steveno89

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 12:25 PM) Not surprising. Turns out just about everyone is finding that acquiring players like Moncada, Giolito, Kopech and Lopez is far more exciting than the acquisitions you lauded as "surreal" back in February/March, those of Rollins, Jackson, Latos, et al. We essentially had to rebuild If we did not we would have wasted a prime opportunity to deal players like Sale, Eaton and Quintana (possibly) for considerable returns to jump start the rebuild. A few more seasons of solid drafting, shrewd signings/trades and we set ourselves up to have a much brighter future. Not rebuilding, signing players like Encarnacion and hoping to catch lightning in a bottle would be very foolish. We had a bottom 5 farm system and our future looked shaky prior to the start of the rebuild.

QUOTE (chisox802 @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 11:41 AM) I tend to be optimistic, and will probably get torn apart for suggesting this. I think this is going to be a quick rebuild. We will be bad in 2017 obviously, but 2018 we will be competitive (75 win team). Some of these guys are not far from the majors. Obviously lets let the rest of the offseason play out, but I could definitely see this team competing in 2019. Lastly, this is not anything new, but my friend works for the sox (in a lower role) and said that the pirates are a definite possibility for Q. Seems like Cutch could be holdings things up for the bucs. A 75 win team is not considered competitive at all That puts you at least 12-15 wins away from contention

QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 11:30 AM) A guy with #4 or #5 potential should not be the headliner in a deal for Q. End of story. I said his floor is likely a #4 or 5 starter due to his excellent control. He only walked 19 batter in 130 minor league innings this season His ceiling is probably a #2 starting pitcher, one with plus control and a solid WHIP. Keller is the "safer" of the two prospects, he has had some injury history, but nothing I would worry too much about. Glasnow has the higher ceiling for sure, and his power stuff is tantalizing. He really needs to cut down on the walks though, as more patient mlb hitters will use his wildness to their advantage. Think alot of 10+ strikeout games, but also alot of 6+ walk games...which will lead to very mixed results.

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 11:11 AM) I still think the Pirates get it done with a Meadows + Bell/Keller/Glasnow + a low level arm or two package. If the Sox want Bell they'd probably have to throw Frazier into the deal, but that also probably adds a better of cadre of prospects after the two headliners. Pirates have tanked the market for McCutchen by being so desperate to sell him that its about time for them to realize they never should've shopped him to begin with. Pirates have two years of prime-time baseball and with some favorable contracts long-term and a farm system that still has some muscle with a strong org to recoup what was dealt in the next couple seasons. Huntington is a good GM and I'm sure they like him, he can convince Nutting to expand the payroll a little bit to add a big piece. Meadows is a big sticking point for the Pirates. He is firmly part of their future, and I feel like he is pretty much considered untouchable by the Pirates front office. If he were on the table a deal would likely have been made by now. I don't see them moving Bell, he is expected to be a big contributor to the 2017 team. Trading him is addition by subtraction. Glasnow is a boom or bust prospect. If he can fix his control he could be an ace. If he can't cut down his walks it will be his downfall. Keller is a rising prospect with good control. He does not have the ceiling of Glasnow, but his floor might be a #4 or #5 starter given his plus control. The Pirates are likely offering: Pick one of Glasnow or Keller + Newman + Hayes/Tucker/Craig + a flyer White Sox likely believe that is not enough

QUOTE (Dam8610 @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 11:05 AM) Torres should be the top player coming back in any Q deal with the Yankees. I just have this feeling that the Rockies could end up being a player for Quintana, Robertson or Jones They want to compete, but badly need pitching help. They had a bottom 5 rotation and bullpen in 2016 that will continue to hold them back unless they make some big additions. A packaged including Brendan Rodgers as a headliner would be very attractive

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:56 AM) Buster Olney ‏@Buster_ESPN 51m51 minutes ago MLB Roundup. http://bit.ly/2hwo9A2 Why the White Sox are in a dominant position in the Jose Quintana trade talks. News/notes/links. http://dynastydigest.sportsblog.com/posts/...sis--1-10-.html Reading this midseason top 10 baseball prospects article makes me really happy about Moncada and Giolito's potential. Giolito had his struggles, but a fresh start in 2017 should allow him to move closer to reaching his potential.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:42 AM) I agree with this timeline. The White Sox are being very specific for the sort of talent that they want in return for their blue chip trade pieces. The trend is that the vast majority of the players they have gotten in return are no more than 2 years away from possibly being big league ready. Which leads me to believe they are not looking for players like Rutherford, who is a minimum of three seasons away from realistically making the big leagues. Moncada, Giolito, Lopez, even Dunning late season should be on the 2017 roster at some point. Fulmer might as well, but I'd rather see him get some time in AAA. Burdi could very well be in the pen. Diaz was a quality fourth piece with upper 90's heat. Kopech might be a quick riser, but needs a full season in the minors this year and at least a half season next year (probably full). Collins should spend minimum one full season in the minors, likely two to work on defense. I fully expect him to mash in the minors this season. I project Collins to dramatically rise up the top 100 prospect charts. Basabe is interesting, in the his hit tool will completely decide his fate. If it ever develops he could be a really good prospect, or if it doesn't he will never sniff the major leagues. All of the other tools are there though.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:37 AM) If there is one thing that we have been taught in this off season is that the guys you are dreaming about aren't available. Realistically, who are you talking about? Talk of 2018 is crazy Talk of 2019 is best case rebuild scenario, everything that could have gone right for the Sox does 2020 - 2023 if we are not competitive, the rebuild has been a failure

QUOTE (Al Lopez's Ghost @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:30 AM) I'll just add that our 2016 draft was outstanding. Collins, Burdi, Hansen, Call and another guy I can't think of right now just add to the talent Hahn is obtaining. The future- the near future- is bright. Jameson Fisher led the NCAA in OBP. Very solid draft pick. Luis Curbelo has talent. Ian Hamilton is a decent relief prospect. Jake Elliott throws hard and is interesting as a prospect. Aaron Schnurbusch raked in rookie ball Matt Foster tossed a very impressive 29 1/3 innings, allowing only 12 hits along with 41 K's Michael Horejsei is older at age 24, but did very well in rookie ball and then A ball The 2016 draft was outstanding for the White Sox so far

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:19 AM) But then were talking about a guy who was tied for 33rd last season amongst qualified batters in OBP. Tied for 59th in wRC+. That's not bad, but its also not great. At least not top 20 player in the game great. He also displays power sporadically at best and has good-not-great baserunning with disappointing steals totals. I see him as a fringe top 50 offensive player, the defensive renaissance he enjoyed in RF last year definitely boosts him but not to the kind of heights that justify giving up two of the best farm arms in baseball (PLUS a 1st rounder). Perhaps he fits what the Nationals need more than most teams so it makes more sense for them. Their window is probably only open for 2 more years anyways. But the Sox are likely to find 10 Adam Eaton's before they stumble on another Chris Sale or even Jose Quintana. That's why you take the pitching back in return for Eaton. Most teams would love to have 1 pitching prospect the caliber of a Giolito, Kopech or Lopez. Even Dunning has potential and performed very well over 8 starts this season and could be a fast riser. He was relegated to being a reliever in college due to Florida's absurd amount of pitching, but he could develop into a starting pitcher or quality bullpen piece. I felt he was an outstanding third piece to the trade.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:11 AM) First off, rebuilding was without question the right strategy for us. We were stuck in the middle with no money and a bottom five farm system. The choice to blow it up was a no brainer. Second, I am super excited to follow some of these young players. By June we could have a rotation that includes Rodon, Giolito, Lopez, & Fulmer. That's four young guys with TOR stuff. For diehard Sox fans, that already makes 80% games at least somewhat interesting. Plus we'll have an electric young arm in the bullpen in Burdi. By June we should also see the most exciting positional prospect the White Sox have had since Frank Thomas called up. I can't understate how excited I am to watch Moncada develop into the superstar he has a legit chance at becoming. I also can't wait to follow Anderson in his second season and see if he can become one of the top young SS in the game. And hopefully there are some other exciting positional prospects on the way between Quintana and/or other potential deals. Hell, I'm even excited to see if any of our C type prospects develop into anything. One or two of Tilson, Liriano, Engel, & May will get some serous playing time in the OF this year. Davidson could get a shot at DH or 3B. Right now Navarez looks to be in the mix at C. There are also a few interesting guys at Charlotte who might eventually get a chance in Delmonico & Peter. I'm not optimistic any of these guys will turn into solid major league players, but rebuilding gives us an opportunity to play these type of prospects and see if any stick. And finally I'm excited to cheer on our remaining trade assets in preparation for what should be an exciting 2017 deadline for us. Assuming Q is dealt in the next month, we could still have guys like Abreu, Frazier, Cabrera, Robertson, Jones, Jennings, Petricka, Putnam, Gonzalez, Holland, etc. that could bring back varying degrees of value. There should be a second influx of prospects come July of 2017. So ultimately while 2017 is going to suck from a wins & losses perspective, there's a lot of things to be excited for if you're willing to consider other angles. And guess what, if the losing is too much for anyone, they can simply change the channel and not feel guilty. There is no expectation to win next year which means following the White Sox can finally be on our own terms. After putting in hundreds of hours into this team over the last few years and receiving nothing in return but regret & unfulfillment, that's a huge plus for me. I'm right there with you I just think fans will need to be very patient with how long this rebuild will take. The earliest the Sox will be competitive will be 2019, likely 2020 before making a playoff push

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 10:00 AM) Never had an OPS over .800, didn't have a higher OPS than Melky last year. So a few nice throws from RF made him one of the best 20 players in baseball? Not buying it at all. Sox should've sold high on him rebuilding or not and glad they got what they did. This is about the time where we get our daily rumor that leads to rampant excitement and eventually dies off around 2 or 3 PM as the reality of not trading Quintana for yet another day sinks in. Just get this over with for gods sakes. Washington is convinced that Adam Eaton is Alex Gordon entering his prime right now, with slightly less gap and home run power That's not an awful comparison if you look at their stats

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 09:55 AM) Thanks. Re: last paragraph, I think it just depends how you rate Musgrove. Musgrove's plus plus control helps his stuff really play up. He throws a ton of strikes, and barely ever walks batters. There's some injury concerns, but overall he could develop into a very good #3 starter

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 08:10 AM) Who's ready for our daily rumor/tease? Pretty sure all we need right now is a tweet saying that a mystery team is making a push for Quintana to send this message board into a frenzy

QUOTE (shipps @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 07:59 AM) I actually didn't know he had that much power from the left side going up the middle and to opposite field. What a monster. Right now he puts up amazing numbers while batting from the left side, and subpar numbers when facing lefties from the right. He should be able to improve those splits over time. Prospects like this are exceedingly rare, as he does everything pretty well.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Dec 28, 2016 -> 07:15 AM) The White Sox are attempting to build something long-term that will be special/sustainable. More importantly they're getting with the damn times. There's still much work to be done. But how can you not be virgin about to lose their virginity excited right now? Moncada will be a superstar. Yes, a SUPERSTAR. WHAT.A.TIME. Watch Moncada's 2016 hightlight video (if you haven't already) He really crushed some moonshots

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 04:21 PM) The fact that the Pirates have been trying to trade Cutch should tell you Meadows isn't going anywhere. They absolutely love him. The reason they are attractive trade partners is because they can put together a really strong package without him. Glasnow and Bell are top 20 prospects and they have Newman (#42) and Keller (#72) as well. I would absolutely love a deal with Glasnow/Bell as the centerpieces + maybe Keller or some other high upside guys. Sox are not likely getting three top 50 prospects, that would be more than what Sale got. I would not rule out getting three top 50 prospects due to Quintana's surplus value Moncada was not just a top 50 prospect, but arguably the top prospect in baseball. Kopech had seriously trended upward from the #70's to being #30, perhaps higher as well. You do not part with players like that except for an elite player such as Sale Quintana could net the White Sox something like Glasnow or Keller, + Bell + Newman + maybe one more prospect

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 03:23 PM) I personally don't think that offer is light at all. I just think Luhnow doesn't realize that in the modern MLB that you have to really go for it when you have a window and that sometimes means trading away quality prospects. Epstein most definitely overpaid for Chapman but it helped them get a ring. Can't be a major league GM and he afraid to make a move like that if you want to win a title. Luhnow believes that his in house pitching will either improve or prospects will step up to fill in the gaps. They do have a decent window to compete, although they are counting on a Keuchel bounceback and McCullers to stay healthy (which I don't think will happen). They also might try out Devenski in the rotation, but he has never exceeded 119 innings in a season. Will be interesting to see how he performs starting instead of relief. Houston might change its mind during the season, right now they are content to hang onto prospects

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 03:17 PM) Eh, Law that offer was light and I'd agree. To me it's because the Astros are like the Braves and don't view Q as a front line starter. Astros and Braves seemed to be the stingiest with their trade offers Yankees are likely cobbling together subpar offers that exclude their top prospects Very surprised the Rockies are not more in on Quintana and/or Robertson

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 03:12 PM) Can we not be bitter towards teams who decide not to give us what we're asking for? It's perfectly reasonable to decide not to give Francis Martes, Kyle Tucker and Joe Musgrove for Jose Quintana. Levine's article mentions Kaprielian and Mateo Both players stock are trending downard in my opinion. Mateo was nothing special in 2016 and Kaprielian was injured all season Astros are out for right now, but so were the Red Sox on Sale until deal day

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 01:29 PM) Crazy, messageboard GM proposal Quintana + Frazier + Robertson and cash for Headley, Torres, Rutherford, Sheffield, Tate, Judge, Andujar and McKinney I can't see New York completely destroying their farm system in a deal like that No mlb team can unload 7 top 30 prospects in one deal haha

QUOTE (hi8is @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 01:21 PM) What's your thoughts on state specifically please - seems like his WHIP has been pretty bad so far professionally. For being the 4th overall pick in 2015, Tate's stock has really fallen off of a cliff He posted a sky high WHIP in 2016, and has not pitched above A ball. He turns 23 in May, so he should be more advanced than he is. A 1.60 WHIP in A ball does not bode well for the transition to high A or AA

QUOTE (BrianAnderson @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 11:05 AM) If Bregman was ever an option we'd have him instead of Moncada and Sale would be in Houston right now. He wasn't an option for Sale and won't be for Q. If you throw in Frazier?? Possibly, but I still think they would have found a way to have Sale on their team if he was a possibility. Bregman never was on the table, neither was Dansby Swanson, Trea Turner or Andrew Benintendi Once a player contributes at the mlb level it is much harder to justify moving that player in a trade. It is addition by subtraction. Teams want to preserve the mlb roster in order to improve and deal from the bank of prospects

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 10:57 AM) @BNightengale reports Sox -Yanks expanded Quintana trade talks with D Robby. Pirates /Rangers and Astros still very engaged on Quintana https://twitter.com/MLBBruceLevine/status/813790388221804545 Hopefully a bidding war Somebody needs to just cave, give up the big kahuna, and land Quintana Pirates arguably need him the most due to his contract. They are totally unable to sign any big ticket free agents due to payroll constraints moving forward. We keep hearing about talks, but nothing regarding any advancement towards a deal.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 27, 2016 -> 10:52 AM) If they are willing to deal Bregman, they can get a deal done with the White Sox. My gut feeling is that with as by their book as they are, they have no desire to get it done. They are almost Vulcan in that once their logic tells them no, they won't do it. Bregman is not, and should not, be traded from the Astros. The trend we have seen time and time again is that teams are unwilling to deal pieces that are expected to contribute to the 2017 roster right away. Bregman is penned in as their starting 3B and a franchise player.