Black_Jack29

QUOTE (CyAcosta41 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:32 AM) What is the deadline today (CST)? I believe it's 3 pm CT.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:29 AM) Yeah I mean I will be a bit disappointed if no big moves are made, but if at least a few of these moves aren't made, I will be really angry. I wouldn't necessarily be angry if nothing is done today, as the Sox have all winter to deal these players. But I agree with you in principle.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:16 AM) I'm not arguing with your opinion of his value, I'm just telling you there's no way that deal ever happens. I'm just trying to set expectations. Fair enough. If DD values his farm system that much, we're better off pursuing somebody like Bradley or Betts. And that would most likely be done in the offseason.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:11 AM) I'm gonna trust Nightengale, who is always right about us, when he says that it's 50/50 on Sale getting moved today, over Stark, who said it's 5/95. I hope that you're right, but Stark's analysis seems more plausible to me. Boston is the best trading partner for us now and it might make more sense for them to wait until the winter meetings. I get the impression that they might be more willing to move somebody like Betts than Moncada, and they may not want to do that now.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:06 AM) Also, DD "caving" is NOT going to include Moncada/Benintendi AND Devers/Kopech. If Hahn somehow talks him into the first two being included, anything else is gonna be light. Moncada and Benintiendi are prospects, not proven ML talent. And I don't think that those two plus an average prospect or a mediocre bullpen arm are enough for 3+ years of a bornerline-HOF pitcher with a ridiculously cheap contract.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:01 AM) What's gonna be most frustrating to me is if Sale is moved, but Sox hold onto pieces like Frazier, Melky, Robertson, Shields, Gonzalez. If you trade Sale, trade everyone cause you're going to suck anyway. I don't think he's going to get traded, but we're sort of running out of time to make other moves if he is. I agree, with the caveat that you can't trade both Sale and Q and expect to compete in a couple of years. I'd actually be in favor of trying to sign Frazier to an extension.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 10:58 AM) Boston has some positions that are set long-term, those being held by Pedroia, Betts, and Bogaerts. Moncada could move to third, sure, but then you have Devers who would also come up and play... what, DH then? Pedroia is 32. He seems the most likely to eventually move and be replaced by Moncada. It might be possible to move him to LF.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 10:39 AM) red sox seem to be most heavily involved for chris sale at moment. big question: would they do both moncada & benintendi? https://twitter.com/JonHeyman/status/760137549423706112 If I'm Hahn, the answer is that they'd have to. The packages I'd accept would include... Sale for Moncada, Benintiendi, Kopech, and Devers Sale and Melky for (Bradley or Betts) + Kopech and (Devers or Benintiendi) If Dombrowski won't agree to that and I can't get something of similar value from another organization, I politely tell DD that we should talk again during the winter meetings.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 07:29 AM) Huh???t. Boston is short a LF right now w Young out and Holt still recovering. Why would they trade their LF heir apparent and their CF and replace w Melky when they are in the pennant chase. Why? Because they're getting a corner outfielder in the deal. And, more importantly, because they're going to have to give up big-time talent when they trade for three years of a perennial Cy Young candidate with a ridiculous bargain contract. Especially when they're taking their best prospect off the table. Wrong, Betts played 133 games in CF last season. Sorry, but if Bradley (or Betts) and Moncada are untouchable, Sale isn't going to Boston.

QUOTE (Flash Tizzle @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 10:16 PM) Duke and Jones will be the two pieces moved. Jones will be dealt for a AAA catcher we'll plug into the spot next season when we go for it again........ I hope not.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 10:23 PM) I've pondered that but don't see it. I can't believe Bruce has more buzz than Melky who has none. I don't know why Melky isn't attracting more attention either. My guess is that Bradley or Betts might be available this winter.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 10:14 PM) To echo everyone else, no. It's bad enough they won't give up Moncada. It's Benintendi package or no deal. I think they budge because they need Quintana. Their staff as is is bad enough. If DD really doesn't want to give up Moncada, I'd throw in Melky and ask for Bradley, Benintendi, and one of their top two pitching prospects.

QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 09:45 PM) Can anybody hack Hahn's Fitbit and see if he has gone to sleep yet tonight? I think it's a safe bet that he and Kenny have been at the office for the past couple of evenings and probably aren't going home until tomorrow afternoon.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 09:32 PM) Rumors are that Boston doesn't want to move Moncada or Benintendi. Hahn probably hung up on them if that's the case. Yeah, there's no way I'd agree to that. Unless DD wants to trade Bradley or Betts, though I doubt he'd do that before the end of the season.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 09:27 PM) What if Boston agreed to those three but only those three? I'd throw in Melky and try to get one of their outfielders.

QUOTE (Tony @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 09:14 PM) That is 100% part of it too, Black_Jack. Again, every time either starts for the Sox, you are now rolling the dice on an incredibly important piece for the future of your franchise. Yep, and if Sale blows out his elbow next June, is Q even tradeable at that point? The Sox would have Rodon, Fulmer, and three holes to fill going into 2018 without Q.

QUOTE (Tony @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 09:08 PM) IF Sale and Quintana really are on the market, then waiting isn't smart. As others have mentioned, the true value of Sale and Q is cost control and age. Every start they make for the White Sox diminishes that value. Waiting a "year or two from now" will substantially lessen their value. Additionally, I'm incredibly uncomfortable with the thought that Rick Hahn and Kenny Williams STILL don't know what lane to pick, and if they believe they can't get proper value for these pitchers, they'll just hold on to them and once again try and make 2017 and 2018 work by piecing together another 78 win team. I don't know how much their values will fall in a year, but one concern I have is the risk of an arm injury. Particularly for Sale, whose mechanics have been deemed by some as unsound.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 08:54 PM) Sure you can. You can just wait a couple years until their price gets to a point in which a team is actually willing to pay. You don't just give up years of control of underpaid aces just to move on. You get full value, or you wait. The problem with that is that the Sox don't have many position players in their farm system that project to be every-day players, and they're not going to be able to do much in free agency this winter. So if you hold on to both Sale and Q until 2019 because you don't feel like other GMs are offering "fair value," the prospects that you desperately needed in 2017 probably won't be ready until 2020 or 2021. Meanwhile, the Sox have no offensive output for years, they toil in mediocrity, and attendance falls and cripples their financial flexibility. I'm not saying that Hahn has to move Sale or Q by tomorrow afternoon, but it would be in the organization's best interest to do it within the next 12 months.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 08:31 PM) Whitesox and Redsox still actively talking trade. Not certain it's for Sale. https://twitter.com/georgeofman/status/759937355029422081 If the Sox were to throw in Melky in a Sale or Q deal, I'm wondering if DD would be willing to part with Betts, in addition to some prospects

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 06:10 PM) Absolute worst time to trade him. Yep, Abreu has very little trade value right now. Hopefully he's been fighting nagging injuries this season and comes back to form in 2017. The Sox desperately need the old Jose.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 06:14 PM) Tilson should get everyday at-bats in CF regardless of what we do with Melky. Coats is simply the next guy in-line for corner outfield playing time if a spot should open up in the very near future. Yep

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 05:39 PM) So, if Boston agreed to Moncada, Benintendi, Devers and Kopeck, you wouldn't be satisfied with that haul for Sale? I think the quality here is more important than the quantity. I don't care if it's 4, instead of 5, as long as they are the right 4. Again, I would guess that Hahn's insistence on "5 prospects" was always just a starting position, from which he was willing to negotiate. Just as I suspect the Dombrowski's refusal to deal Moncada is posturing. No one is going to start right out with their ultimate position. I think that Hahn would eventually take that deal. I'm sure that he and Kenny have sketched out several trade scenarios for what they believe Sale or Q is worth, and other "close enough" scenarios that they would initially resist, but eventually agree to.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 05:36 PM) The problem is the value of these assets diminishes as the length of the team-friendly term is reduced. I hear you, there is still time, but at some point, you either s*** or get off the pot. Hahn doesn't have to deal right now, though. He can wait until the winter meetings if he doesn't like what other teams are willing to trade at the moment.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 05:15 PM) That would be so incredibly risky IMO. First off, your odds of building winner for the 2017 are incredibly low. Second, you're passing on potential value that guys like Melky & Gonzalez could get you now. Finally, you're gambling that your prized assets don't get hurt between now and next July. Why take that risk? This organization needs to be smart for once and blow things up between now and the offseason. I agree with you and Shack, but I don't think that the Sox are going to do that.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 31, 2016 -> 05:08 PM) You shouldn't be worrying about that going into the beginning of a rebuild. They need to assemble as much young talent as possible and figure out how to piece it together later. Who said the Sox are going into a rebuild right now? If they are, they need to move either Sale or Q between now and March. Guys like Melky and Robertson aren't going to get you enough talent to do it properly. I think it's a lot more likely that the Sox try to retool a little over the next six months and save the major trades for next July.