What to do at the Trade Deadline

[Chicago White Sox]

I can't remember a player of Sale's caliber being made available in quite sometime. When you consider his status on the field, his ridiculous contract and his age, he might be untradable but with that being said if the Sox were going to trade him they would need to get something better than what the Indians got for Bartolo Colon, something totally ridiculous.

I'd want four top 100 prospects plus some lottery tickets for Sale. And I'd want one of those prospects to be a top 10-15 guy and another a top 30-40 type.

[Big Hurtin]

Dodgers are interested in Longoria so why not Frazier ? /snip

 

Um, 'cause Longoria doesn't suck.

[2Dbill]

I’m enjoying the debate.

I’m for a rebuild.

The trades for a rebuild take time and usually seem to take about a year and a half to be fully complete(so part now and the rest this winter thru next year). I also believe that we should take on salary where it make sense to make our trade players more valuable.

I would leave the core players (Sale/Q/Rodon/Eaton/Abreu) alone until this baseball year(2016) is complete.

 

I would trade Frazier to St Louis for pitcher Luke Weaver and the Cardinal’s supplemental pick in the 2017 draft. Matt Carpenter and Jhonny Peralta are currently on the Dl so they need coverage at third.

 

I would trade Shields and Robertson and 10 million dollars to the Rangers for infielder Justin Profar and pitcher Ariel Jurado. I know some might consider this a reach but the Rangers need starting pitching and relief help.

I’m including the 10 million because Roberson is being paid as an elite reliever when he is a step below that(forgetting last night). Hopefully this makes the offer more appealing.

 

I would trade Melky Cabrera and 7million dollars to Seattle for pitcher Edwin Diaz. Seattle is using Diaz in a set up relief role. We could move Nate Jones to the closer role and Diaz to Nate’s old set up role.

 

I would do a three way trade with San Francisco sending Brett Lawrie , Austin Jackson and Jacob May to SF for pitcher Tyler Beede I would then trade Tyler Beede and Ariel Jurado to Colorado for outfielder Ramiel Tapia and catcher Tom Murphy.

I love Tapia all he does is hit and god knows we need some immediate catching help.

 

Except for Profar and Diaz. The new prospects are not the top rated at their positions in their respective farm systems-I guess what I’m trying to say they are more attainable than some of their counterparts.

I always think that teams competing for a playoff spot can get a little carried away in trying to improve their teams and may overpay(at least I hope so).I still think these prospects are valuable players.

After the season ends we could explore trades for some of the core players with the rest completed next year depending how some of these other moves play out. For example If I have to make other trades other than the ones listed above maybe my needs change.

I think the Sox are somewhat different than most teams going for a rebuild because once the above mentioned players are “off the Books” the remaining players are not only very valuable players but very reasonably compensated making them even more valuable.

Usually trades are for players in the final year of their contract or are players that come with a hefty long term contracts.

Hopefully this increases our chances of success.

 

[caulfield12]

White Sox almost never send money to get better prospects....they traditionally do the opposite.

 

As long as Hahn's GM, they also won't turn around and just dump Shields, especially when the state of starting pitching is so thin in the upper levels of the system.

 

We already have plenty of RH relief candidates for the future and Mariners need Diaz to compete for wild card this season...would trade us prospects instead or no deal with them.

Edited July 19, 2016 by caulfield12

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Um, 'cause Longoria doesn't suck.

 

Yet another insightful comment but the Longoria contract is HUGE . He is signed through 2022 with a team option for 2023 .From 2017 to 2022 his contract has $94M left on it plus whatever is left on his $11.5 M this year if/when he is traded. He is also been injury prone. Why anyone, even the Dodgers, would want that is beyond me.

 

Frazier on the other hand is arbitration eligible next year. this year he makes $8.25M so lets say he gets $10M in arb next year plus whatever is left over from this year if the trade is made. Lets call it $14M for a year+ of Frazier in age 30-31 vs. 6+ maybe $98M for Longoria in his age 30-36 years. Throw in Longoria's history of injuries .

 

$84M difference to get a better player this year and next seems a very steep price to pay. But it's the Dodgers so they have money to burn . But they did bring in Andrew Friedman to supposedly stop some of that free wheeling spending.

Edited July 19, 2016 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[BlackSox13]

Yet another insightful comment but the Longoria contract is HUGE . He is signed through 2022 with a team option for 2023 .From 2017 to 2022 his contract has $94M left on it plus whatever is left on his $11.5 M this year if/when he is traded. He is also been injury prone. Why anyone, even the Dodgers, would want that is beyond me.

 

Frazier on the other hand is arbitration eligible next year. this year he makes $8.25M so lets say he gets $10M in arb next year plus whatever is left over from this year if the trade is made. Lets call it $14M for a year+ of Frazier in age 30-31 vs. 6+ maybe $98M for Longoria in his age 30-36 years. Throw in Longoria's history of injuries .

 

$84M difference to get a better player this year and next seems a very steep price to pay. But it's the Dodgers so they have money to burn . But they did bring in Andrew Friedman to supposedly stop some of that free wheeling spending.

Yep, I cannot think of any playoff contenders that would not be interested in Frazier's 26HR and 59RBI. If I had to chose between Longoria and Frazier, I would chose Frazier every time because that Longoria contract is an albatross.

[NCsoxfan]

I'm worried we're going to run off 5 wins in a row and have Hahn and KW rethink the need to sell!

[Bob Sacamano]

I'm worried we're going to run off 5 wins in a row and have Hahn and KW rethink the need to sell!

 

Rethink? You think they're thinking about selling? That is one thought not even close to in their brains.

[Bananarchy]

Rethink? You think they're thinking about selling? That is one thought not even close to in their brains.

Yeah, my worst fear is the Sox play .500 ball and the FO reconsiders

[2Dbill]

White Sox almost never send money to get better prospects....they traditionally do the opposite.

 

As long as Hahn's GM, they also won't turn around and just dump Shields, especially when the state of starting pitching is so thin in the upper levels of the system.

 

We already have plenty of RH relief candidates for the future and Mariners need Diaz to compete for wild card this season...would trade us prospects instead or no deal with them.

I know we almost never send money in trades but if we are trading a lot of higher priced talent, it would seem that we would have the resources to do so.

As far as asking for Diaz, it never hurts to ask. He does have two loses since they called him up last month but he has 36 strikeouts in 18 innings.

[GreenSox]

White Sox almost never send money to get better prospects....they traditionally do the opposite.

 

As long as Hahn's GM, they also won't turn around and just dump Shields, especially when the state of starting pitching is so thin in the upper levels of the system.

 

We already have plenty of RH relief candidates for the future and Mariners need Diaz to compete for wild card this season...would trade us prospects instead or no deal with them.

Mariners have basically same chance at wild card as Sox do. But their GM is likely more realistic and didn't put himself under the same absurd timetable as Williams/Hahn so I doubt they are buying "this year" players.

[Harry Chappas]

I voted for stand pat.

 

I don't what the Ray Durham / Jon Adkins crap.

 

Sell high or don't sell.

 

If you can flat out win a trade for guys like Lawrie, Frazier, Melkey, Shields, Duke, Robertson or Abreu you do it. I do not want them to give them away.

 

 

 

[bmags]

I've never seen this kind of pressure from Chicago media to sell off before

[shipps]

I've never seen this kind of pressure from Chicago media to sell off before

 

I wondered this morning if the media and fan pressure will sway the Sox FO in what they are going to do next. Historically they seem to be pretty reactionary and do pay careful attention to all that stuff.

[Special K]

4th place in the division, 9 games back of 1st, under .500, and a few days away from August...

 

looking at this objectively, this team is not going anywhere. keep the core and sell pieces like Robertson, Gonzalez (might as well and try and sell high), Shields (if possible), and listen-in on Q for major league ready position players...

[Whisox05]

I wondered this morning if the media and fan pressure will sway the Sox FO in what they are going to do next. Historically they seem to be pretty reactionary and do pay careful attention to all that stuff.

 

Ya last year im sure most fans wanted to sell off and they had worst record then this year and they still tried to add. Dont think fans or media have any indication on what which direction the team should go. Its up to jerry and he wants to win so they will probably try to add

Edited July 20, 2016 by WhiteSoxLifer

[Bananarchy]

I've never seen this kind of pressure from Chicago media to sell off before

The perception in Chicago Sports Media (not the reality) is that the Cubs rebuilt their franchise on blowing everything up and building their minor league system. While a number of good Cubs players went through their minor league system and the Cubs appear to have drafted well, the Cubs FO found a great deal of success making moves that don't involve the farm system.

[bmags]

The perception in Chicago Sports Media (not the reality) is that the Cubs rebuilt their franchise on blowing everything up and building their minor league system. While a number of good Cubs players went through their minor league system and the Cubs appear to have drafted well, the Cubs FO found a great deal of success making moves that don't involve the farm system.

 

I think that's disengenous to them. The demand on the sox that they begin competing very quickly into a rebuild forced them to be buyers in a lot of sellers markets, where they could have received surplus value for some pieces (as we saw in late fall of 2014).

 

But yes, great, cubs didn't draft all of their players. Who cares. We know the narrative by now. You can't rebuild! The Royals were bad for a long time! The Pirates were bad for a while!

 

Yeah they were bad because they had a terrible front office and plan, then they put in good people and are good. I expect the owner to demand good people to do good work as well.

[Dunt]

4th place in the division, 9 games back of 1st, under .500, and a few days away from August...

 

looking at this objectively, this team is not going anywhere. keep the core and sell pieces like Robertson, Gonzalez (might as well and try and sell high), Shields (if possible), and listen-in on Q for major league ready position players...

 

I was thinking about that this morning. With how thin the pitching market is, why not try flipping Gonzalez or Shields? You might actually get a decent piece back and both have atleast another year of control. Not sure how good the piece would be, but Fulmer will be in the rotation next year and there is going to be too many pitchers.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

This organization is starting to draft better the past few seasons. I think they could sell high on some guys and do well. The key would be the lesser known guys they scout and how many they could hit on. I'm down on Hahn and have gone back and forth. I just don't want them to buy. I think they could move guys like Melky, Frazier and Robertson and do well at the deadline. Then wait til offseason to move the one or both of the main studs. Not sure Sale would want to be part of a rebuild. Q might be more willing and you would get a better package from Sale so moving Sale might be the better option if you don't move both. Ideally, you should move both. I'm just speaking hypothetically about if Sale would or wouldn't want to be part of the rebuild obviously.

[Whisox05]

This organization is starting to draft better the past few seasons. I think they could sell high on some guys and do well. The key would be the lesser known guys they scout and how many they could hit on. I'm down on Hahn and have gone back and forth. I just don't want them to buy. I think they could move guys like Melky, Frazier and Robertson and do well at the deadline. Then wait til offseason to move the one or both of the main studs. Not sure Sale would want to be part of a rebuild. Q might be more willing and you would get a better package from Sale so moving Sale might be the better option if you don't move both. Ideally, you should move both. I'm just speaking hypothetically about if Sale would or wouldn't want to be part of the rebuild obviously.

 

 

If the Sox are going to move the likes of frazier, melky, Robertson, etc they should go into full rebuild. Sox dont have anyone internally that can really fill those positions. saladino would either play 3rd or Lawrie gets moved there and saladino goes to 2nd. Im not sold on saladino being a every day player especially if you are tryng to contend. outfield would be eaton, shuck and Garcia till jackson comes back. Thats not very good. Mostly likey jackson is gone after this season and probably so is garcia. Thats 2 spots to fill and next yrs free agent class isnt good. Sale has stated he wants to win and i highly doubt he wants to sit through a rebuild for whats left of his contract with the sox. Frazier, melk and Robertson should bring back prospects but not the quality or quantity sale, Quintana or even abreu would command. If they start selling go full rebuild, dont half do it

[Bigsoxhurt35]

If the Sox are going to move the likes of frazier, melky, Robertson, etc they should go into full rebuild. Sox dont have anyone internally that can really fill those positions. saladino would either play 3rd or Lawrie gets moved there and saladino goes to 2nd. Im not sold on saladino being a every day player especially if you are tryng to contend. outfield would be eaton, shuck and Garcia till jackson comes back. Thats not very good. Mostly likey jackson is gone after this season and probably so is garcia. Thats 2 spots to fill and next yrs free agent class isnt good. Sale has stated he wants to win and i highly doubt he wants to sit through a rebuild for whats left of his contract with the sox. Frazier, melk and Robertson should bring back prospects but not the quality or quantity sale, Quintana or even abreu would command. If they start selling go full rebuild, dont half do it

 

I'm not sure what kind of value Brett Lawrie has. I'd extend him and keep he and Eaton. Keeps those two positions locked down. Lawrie has been what I thought he'd be. Honestly he's what I was hoping Beckham would turn out to be after I knew he wasn't going to be a stud. I'd much rather have Lawrie at second that Sanchez. I agree with a full rebuild I just know this team doesn't like to do it that's why I mentioned maybe keeping one of Q or Sale. I'm just all up in arms about this team so I'm going back and forth about full rebuilds or how they can fix it quicker. That's why I had my 2018 idea about a quicker fix than a full rebuild. I'm not sold on Saladino but he could at least fill a hole temporarily until someone's ready. We have some options down there but not many great ones. I'm hoping Engel can lock down CF next season.

 

 

I'm all for a full rebuild. It can work. At least I think it can with the way they've been drafting.

[SCCWS]

I'm not sure what kind of value Brett Lawrie has. I'd extend him and keep he and Eaton. Keeps those two positions locked down. Lawrie has been what I thought he'd be. Honestly he's what I was hoping Beckham would turn out to be after I knew he wasn't going to be a stud. I'd much rather have Lawrie at second that Sanchez. I agree with a full rebuild I just know this team doesn't like to do it that's why I mentioned maybe keeping one of Q or Sale. I'm just all up in arms about this team so I'm going back and forth about full rebuilds or how they can fix it quicker. That's why I had my 2018 idea about a quicker fix than a full rebuild. I'm not sold on Saladino but he could at least fill a hole temporarily until someone's ready. We have some options down there but not many great ones. I'm hoping Engel can lock down CF next season.

 

 

I'm all for a full rebuild. It can work. At least I think it can with the way they've been drafting.

 

I am not sure what value Robertson has. Contending teams are always looking for closer types. But I think his salary makes him a problem. I thnk the Sox could unload him but get nothing( low prospect) back. If they eat a chunk of his salary they get a good prospect back. But why eat a chunk of his salary at this point and then have to go out and find a less valuable closer who probably would eat up what you saved by dumping him. Jones did not pass the closer test the last time we needed a closer. Tough positions to be in right now

 

[Balta1701]

I'm not sure what kind of value Brett Lawrie has. I'd extend him and keep he and Eaton. Keeps those two positions locked down. Lawrie has been what I thought he'd be. Honestly he's what I was hoping Beckham would turn out to be after I knew he wasn't going to be a stud. I'd much rather have Lawrie at second that Sanchez. I agree with a full rebuild I just know this team doesn't like to do it that's why I mentioned maybe keeping one of Q or Sale. I'm just all up in arms about this team so I'm going back and forth about full rebuilds or how they can fix it quicker. That's why I had my 2018 idea about a quicker fix than a full rebuild. I'm not sold on Saladino but he could at least fill a hole temporarily until someone's ready. We have some options down there but not many great ones. I'm hoping Engel can lock down CF next season.

 

 

I'm all for a full rebuild. It can work. At least I think it can with the way they've been drafting.

If you look back over the past several seasons including this year, Lawrie is going to come out at about a 1.5 fWAR per year player. He's not going to make your franchise but he's no where near a liability. With his level of consistency and ability to play both 2b and 3b, that's a $10 million a year player on this market, give or take. I wouldn't be surprised if extending him took 4/$40 or more on the years side considering he'll be filing for free agency before turning 28.

 

However, he might actually have a bit of motivation to give a discount if you wanted to extend him before that because he's going to hit free agency after 2017 during the huge splurge in spending. With the number of guys who are flat out better players than him on the market he could wind up in the boat guys like Desmond and Fowler were this year - wanting a solid contract but finding that most teams filled their needs or spent their funds on better players. At least, that's the advice I'd be giving him if I were his agent.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

If you look back over the past several seasons including this year, Lawrie is going to come out at about a 1.5 fWAR per year player. He's not going to make your franchise but he's no where near a liability. With his level of consistency and ability to play both 2b and 3b, that's a $10 million a year player on this market, give or take. I wouldn't be surprised if extending him took 4/$40 or more on the years side considering he'll be filing for free agency before turning 28.

 

However, he might actually have a bit of motivation to give a discount if you wanted to extend him before that because he's going to hit free agency after 2017 during the huge splurge in spending. With the number of guys who are flat out better players than him on the market he could wind up in the boat guys like Desmond and Fowler were this year - wanting a solid contract but finding that most teams filled their needs or spent their funds on better players. At least, that's the advice I'd be giving him if I were his agent.

He's young enough and doesn't have great trade value, so you could extend him and that'd give ya one less hole to fill for a few seasons and would give a decent young core to work with while we rebuild. Eaton, Anderson, Lawrie, Rodon and Fulmer.