BlackSox13

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 09:10 PM) See, we can't even agree that Rick Hahn's important enough to even put up on the banner!!! The last two posters included KW in their groupings but not Rick. Interesting.... I mean, if Mark Parent can single-handedly disrupt the clubhouse morale/chemistry and turn players on each other and Ventura, isn't Hahn capable of at least doing something besides negotiating contracts? I think you missed the obvious sarcasm. Let's not read too much into it.

QUOTE (shysocks @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 12:02 PM) He gawn. Well done Shysocks! Looks great. For future reference. I'm thinking of a new banner for spring with RV, KW and JR betting the house on the '16 season.

QUOTE (knightni @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 03:49 PM) Yes, but will they get busted for running a stop sign? Yes, you can bet the house on it!

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 12:39 PM) Is anyone else as sick of Eddie Vedder as I am? Yes X2! Had enough of Vedder.

Anderson is only 22 and will start the '16 season at AAA, that's quite young for that level. His defense improved alot in '15 despite moving up a level. As for his bat, again he's only 22 so there's nothing to panic about. Let's see what he does in '16 before making any decisions on his future with the Sox. Anderson is still very raw with plenty of untapped potential and imo is well worth waiting for.

QUOTE (shysocks @ Oct 15, 2015 -> 08:36 AM) This is a terrific post. Balta's thing is the idea that the failure rate of free agent contracts is fairly high, but not all contracts are equal. The LaRoche and Melky signings suck in hindsight, but they are not albatrosses. The Samardzija trade didn't work out, but no blue chippers were involved. Do I now wish those moves hadn't happened? Yes. In fact the only move I really liked at the time was Melky. But the fact is that the Sox went for it in 2015 without dooming the future. Thanks Shysocks. I do agree about the failure rate being high and I think it's due to many players have already peaked by the time they hit FA around age 30 so the signing team is paying for what that player has done in the past and not what the team will get from him in the future. Its definitely not the best approach to building a team but sometimes signings some free agents is a necessary evil. I admit, I liked all the signings at the time but like you, I don't like them in hindsight. I'm at peace with Melky and Robertson since the Sox were pretty desperate for a LF and Closer but the LaRoche and Duke signings really sucked. What gets me on the Samardzija trade is that the Sox gave up a 26 year old starter in Bassitt that showed some impressive stuff in a small sample size and also gave up a young high OBP minor league player in Ravelo. Luckily we just have to ride out the '16 season and the Sox will be in better financial shape. Samardzija is good as gone and hopefully EJ is the answer to replacing Samardzija in the rotation. Melky hit decent in a linup a most horrible lineup so I can live with that. Robertson, hey at least we finally have a closer despite him blowing some saves. Good news is the Sox have just over 28M coming off the books when '16 ends. So while next season is playing out the Sox will have their young talent in the minors progressing through the system while guys like Sanchez, EJ, Micah and Saladino get more MLB experience. At the end of the '16 season the Sox will have a better idea of where the youth stands and money to play with which puts them in a much better situation than the one they are currently in.

Initially I had the Jays over the Astros in 6 so I'll stick with Jays in 6. I think the Jays offense matches up well against KC pitching.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 09:45 PM) Not so fast my friend, he did predict 7-2! You're right, he did but was wrong on Cueto. So where does that leave the house betting market now?

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 09:40 PM) Ya my plan of AC, Freese and Wieters isn't out of the realm of possibility. All won't command big contracts. I'd really like to see these three signed. All three might be a stretch since their salaries combined for just a tick over 22M this season and are bound to get raises with their new contracts. Just a guess on my part but I can see the three of them easily adding 30M+ to the payroll which would put the Sox payroll in the mid 130's. I would think seriously about trying to get Wieters on a multi year deal and slide him over to 1B when LaRoche is gone.

Lots of vacant homes coming soon to a prediction near you! Get em while they're not baby!

Danks and Ozzie!

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 06:21 PM) I don't give the FO for trying and then using a strategy with an extremely high rate of failure. The accurate metaphor is trying to satisfy your retirement needs by putting the $100k you've saved up in the lottery. Then yelling "I totally tried to retire a millionaire!" Yes, you tried, but you didn't assess the fact that it would be surprising if that strategy worked. It might work if we try it again next year, eventually if you put $100k into the lottery every day you would win, but it might well take decades. The Sox had money to spend, numerous holes to fill with not nearly enough in the farm to fills those holes so what else were they supposed to do? I went into last off season expecting '15 to be a year for youth and development but since the Sox opened up payroll, I bought into the idea of trying to contend. Things didn't work out but I still give them credit for trying despite having so many voids. I do hold the FO responsible for the Samardzija trade, never did like it since I was high on Bassitt and Ravelo but its not the FO's fault Samardzija sucked so badly either. I can see why a few people around here use the word fickle. Sox are criticized for spending money and yet also criticized for being cheap. I'm not directing that anyone in particular, just an observation in pessimism. Some just seem hell bent on complaining about any and everything.

RV and the FO are far from perfect but imo, the players should get most of the blame. I give the FO credit for their effort last winter in trying to put a contender on the field but in the end it was the players that s*** the bed. I highly doubt Maddon and the cubs FO would have made a difference with LaRoche, Gillaspie, Samardzija, Alexei, Avi and Flowers. It's on the players for not preforming. Hopefully, RV and the FO have learned from this past season and get things back on track.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 10:29 AM) My plan for AC was sign him to 2 or 3 year deal. When Tim is ready, move him to 2B. Have Freese at 3B Ok, I follow you. The Sox could very well have the funds available for Freeze and Cabrera, would solidify two positional needs. That's a solid plan.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 07:55 AM) I'm hoping for David Freese, Asdrubal Cabrera as the stop gap to Anderson, and Wieters. No reason to not be able to sign those guys. They won't be breaking the bank. Then finding an impact bat via trade. Whether it's moving Q or a Montas package. I also wonder if Colorado would give up their 3B prospect McMahon. We could look at young catchers around the league and maybe grab one to sit behind Wieters until they're ready. A few things. Cabrera is a good idea except he will likely cost more than Alexei in terms of salary and contract. Now if Cabrera could slide over to 3B when Anderson was ready then there's no problem. Cabrera is going 30 years old so there's no reason to think he cannot get more than a one year deal. If the Sox trade Q then who replaces him in the rotation? Montas I would not hesitate to trade for the right player and I'm hoping the Sox look into a Montas for McMahon trade. Montas is rated #54 and McMahon #50 in the top 100. Problem is that McMahon has only played at A+, likely starts '16 at AA so he won't be ready until 2017 at the earliest. I'll take it since he would give the Sox another young 3B option to go with Michalczewski. Freeze is a good idea and could be a great stop gap to hopefully Michalczewski or McMahon if the Sox can trade for him.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Oct 14, 2015 -> 12:34 AM) You put things into perspective and make me even more sure the Sox are going nowhere fast in 2016. The talent simply IS NOT there and they have no real solution to get the many areas solved under the circumstances. They are offering hope for next year, that's all (and sometimes that works although I would say not very often...talent wins out usually.) Mark It's kind of disheartening to be honest. At the moment I'm looking at 2016 as a season of potentially further developing young players such as Sanchez, Micah, EJ, Rodon and Thompson to see who can actually contribute to the making of a 2017 contender. Also buys time to see how Anderson progresses at SS and Michalczewski progresses at 3B. After next season the Sox will have a better idea of who sticks, who stinks and will have Danks/LaRoche's salaries off the books which opens up 28.75M. Hate to say it but we could be looking at 2016 ST duels for 3B with Olt/Davidson, SS with Saladino/Leury/Sanchez and 2B with Sanchez/Micah. http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/03/2016...ree-agents.html There's a few names that would certainly be of some interest to the Sox. Reddick ( really like Reddick alot) and Gomez look good for outfielders but I don't see much else of interest. SS and 3B are very weak so I'm not relying on the Sox going after free agents for those positions in '17. Hopefully Anderson will be ready by then with Michalczewski not too far behind.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1GZ9...pub?output=html According BP, the Sox have 88.7M committed to 10 players and 1 of those 10 is Alexei and his 1M buyout so its really 88.7M for 9 players + buyout and if the Sox keep Alexei the number jumps to 97.7M for all 10. Those numbers do not include arbitration eligible players in Jones, Putnam, Avi, Jennings and Flowers nor do they include pre-arb player salaries or potential FA signings. Depending on what the Sox do with Alexei they have between 30-40M to fill out 14 or 15 spots on the 25 man roster if they go with the same payroll as '15 (118.6M). Just a guess but I would imagine the arbitration players could easily add up to 10M and then factor in (500k+) for each pre-arb player. Let's say the Sox buyout Alexei for more flexibility. Add these pre-arb players at 500k+ each to the 88.7 committed to 9 players. EJ Sanchez Olt Saladino Micah Petricka Shuck Rodon Thompson Brantly ( replaces Soto ) These players add 5M+ to the 88.7 committed and rounds out close enough to call it 94MM for 19 players. Add in arbitration players in Jones, Putnam, Avi, Jennings and Flowers at an approximate 10M brings the total to 104M for 24 players which leaves room for one FA signing at 15M assuming JR does not raise the payroll, which he certainly could, who knows at this point. All I'm doing here is show where the Sox are at with what they currently have both in players and salaries. It's easy to say trade this player for that player or sign this player but without raising the payroll the Sox only have approximately 15M to play with. Theres a few arbitration players they could cut bait with like Avi and Jennings but it won't make a huge difference although every bit helps when things are this tight. If the Sox were to cut bait on Avi and Jennings, they could have enough left over to sign a few free agents, for instance, like Parra and Zobrist. The payroll would be about the same as it was this past season. I'm not a fan of signing Zobrist, just using him as an example. I'm not trying to stir up the payroll debate, just trying to help put things in perspective. After seeing the contracts of Sale and Q, there's no f***ing way I trade them because their cheap contracts are the reason why the Sox have been able to sign other players. GO WHITE SOX!

I think there's going to be some disappointed Sox fans come spring. Expectations are a bit high for a team with a few bad contracts and lttle financial wiggle room. As a Sox fan I surely hope for more but understand the rock and hard place they are in.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 13, 2015 -> 07:25 PM) Mets have the deeper rotation than the Dodgers and were 3rd in the MLB in runs scored after the ASB, Dodgers were 28th in runs scored over that time. The regular season record means nothing, especially considering both the Cubs and Mets are completely different teams since the last time they faced each other. Points taken, Go Mets!

So which team stands a better chance against the cubs? The Dodgers were 4-3 against the cubs and the Mets were 0-7 against the cubs in the regular season. The Mets haven't faced the cubs since early July and have since added Cespedes. This is a tough one.

AJ and Stone together sounds damn good to me. I'm game.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 13, 2015 -> 11:12 AM) If Arrieta ends up getting a huge number through arbitration that could affect their bid for Price. Funny how this board is the only place I've read that just 100% assumes Price is going to the Cubs, everywhere else I've read thinks he could still go several places, even end up staying in Toronto. I know there's a Maddon connection, but I still think he goes to the highest bidder. Good points and would like to add that the Dodgers have shown they are willing to spend huge on their payroll. Another factor from Price's perspective could be the ballparks. Pitching in Dodger stadium sounds better than pitching in Wrigley.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 13, 2015 -> 10:38 AM) For the record, this is the first time I've wanted to trade him. Q is one of my favorite players. Has always been. But, we need an impact bat. I really doubt were signing Upton, Cespedes or Heyward. My pipe dream with Rockies is just that. Q is probably more likely to be dealt to the Dodgers for Puig. I hear ya and wasn't trying to direct the trade Q stuff at anyone directly, just find the humor of it after three off seasons is all. I agree that the Sox won't be signing any of those FA bats, just too costly for a team that does not appear to have the funds, though I can't say that for sure since I don't work in the Sox FO, lol. Puig is an interesting possibility with his recent injury, sort of a down season but he is a bit of a head case and ihmo I'd rather not trade Q for him. Also, the Dodgers have a seemingly endless amount of money so they can easily sign a FA pitcher like Price, Cueto or Zimmermann without giving up Puig and they will have McCarthy back next season too. I think it's more likely the Dodgers look to trade Crawford ( good luck, lol) or Ethier to keep Puig in the lineup more often. From a Dodgers stand point, it would make more sense to try and trade one of those older high salary veterans instead of youth. They are likely stuck with Crawford but they should be able to move Ethier. I admit that I probably over value Q a bit but when the Sox find a pitcher that can put up his numbers at the Cell, I find it difficult to trade him. Plus, it won't be easy for the Sox to replace his production without going to the FA market and that will cost much more than Q's salary. They really are in a bind with the contracts of Danks, LaRoche, Robertson and Melky. Those four will combine for 52.25M in 2016, yikes! I honestly don't know what the hell they are going to do. Gonna take some serious creativity to try and make the '16 team a contender.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 13, 2015 -> 10:10 AM) Ok ya that's what I was thinking of. Well he didn't come out and curse the organization but he wasn't happy at all. Never say never in this league. This team will have offers and good ones when they're trying to move Quintana. Q is another subject we might not see eye to eye my man. Unless the Sox are offered a haul they just cannot pass up, I think Q will be the #2 for the '16 White Sox. I doubt seriously the Sox are shopping Q. Just my opinion is all. One thing I'd like to point out is that this will be my third off season on this board and the third off season in which some members wanted to trade Q. I still remember the trade Q for Jason Castro idea a few years ago and thank goodness that didn't happen.