Chris Sale scratched from start

[chitownsportsfan]

When you're a lame duck like Robin, you allow players to do it. Really shows how Robin isn't in control of the clubhouse whatsoever.

 

Leadership vacuum.

[Quin]

I haven't seen anyone agreeing with what Sale did. It seems to be pretty universally accepted that Chris was wrong. But management definitely shoulders some of the blame here as well.

 

Greg, Mike, a few others in this thread.

[Dunt]

When you're a lame duck like Robin, you allow players to do it. Really shows how Robin isn't in control of the clubhouse whatsoever.

 

False, the very reason Robin is here is because he is a great clubhouse manager. The best really.

[Texsox]

No matter what Robin did posters here would say it was wrong.

[Balta1701]

No matter what Robin did posters here would say it was wrong.

I promise you...had no player cut up theirs or other people's uniforms, no one would be saying Robin was wrong and should have had his players deliberately damage their equipment.

[ptatc]

When you're a lame duck like Robin, you allow players to do it. Really shows how Robin isn't in control of the clubhouse whatsoever.

It doesn't really matter. A 20 something year old man shouldn't act like that. There is nothing management should need to do to keep someone from acting like this. It is on him and him alone. He can be mad about it but no one should ever act like this.

[ptatc]

I promise you...had no player cut up theirs or other people's uniforms, no one would be saying Robin was wrong and should have had his players deliberately damage their equipment.

Correct. It's on sale and sale alone.

[Texsox]

It doesn't really matter. A 20 something year old man shouldn't act like that. There is nothing management should need to do to keep someone from acting like this. It is on him and him alone. He can be mad about it but no one should ever act like this.

 

I'm trying to decide at what age it is appropriate to act this way.

[southsider2k5]

It doesn't really matter. A 20 something year old man shouldn't act like that. There is nothing management should need to do to keep someone from acting like this. It is on him and him alone. He can be mad about it but no one should ever act like this.

 

Seriously. How this is even a thing is beyond me.

[Texsox]

Seriously. How this is even a thing is beyond me.

 

It's an opportunity to complain about the organization and Robin during a frustrating season. If the team was winning, in the race, and Sale missed a start because he didn't like the uniform he'd be the one getting attacked for not being a team player and hurting *our* chances to win the division.

[southsider2k5]

It's an opportunity to complain about the organization and Robin during a frustrating season. If the team was winning, in the race, and Sale missed a start because he didn't like the uniform he'd be the one getting attacked for not being a team player and hurting *our* chances to win the division.

 

This is where the focus should be. Not only did he cost us a start, but he destroyed our bullpen for the time being, which have seen ripple across the last two days of forcing the pen into a really bad situation and forcing guys to be unavailable to do their normal jobs. If Chris Sale doesn't get that you wear the promotional jersey on a promotional day, I'm not sure what else there really is to explain to the guy. This should be about the most obvious thing ever. If your boss tells you to wear something to work, you wear it. Period.

[Hatchetman]

If your boss tells you to wear something to work, you wear it. Period.

 

A lot of guys have gotten in trouble trying that.

[Texsox]

This is where the focus should be. Not only did he cost us a start, but he destroyed our bullpen for the time being, which have seen ripple across the last two days of forcing the pen into a really bad situation and forcing guys to be unavailable to do their normal jobs. If Chris Sale doesn't get that you wear the promotional jersey on a promotional day, I'm not sure what else there really is to explain to the guy. This should be about the most obvious thing ever. If your boss tells you to wear something to work, you wear it. Period.

 

Agreed.

 

Compare this to the "problem" that Jordan had during the Olympics. Puma (iirc) was the uniform sponsor. Rather than be photographed wearing Puma gear, Jordan wrapped himself in an American flag.

 

I wish I could give Sale the benefit of a doubt and say there probably was other things bothering him and this was the outlet. Dunn went a season with extra stress we only learned later. So maybe he's having other issues besides the bullpen blowing wins for him and a uniform that isn't comfortable.

[Baseball palace of world]

Something else to think about. This promotion was also about honoring players like Steve Stone, Harold Baines, Britt Burns, Chet Lemon, Carlton Fisk, Lamar Hoyt, manager Tony LaRussa. Ed Farmer. All wore these uniforms. Chris Sale 100% at fault for his actions. I also take the view that Robin is at fault for creating an environment that allowed Sale to do this. Robin is the worst manager I can remember. Worse than Bevington.

[ptatc]

Something else to think about. This promotion was also about honoring players like Steve Stone, Harold Baines, Britt Burns, Chet Lemon, Carlton Fisk, Lamar Hoyt, manager Tony LaRussa. Ed Farmer. All wore these uniforms. Chris Sale 100% at fault for his actions. I also take the view that Robin is at fault for creating an environment that allowed Sale to do this. Robin is the worst manager I can remember. Worse than Bevington.

worse than Bevington is not correct.

 

The is no environment in what Sale did is the appropriate response. Robin had no influence on this response. No one created an environment to allow for this response. An individual can be angry about something but no one should do what he did, ever.

[kitekrazy]

It doesn't really matter. A 20 something year old man shouldn't act like that. There is nothing management should need to do to keep someone from acting like this. It is on him and him alone. He can be mad about it but no one should ever act like this.

 

Modern day athletes are like that now. They throw a lot of fits. Even moving a player off the plate was a strategic part of baseball. Now it's like "he's trying to hit me". I can't imagine in the 70's a player using a bat in retaliation. Professional sports with it's players and fans have gotten too emotionally out of hand. Celebration is out of hand Watching a guy celebrating a tackle after a 5 yard gain and 20pts down is hard to watch anymore.

 

[southsider2k5]

Something else to think about. This promotion was also about honoring players like Steve Stone, Harold Baines, Britt Burns, Chet Lemon, Carlton Fisk, Lamar Hoyt, manager Tony LaRussa. Ed Farmer. All wore these uniforms. Chris Sale 100% at fault for his actions. I also take the view that Robin is at fault for creating an environment that allowed Sale to do this. Robin is the worst manager I can remember. Worse than Bevington.

 

Sale strikes me as the kind of guy who would have issues under a lot of managers. It is my guess that if you had someone more controlling of the clubhouse it would make things worse, not better, as he would have more to rebel against. The report before was that this was the 4th incident in about 2 years time.

[Baseball palace of world]

worse than Bevington is not correct.

 

The is no environment in what Sale did is the appropriate response. Robin had no influence on this response. No one created an environment to allow for this response. An individual can be angry about something but no one should do what he did, ever.

 

My point is that I just don't see Guillen or LaRussa allowing the players to overrun the clubhouse. Was not defending Sale at all.

[Hatchetman]

So you guys can't handle a top 5 pitcher who throws a temper tantrum a couple times per year? Need to trade him to show who's the boss?

[flavum]

So you guys can't handle a top 5 pitcher who throws a temper tantrum a couple times per year? Need to trade him to show who's the boss?

 

If they find a suitable trade in the next 6 days, great.

 

If they find a suitable trade in the next 6 months, great.

[chw42]

It doesn't really matter. A 20 something year old man shouldn't act like that. There is nothing management should need to do to keep someone from acting like this. It is on him and him alone. He can be mad about it but no one should ever act like this.

 

I don't agree with what Sale did, but this and the Drake LaRoche thing earlier this season shows how the clubhouse goes wild too often. Players like Eaton and Sale go unchecked for the most part. You can't have that. I don't care if they're deemed "leaders" and get to be more vocal. It's clear that Robin's been too nice and players just get to do whatever the hell they want. It shouldn't take the VP and General Manager to handle s*** like this.

[Balta1701]

Sale strikes me as the kind of guy who would have issues under a lot of managers. It is my guess that if you had someone more controlling of the clubhouse it would make things worse, not better, as he would have more to rebel against. The report before was that this was the 4th incident in about 2 years time.

However - if you've got 4 incidents in only 2 years time, you've made a strong case to try something different, because clearly what is being tried right now is failing to deal with the problem and instead seemingly allowing it to get worse.

[ptatc]

So you guys can't handle a top 5 pitcher who throws a temper tantrum a couple times per year? Need to trade him to show who's the boss?

Depends on your version of temper tantrum. Screaming obscenities at your boss. Ok he didn't really do much. Attacking other people's property with a knife? If you're ok with that there are other issues involved.

[soulfly]

This whole thing is comical. If he didn't want to wear it, why not just cut up his own jersey and his alone?

 

If he did cut up other jerseys, other than his own, it begs the question, where was everyone else when this happened? You're telling me there wasn't a single other player in the clubhouse when this happened? Seems silly that other guys were in there and just let that happen. If there were other guys on the team there, it should have ended with cutting his own jersey. End of story.

 

This team sorely needs a real leader to stop things like this from happening in the first place.

[ptatc]

I don't agree with what Sale did, but this and the Drake LaRoche thing earlier this season shows how the clubhouse goes wild too often. Players like Eaton and Sale go unchecked for the most part. You can't have that. I don't care if they're deemed "leaders" and get to be more vocal. It's clear that Robin's been too nice and players just get to do whatever the hell they want. It shouldn't take the VP and General Manager to handle s*** like this.

so they are attempted to check it now and it's wrong? Maybe they put too much confidence in Sale that he would control himself after the first couple of incidents. There is nothing wrong with disagreeing in any of these situations. It's sale's response to it that is the issue.