Doubt they would be interested in Melky but Frazier makes sense.

1B- Adam LaRoche 2B- Wilson Betemit SS- Alex Cintron 3B- Josh Fields OF- Joey Belle OF- George Bell OF- Carl Everette DH- Joe Borchard Bench- Lyle Mouton, Drake LaRoche , Leury Garcia , Oney Guillen SP- Jaime Navarro SP- Todd Ritchie SP- Erik Johnson SP- Aaron Poreda SP- Arnie Munoz Closer- don't need one with that lineup and rotation. Skipper: Terry Bevington

QUOTE (hi8is @ Dec 30, 2016 -> 01:46 PM) This article is poop. It's only potential redemption is #3... and it doesn't even work on my iPhone... that said, I'm very glad I took the effort to play that video on my computer, where it works. Amazing. So what are your thoughts on #2? Fun read and thanks for the laugh. That list is awesome.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 30, 2016 -> 01:39 PM) Albies, Maitian, Soroka, and Touissant? I didn't think Atlanta would be after Q based on their pitching acquisitions this winter but if the Sox are willing to take younger lower minor league level talent then Atlanta makes more sense because that will not take from the talent they are expecting at some point in '17.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 30, 2016 -> 01:24 PM) That is an intriguing package. Severino could make or break that package. I think Severino and Frazier break that package. Yanks seem high on both, depending of course on what and where you read. Sounds as though Frazier, Torres and Judge are highly coveted by the organization. Then again, so was Moncada so who knows.