steveno89

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 08:57 AM) Running out of guys to trade. Have this guy under control through 2019. Might be better off holding onto him until next deadline. He is doing good against lefties this year however. I think Jennings will stay with the Sox for the time being. The market is flooded with relievers and Jennings is not having a terrific season or anything. He would not bring back much in a trade right now.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 08:43 AM) I've seen you use the phrase "useful role player" several times now when defending certain pieces coming back. And if that's the case here with Cordell, I think it's a horrible trade. You don't worry about finding potential role players in the first year of a rebuild. You try to find guys who can potentially be everyday guys, even if the odds are low. I personally think this guy has a much bigger ceiling than some posters are suggesting. The lack of a standout tool is overrated when all of his tools are above average with the exception of his hit tool perhaps (although it sounds like he has very good bat speed). I really think people simply look at his age and current prospect ranking and say this guy is AAAA material without looking at the scouting grades and his minor league track record. I'm not going to say this guy will definitely work out, because prospects fail more often than not, but I'm going to assume our front office really likes Cordell and thinks he has a chance to be an everyday player. He absolutely has a chance to end up being an everyday player, with the ceiling of a second division regular. In being realistic about the player, I think he is going to be best suited to a solid 4th outfielder role. Playing good defense will help his case, as will some pop. It's worth rolling the dice on.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 08:09 AM) Carlos Quentin was a big time prospect that had sort of stalled out a bit in the DBacks system, wasn't he? I don't think Cordell's mom even thinks Cordell had the pedigree that TCQ had. Cordell projects to be a quality defensive player, with plus speed, solid range and arm. It's not easy to find a player that can play a solid center field that also has some potential with the bat. He's a little old for a traditional prospect, but that does not mean he cannot become a useful role player for the White Sox moving forward.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:24 PM) SH, I suspect outside the top 150 still means somewhere near the top 150. If outside the top 150 is still fair game for like the 700th rated prospect, then fine, I stand corrected. If Cordell becomes a quality MLB regular you will absolutely have to eat all of these negative posts. If he doesn't pan out, what did we really even lose?? You have to face the fact that a rental reliever like swarzak wasn't getting us a better prospect than Cordell given the glut of relief options on the market.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:20 PM) Followed up with: The Fear with Ryan Cordell: No true standout tool. One scout just texted: "Fairly ordinary across the board." Sees him as a 4th OF type. My quote was the final thing passan posted... Bob Nightengale The #Brewers got the reliever they needed in Anthony Swarzak,but scouts believe speedy Ryan Cordell could be everyday OF for #WhiteSox, too He agrees this is a win win deal

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:13 PM) And you are acting like a f***ing dick. Jeff Passan "How rebuilding is done: Sign guy in late January to minor league deal (Swarzak), turn him into legit prospect (Cordell). Bravo, White Sox." Even national guys are on board with this move

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:01 PM) Please explain then what we were doing when we traded for James Shields. How much surplus value did we create? The Shields deal was a f*ck up, no doubt. This is a different situation. Swarzak was never getting us a top prospect, regardless of how well he pitched this season. We leveraged a minor league deal guy into a potential solid player, which is always a good move.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 10:55 PM) Because it's July 25th. It is absolutely a buyer's market. There are tons of relief options available, why overpay? Sox wanted to get a deal done and got a legitimate prospect in exchange. Hard to complain for a rental.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 10:39 PM) The scout in the text to Dan Hayes that ss2k linked to basically said they are the same player. Who did you expect for a rental? Especially in this market. Also, don't slam Cordell as being useless before he even gets a chance with us.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 10:31 PM) He is the 8th best reliever by era of relievers who have thrown 30 innings or more. That is pretty damned valuable. He's done it all. High leverage, multiple innings, anything we've asked. We traded maybe 30 innings of swarzak and saved 300k and in exchange got a player who might become interesting for us given his tools. You honestly can't have expected much more given the relief market this year.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 08:48 PM) We heard yesterday the likely value was a top 150ish guy or so... We basically got someone closer to top 350-400. But the whole goddamned board wants to keep rationalizing and justifying that guys with good stuff that have eras in the low 2's in a year where we're seeing the most home runs basically EVER are worth NOTHING. Bulls***. You honestly think haha dealt swarzak on the first trade conversation he made with a team and didn't check the market? They got what they could for a pure rental reliever. I hope Cordell pans out big time.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 08:03 PM) See, I couldn't disagree more. I don't like this much at all. We've already got like 2-3 guys that can play center field. Presumably, this guy will come up and play left when Melky is gone, but Adam Engel is actually deserving of playing time right now and I think when Garcia returns, he deserves another chance as well. Would have much rather gotten an intriguing arm or something. I get the Swarzak was signed as a minor league FA, but let's not ignore what he accomplished up here; nor should we ignore his stuff. Dude can bring mid-90's heat with a wicked slider that he currently has penchant for locating wherever the hell he wants. I'm frustrated by this idea of comparing the value a player had when he was initially signed with the value he received back when traded. What we need to be considering is the value the player has given his current performance. If that means we get some mediocre prospect who might become a 4th OFer if he's lucky, I'd prefer to just f***ing let the guy close for the rest of the year and see if he'll resign with you. I should probably wait until I actually see this guy play, because it sounds like he is one hell of an athlete, but we are not short on athletes, from what I understand. What more could you honestly expect for a 2-3 month rental of swarzak? There are a bunch of relievers on the market right now, and Cordell still had some upside. Sox were not getting a better prospect than we got.

QUOTE (heirdog @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 07:30 PM) Cordell will probably slot in between Sheets and Basabe so #18 in our system. A short cup of coffee for Nicky D on our top prospect list...just like Yrizzari before him. Cordell seems like a slightly better Delmonico who can actually play solid defense. Could be a solid forth outfielder on a contending team.

QUOTE (Username @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 06:54 PM) The more I look into this guy the more I like it. Didn't realize he's 6' 4" 205 and can apparently run. It's interesting that he can play every outfield position, third base and first base reasonably well. That sort of versatility can be valuable.

QUOTE (Username @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 06:42 PM) This guy is realistically perfect for where we are in the rebuild. Let him soak up ABs and if he becomes something, great. Were he an A-ball guy he'd be stuck in the logjam down there. I don't mind the return, as Cordell will very likely get a shot with the major league club. Scouting report suggests he can play all three outfield positions, has some pop and solid speed. A little old for a prospect, but I really can't complain given how many relievers we're on the market. Good move.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 02:44 PM) I disagree, during that great stretch he had in July-August last year he was clearly mixing in the changeup pretty frequently when in 2015 he barely threw the pitch at all. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/carlos-rodo...a-step-forward/ This article covers it more. After the All-Star Break last year he was throwing his changeup nearly 20% of the time but before the All Star break it was just 6% of the time. Rodon's line today is so strange, he's getting strikeouts but also getting hit hard and walking batters. Screams inconsistency to me and not hitting his spots, not a lack of stuff. This seems mental to me.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 01:26 PM) With regards to Lewis, I was reading Longenhagen's chat today and he said he's pretty worried about his struggles with staying healthy, and that it could be a recurring problem. Lewis did have major knee injuries last year that he only recently is returning from. It's not crazy to think he will experience a few setbacks.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 01:15 PM) I dunno about that...the trading was fun and all, but now we actually get to watch these kids develop. I, for one, have been following the affiliates games, as well as excited more than ever to watch guys like Yoan, Lopez and Giolito begin their White Sox careers. Then will come some of those things you mentioned, which, IMO, will be fun as well. The great thing about our rebuild is that we didn't have to just all-out suck AND have no real assets to watch develop like the Astros did for awhile. We're pretty lucky. We are certainly lucky to have the top assets to deal for our rebuild. We would be looking at a rough 5 years without the Sale/Eaton/Quintana/DRob/Kahnle trades

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 01:15 PM) I dunno about that...the trading was fun and all, but now we actually get to watch these kids develop. I, for one, have been following the affiliates games, as well as excited more than ever to watch guys like Yoan, Lopez and Giolito begin their White Sox careers. Then will come some of those things you mentioned, which, IMO, will be fun as well. The great thing about our rebuild is that we didn't have to just all-out suck AND have no real assets to watch develop like the Astros did for awhile. We're pretty lucky. Strongly advise all Sox fans to download MILB First Pitch app as you can quickly and easily follow our systems minor league games. I've been using it to follow the box scores of our prospects each game. Now it really is about player development as we look to guide our young talent through the system. We have to remember that growing pains and struggles are going to happen. Major trades are likely over, unless they get a great offer for Abreu/Avi, so it will be upto Hahn and Co. to do well in minor trades/rule V draft/2018 and 2019 drafts, free agency etc.

QUOTE (yesterday333 @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 12:40 PM) No one is saying you cant disagree but every time Collins (or any other player we drafted) gets brought up, people have to chime in with, "we could've had this player I wanted." It gets pretty old. I'm happy Collins is in the system as we were lacking catching prospects for sure. I'm also happy that Zevala and Skoug are in the system as well to give it more depth. I'm pretty satisfied with who we have drafted in 2016 and 2017 so far.

QUOTE (Quin @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:39 AM) What in the hell is the Kyle Lewis obsession? What has he shown that someone like Rutherford hasn't? Lewis has shown power, both in college and limited pro sample size. I'm still high on Rutherford, but eventually the power will have to start showing up if he is going to stick as a corner outfielder. I'm not obsessed with Lewis, but feel is is a better overall prospect than Collins at this stage. I get organizationally we needed a catcher, but I think we fell in love with Collins' 2016 junior season. Lewis raked in college, albeit at a smaller program, for two full seasons. What is done is done, but I'm still allowed to respectfully disagree with the organization's draft decision from 2016.

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:20 AM) He only hit .300 his first 2 years at Miami. That isn't a great BA for a college hitter, certainly not for a first round pick. If the that is the real Zack Collins, and the .360 hitter from his junior year is just an outlier, then based on college and pro stats in 3 out of the last 4 years you have a below average to poor hitter, someone who can work the count and also strikeout a bunch at the same time with average to above average defense. That adds to about a .220/.320/.400 hitter at the big leagues if he gets there. But of course he won't hit .220 every year, some years he may hit .240 and become a viable starter (much better than what we get out of Narvaez and Kevan Smith), and some years he may hit below the mendoza line and work himself back to the minor leagues. That's what I expect out of Collins at this point. I'm still a bit annoyed that the Sox passed over Kyle Lewis in favor of Collins, but it's still early enough that Collins could work out. A starting caliber mlb catcher is a very valuable player and hard to find.

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:17 AM) dodger hype Very true^^^

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:14 AM) link Jim Callis‏Verified account @jimcallisMLB 55s55 seconds ago More Jim Callis Retweeted Matt Knox Burger closer to Top 10 3B than #Top100Prospects right now. Have him at No. 13 on stacked @WhiteSox list, only 8 Sox on Top 100.

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 25, 2017 -> 11:00 AM) Not really I see the '19-'20 rotation like this Kopech Rodon Giolito Guerrero Hansen Burdi Lopez Fulmer I think Giolito makes it even if its less than was initially anticipated. I think Lopez will absolutely get the chance to remain a starter, he seems to have turned the corner as of late. MLB.com's rankings seems very lazy to me. How do many players increase or drop in scouting reports since the draft for no apparent reason? How is Jeren Kendall a top 100 prospect and FV "55" after being rated a "50" in the draft? 4 good games in rookie ball? Makes little sense given his high strikeout rate.