OmarComing25

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 04:14 PM) That team was supposed to be competitive. They had a $115 million+ opening day payroll. They increased their payroll significantly from 2012. Saying the 2013 white sox were a laughable roster is the same hindsight as saying the 2015 roster was. We were supposed to compete those years and talked like it during the offseason. Yeah I don't think anyone expected a team that almost won the division in 2012 to tank so badly. We definitely wanted to compete in 2013. The only true rebuilding year was 2014.

QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:35 PM) Red Sox would absolutely trade Betts for Sale, IMO On second thought you're right, but he certainly isn't going to be headlining a huge haul. Maybe him and one decent prospect.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:49 PM) He has a 2.74 FIP. 3.35 in the second half though, and 4.32 in September/October. However, a large part of that is giving up HR on over 20% of his flyballs, which probably won't happen again. That said, he really needs to cut down on HRs next year.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:42 PM) The market for Sale would be an all time high. Ya you could go spend the fortune on someone like Price but Sale is a great young LHP under reasonable control and hitting his prime. Maybe if the free agent SP was thin I could see that, but it's the best it's been since I can remember, so I don't see how that doesn't affect the market for Sale.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:39 PM) In-game decisions is, to me, an important part, but not the crucial part. Are they fundamentally sound? Do they execute well? Do they run the bases smartly? Do they hit the cut off man? Do they hit the other way? Do they know how to move runners over? Do they play as a team? How does the club carry itself? Does it have confidence? Does it know how to win, and find ways to win? Are players put in the best position to succeed? Or used in ways that make that harder? And are players held accountable when they screw up, so as to be brought back to playing the right way? I don't get the feeling Robin Ventura does ANY of this well. And certainly the Sox don't do any of it well. These guys have played professional baseball for years and years, they shouldn't need to be taught this stuff by the manager. Especially the veterans that we brought in. If Melky Cabrera suddenly forgets how to hit the cut-off man after he puts on a White Sox uniform, I don't see how that's on Ventura.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:25 PM) Who were the runner-ups when Verlander/Kershaw won? I'm too high to look for myself. Stanton finished 2nd last year, and Ellsbury finished 2nd in 2011. Neither were anywhere close to Harper this year. He's having a very, very special year. The Nationals have actually scored more runs than last year and that's with everyone in their lineup except Harper regressing pretty bad from last season.

QUOTE (ewokpelts @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:24 PM) Believe it or note, but market for sale is actually quite small. Teams like the Dodgers and Yankees have money to blow and will usually just get a guy in free agency. Teams with impact players/ can't miss prospects like the Cubs won't want to part with their own cost controlled talent. The sox aren't "screwed" in this situation, but they really can't explore every option. Better to build around sale( which they did in the rotation, even if it's lefty heavy), and bank on his loyalty paying off in the next contract. Have to agree with you there. I doubt we'll be able to get the haul we're seeking. The Cubs wouldn't do a Bryant-Sale trade straight-up, and I probably wouldn't do it if I were them either. Same with the Red Sox and Betts.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 02:26 PM) He probably won't get it. But he's the MVP, imo. Take him away from the Cubs and they're (gross) the White Sox. Arrieta was not worth 20+ wins by himself, that's absurd. If Harper doesn't win the MVP then the award is a joke.

I'll honestly be shocked if Arrieta doesn't win it at this point. Lowest 2nd half ERA in history, the ERA difference between him and Greinke is pretty small now, and he has the no-hitter. He also has a much better FIP and SIERA. We all know wins suck as a stat but he also has that working for him as well.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 07:56 AM) Even using my preferred "we're not competitive in 2016 and we need to act like it" model, there's no reason why this team can't be back to the top of the division in 2017 or 2018. We've got at least 1 more shot before the pressure really starts to rise to move him. When the White Sox do their "all in" thing again next year, trade Quintana for some career NL hitter close to free agency and come back totally surprised that the 2016 roster flopped just like the 2015 roster, then suddenly we'll have Sale for only 3 years and we'll be staring another year that should be a developmental year in the face. That's when the pressure starts rising. The time when I'd guess the price for Sale would line up with the price teams would pay for Sale will come sometime around 2017-2018. Moving everything for a guy with 2-2.5 years remaining is a gamble teams will take and one that would make sense for the White Sox. Of course, they'll still be insisting that their 15 games under .500 team is right there, so we won't even do that. Thanks, now I'm going to have nightmares about us trading Quintana for Frazier, who proceeds to put up a sub-.700 OPS here. Really really hope they're planning for 2017, if we catch some breaks (LaRoche bouncing back, Sale pitching like 2014, two of Thompson/Saladino/Sanchez hitting well enough to stick with their defense, Johnson pitching much better than Samardzija this year), we could still contend next year, but don't expect it and don't sacrifice any pieces for 2017 or tie yourself down with more big contracts. That really is the best move at this point.

Boston is going to finish just under .500, and that's with Porcello and Sandoval being far worse than anyone could reasonably expect. They sign a top SP and even if they do nothing else, I could easily see them winning 90+ games next year if those two guys bounce back a little.

QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 02:28 PM) Around the time the Cubs were looking to hire Maddon, all the sports radio guys would talk to experts from Baseball Prospectus, etc. They all believe that managers matter very little over the course of the season with regards to in-game decisions. Maybe a 3-5 game difference at best. The big impact is on preparation and scouting (ie...Pirates over the last few years). All you have to is look at the salaries. If managers mattered much more than that, they'd be getting big-time money. A player who can add 5 wins to your team could command $25 million a year. Meanwhile, the top managers in the game are getting paid less than some bench players. That should be pretty telling.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 09:21 PM) Disgusted. As I wrote elsewhere, managers should be assigned WAR. If they were, I'd give Ventura a -5 to -8 range. Just pulling that out of a hat. But I think there is no question managers make a difference. And it starts with whether the team plays good fundamental baseball. Do they field well, or as well as they could give their talent? Do they run the bases well? Do they move runners over? Bunt if called upon? If they dont, this is a managerial problem. Anyone think the Giants win the World Series without Bochy? Any of the 3 they just won? Managers also make in game decisions that win and lose games. Ventura is not good here either. They set lineups, decide who sits, etc. Ultimately, how can Ventura hold any player accountable when he hasn't been held accountable himself?? Another wasted year coming up. Sox could be better, but there is no way they will overcome the anchor that Ventura is for the team. I don't live in Chicago, but I'm not going to see them when they come to DC or Baltimore. And it's hard for me because I have a 12 year old son who loves baseball. If you think managers have enough of an impact to have -5 or -8 WAR then they are vastly underpaid. No way. Also, Bochy is a good manager but to me the Giants are the poster-child for why baseball playoffs are a crap shoot. They won because Cody Ross randomly became Mike Trout for a few series and Bumgarner became Superman.

After the last off-season, I think questioning JR's desire to make the White Sox better doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The moves may have mostly backfired, but you don't spend all that money on free agents just due to shareholders. He's too loyal and slow to make changes in the front office, but that's a different conversation.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 06:26 PM) I am a White Sox fan living on the east coast. I also agree that managers get too much blame and credit. But I did see a good number of Tampa bay games in person the last few years and always thought Maddon got a lot out of a roster with limitations. I have not seen a single Cub game. But they had one hell of a reversal this season. I would think Maddon is a manager that has an impact. Maddon is a good manager but the impact even a good manager can have on overall wins is pretty minimal. The Rays have won more games in 2015 than they did last year, and they made few changes in the off-season and were ravaged by injuries this year.

QUOTE (flavum @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 05:58 PM) Simon vs Sale Sox lineup Eaton CF Ramirez SS Cabrera DH Thompson LF Shuck RF LaRoche 1B Flowers C Sanchez 2B Saladino 3B Tigers lineup Davis LF Romine 1B J.D. Martinez RF Castellanos 3B Marte DH McCann C Machado SS J. Wilson 2B Gose CF Team that loses 2 out of 3 gets the higher draft pick. And people said we weren't playing meaningful baseball in October this year!

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 06:09 PM) Manager barely matters unless it is someone as insane and toxic as Ozzie. Ned Yost was the biggest dumb piece of s*** manager in baseball, until their young players finally started playing well. Now he's a genius. And if you want to argue "hey, I never said Ned Yost is a genius," then look at the Royals record and see how much the manager matters if you have a lineup full of valuable players. The amount of anger and vitriol heaped on Robin is at about a 10 when it should be more like a 1.5. Well said, agree with everything here. Managers get too much credit when a team wins, and too much blame when a team loses.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 04:56 PM) Not sure why I didn't say manager but yeah, you know what I meant. Sounds like crazy talk but I still believe in the whole "Any fan in the stands can manage" line Hawk dropped awhile ago. I don't agree that managers are worthless, but I do agree their value is way over-stated by a lot of fans. The difference between a good and bad manager is a handful of wins at best.

His point is that things can change fast in baseball, and he's right. Hell over half of the teams in baseball this year will have a 10+ swing in wins in either direction from 2014.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 02:03 PM) Just wondering. Who is Jeff Sullivan? Mark A writer on Fangraphs, he usually is very pessimistic when it comes to the White Sox, so I thought that comment was interesting. Then again, the competition among teams 10 under .500 is pretty light, so it could mean nothing.

From Jeff Sullivan's chat today: Comment From Rexdale Of all the teams 10+ games under .500 who do like best next year? 11:26 Jeff Sullivan: A’s, then White Sox Comment From Nick What would be the best way for the White Sox to fix their 3b problem? Is Quintana and his favorable contract too much for 8 years and$100m of a 30 year old Longoria… too little for Arenado? 10:36 Jeff Sullivan: oh what the hell. sign Juan Uribe!

QUOTE (Baron @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 12:52 PM) That's where you have to spend it. But they wont ofcourse. Probably just a few role players and the "all is well" speech. I'd love to get Heyward, but to be fair I can't really remember the last big free agent that was worth his contract. You basically have to over-spend, and in the position we're in with all our holes it's not a good idea to over-spend. It's highly unlikely to get surplus value (or even equal value) on free agents, even (especially?) the top ones.

This does kind of feel like the year to do it. The Cardinals are injured and their pitching has fallen off a bit as of late. The Pirates have to beat Arrieta. The Dodgers have sucked against teams over .500 this year, and though the Mets' offense is much improved vs. the last time they faced the Cubs, their pitching has also slipped lately and they did go 0-7 against the Cubs. That said, the playoffs are a crap shoot and baseball rarely fails to surprise you. I wouldn't be all that surprised if the Wild Card game turned into an 11-10 shootout instead of the pitching duel everyone is expecting, because baseball.

I've heard a lot of talk about unbalanced schedules lately, but I see two issues that remain even if we were to "balance" them out like they were before the divisions. 1. Teams like Oakland and Seattle are going to get boned with all the extra mileage they would have to endure, which is already a big disadvantage they have to deal with. 2. Even if you face the same teams as everyone else, it's highly unlikely you're going to face the same set of pitchers as everyone else, some teams are going to luck out and miss more aces, while an unlucky team will face them more often. This is a problem unique to baseball. Obviously there's nothing you can do about #2, but this means that even with 100% balanced schedules some teams are still going to get a raw deal compared to a balanced schedule system in other sports.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Oct 2, 2015 -> 12:08 PM) Yay can't wait for another offseason for him/the org to make excuses that he wasn't healthy during the season. He actually was fine in 2014, I'd definitely take a ~.700 OPS from the catching position, the problem is there's little chance of him repeating that, especially considering a lot of his 2014 production was fueled by a high BABIP.