Black_Jack29

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 07:30 PM) Shields' peripherals are awful. He's Latos with much better luck. They should dump him and save the $22 million if they can. I think Robertson could be moved even if claimed and Morneau should clear and be moved as well. Could see some action this month. I don't think that the Sox will get anything of value in return for Morneau, and he doesn't make enough money for a salary-dump. If anything, they might want to consider offering him a contract extension on the cheap. I'd like him at DH more than Avi.

QUOTE (southsideirish71 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 07:32 PM) WAT Yep, does not compute

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 06:10 PM) I've always thought that this trade is a lot more doable in the off-season and honestly, I think Sale will be traded to Boston sometime this winter meetings. I think Boston will fall apart due to their pitching and cave for Sale. What will it be? Not sure. QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 06:28 PM) The importance of centerfield. Betts can and did play center field for Boston. But Bradley forced the move to RF. Bradley may have the most best/accurate arm from CF in baseball. Betts may be a little better offensively but he is not the CF Bradley is. He is a good RF. He also has a Fenway swing and as you state is younger. If Moncada and Benintendi are ML ready after this year, they might be tempted to move Betts + for Q. Seems like rumors in Boston was Sale was really not for sale and won't be in the winter. Agreed on both counts. Even after Big Poopie retires, the Red Sox will still have a ton of offensive talent, and I don't foresee DD wanting to rely heavily on Porcello. Price has been iffy in the recent past as well. I think that one of the "B" outfielders ends up in Chicago. I still see the Sox dealing Sale instead of Q, but perhaps I'll be proven wrong.

QUOTE (bighurt574 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 04:40 PM) If Shields is a pure salary dump, they might as well keep him. After the rough start, he's basically pitching as well as they likely expected. Why dump the guy, unless 2017 is a complete rebuild year? If he keeps pitching well, he probably has a bit of surplus value (taking into account the SD money). If Sox don't believe that Fulmer is ready to join the rotation next season, they should keep Shields for another year and hope for the best. If not, there's no reason for Shields to be on the roster.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 04:35 PM) A couple of thoughts: 1. We are not getting Bradley or Bogaerts for Sale. They are All-Stars playing prime positions. Betts + some prospect package is very doable. I don't see how Betts and Bradley are all that different in value. Betts is younger than Bradley and can also play CF. If Dombrowski isn't willing to give up his two best prospects in a deal for Sale, I think that one of the "B" outfielders needs to be part of the package. If DD isn't amenable to either of those scenarios, I don't see how trading Sale to the Red Sox benefits the White Sox.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 04:20 PM) Wrong. The Red Sox have become a corporate boom since the late 90's. With corporations buying up blocks of box and grandstand sections, the average fan is forced to compete for the non-season ticket seats. That has driven up demand and price and was the reason they got creative adding seats instead of building a new stadium. Most other teams have made done the same thing. The average fan can't afford to purchase box or club-level seats for a family of four at the Cell these days. The reason why they added seats to Fenway, rather than build a new stadium is the same reason why they did it a Wrigley: nobody wants those stadiums torn down. They're iconic. You're also forgetting that a larger chunk of baseball's revenue is coming from TV deals these days. Ticket sales don't drive the bulk of revenue that they used to.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 03:59 PM) If fans aren't able to vent, or post opinions why is this web site available? I thought that this web site was for the purpose of serious baseball discussion, not childish emotional incontinence. But apparently I was wrong about that.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 03:43 PM) Au contraire mon ami, I can b**** on Soxtalk about it! And that'll totally fix everything! A friend of mine is a huge Mets fan, but doesn't spend his time on message boards b****ing about how the Wilpons screwed his team by getting into bed with Madoff. He's had to focus his energy on the adult aspects of life, such as getting laid off and dealing with a child who has vision problems due to a birth defect.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 03:28 PM) why should we let the current group of incompetent management drive us away from the team entirely? If you can't buy the team from Reinsdorf's ownership group, there's not much that you can do about it.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 02:45 PM) If it's money coming from the Padres, I don't think it matters. Shields is owed almost $50M (including the buyout) for the remainder of his contract. The Padres are only paying $22M of that, and that money is going to the Sox. If I'm a contender that's trying to trade for Shields, I want the Sox to pay me the $22M from the Padres, and I'd probably want the Sox to eat an additional $5M of Shields' contract. And I'm not going to give up much in return for Shields if I have to take on $20M+ of salary for a pitcher near the end of his career. From the Sox's perspective, it's a partial salary dump with no player of value in return. It might make more sense for the Sox to have Shields at $10M next year as their #5 and trade him in July of 2017, when he's only owed $23M. If Shields sucks in 2017 (a distinct possibility) the Sox will have to eat $23M. They may want to avoid that scenario, or they may not care that much with Frazier, Melky, etc. coming off the books.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 01:41 PM) Melky and Robertson dont have a chance to clear waivers. But they should make it to a contender you could maybe work something out with. Would be wise to monitor injuries and perhaps delay putting them through. Shields will 200% clear. Hes the only chip here. The Sox would have to send cash to a trading partner for Shields. I don't see that happening.

QUOTE (bighurt574 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 12:44 PM) He'll be put on waivers, but if you put in a claim, they may just give him to you at this point. This is probably correct. The Dodgers are probably more interested in dumping his remaining contract than trying to get something useful in return.

QUOTE (LVSoxFan @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 11:54 AM) I knew something was up when Sale lit in to KW on-air after the LaRoche fiasco. I've never seen a player go after a team president like that while still playing for him. That's when I knew something was quite wrong. A great April of course makes everything disappear--until it stopped being great. Sale even took a shot at Ventura recently (after the jersey thing)--what that shows me is that the elite players (all two or three of them) know that they're surrounded by incompetence and it's harder and harder to tolerate it anymore. No, these incidents both involve Sale and show that Sale is a childish idiot. Recall that Sale got into a shouting match with Kenny Williams during his rookie year because Kenny wanted to use Sale as a closer. Sale throws temper-tantrums when he doesn't get his way, and I can't wait until he's traded for a package of young, talented players.

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 10:32 AM) And that team in the north hasn't won a world series in over 100 years. I imagine their fan base will increase if they became a dynasty like the Yankees. That will be especially bad for the White Sox if they continue to be inept. Again, the Red Sox didn't permanently take over all of the Northeast after they had their own Yankees-like dynasty. Given that the majority of the Cubs fan base consists of very casual fans, any bump that the Cubs get in popularity from a WS is unlikely to be permanent.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 10:24 AM) Well things aren't going well on a number of fronts for this organization including the worst stretch of sustained bad baseball since the period from 1968-1980 if they have their seventh losing season in ten years this year...but moving? Just can't see it because of the good stadium lease and the money the franchise is making. And make no bones about it, they are in good shape financially. Mark The only thing that would force the Sox to move will be a significant erosion of the economic environment of the Chicago area. If Chicago turns into Detroit, I don't think that it could support two baseball teams. But I don't see that happening.

QUOTE (shipps @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 10:16 AM) That may be but that isnt the point really. They havent even hit rock bottom yet, if you can believe that. It is feasible that its only going to get worse from here, not better, seeing the direction or lack of direction as a franchise is leading a detached fan base. Yes, but they still have a LONG way to go before they hit rock bottom. You and others seem to assume that their current trajectory isn't going to change until they can't draw flies and are forced to move to Las Vegas. I really doubt that's going to happen. Look at the Sox in the '90s. They went from division champs to the best team in the AL to the strike. And then they began selling off their pitching staff, tried to get back to competitiveness with two key FA signings, sold off at the end of July, and pissed off the fan base again. Then they continued to lose key players to free agency and bottomed out in 1999. Then they won 95 games in 2000 and their fortunes were suddenly reversed. I'm not saying that the Sox are going to win 95 games next year (or the following year), but history strongly suggests that they're not going to marinate in mediocrity forever and eventually fade into nonexistence. They have a handful of really nice players who are under contract for the next 4-5 years and a farm system that's beginning to come back. If they can trade Sale sometime in the next 12 months, they'll be in even better shape down the road.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 09:38 AM) I'd take a flyer on Puig. I thought a Shields - Puig swap made some sense. The only reason I'd consider doing this would be the salary. If the Dodgers want Saladino or somebody cheap for Puig, forget it. And even then, Puig appears to be a clubhouse cancer and his declining offensive stats (currently a .700 OPS) make me lean towards passing.

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 09:31 AM) ESPECIALLY if that other Chicago team goes on a Yankees like run and takes over the city. What young kid is going to want to be a White Sox fan? The Cubs have been the most popular team in Chicago since the mid-80s. Win or lose, they have fans. Same goes for the Red Sox in the Northeast. Their fan base hasn't changed much since 2004.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Aug 2, 2016 -> 09:35 AM) In terms of organizational strength (personnel), the Sox are much weaker now than in 1998; 1988 may have been weaker, but that was in the process of changing, with successive drafts of Thomas, Ventura, McDowell and Fernandez et al, coupled with several clever trades, the type of which Williams/Hahn were unable to accomplish (and really aren't trying to accomplish). The Sox farm system was in better shape in those years, but Reinsdorf was threatening to move the Sox to Florida in 1988. In the late '90s, the Sox were still reeling from the '94 strike and the White Flag trade. People need to step off the ledge and stop with the drama. The Sox have most definitely been in worse shape in the past than they are now.

Similar posts could have been made back in 1988 and 1998. I'd argue that the Sox are in a better situation now than they were in those years.

Abreu *hates* DHing, so expect him to play 1B for the vast majority of next year.

QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:41 PM) JR doesn't want the team to suck too badly since the TV contract will be negotiated in a year or two. That makes even more sense. Who knows, maybe JR will go "all-in" and overpay for Reddick and another bat this winter.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:32 PM) FWIW---Boston had a Trade Deadline Show w Jerry Remy and 2 Boston Beat Writers. They indicated multiple sources said the Dodgers were the only team who thought they could make a deal for Sale. Texas and Boston were not giving up what Hahn wanted and moved on. Dodgers finally switched their attention to Hill mid-day. There was some discussion that JR was not trading Sale regardless of the package. They don't think Sale will "really" be available in the winter either. Maybe tomorrow we will hear some more rumors. However, we saw how wrong most of the pre-deadline rumors turned out so many of these post deadline rumors are just as wrong So perhaps JR is just that desperate for another shot at a ring before he steps down? That doesn't sound too far-fetched and would explain why things never materialized today.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:20 PM) This clubhouse is a disaster anyways. At least he has upside. Avi doesn't. He can't get along with teammates, his OPS has fallen in each of the past few seasons (now down to .700), and he's owed about $19M. No thanks.

QUOTE (Footlongcomiskeydog @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 06:21 PM) They are most definitly going for it again next year. The lack of activity today proves that. Sale and Q aren't going anywhere during the offseason. The question is whether or not Jerry will open up the pocketbooks to bring in a couple of impact bats. Jerry won't out-bid teams for Cespedes, Reddick, Rasmus, etc.