Chris Sale scratched from start

[southsider2k5]

They knew about his concerns in Spring training. I think that might have given them enough time to plan the rotation.

 

A team should not have to plan promotions around what their players like or dislike.

[Iwritecode]

Again, we don't know if Sale even knew about pitching on the jersey day at that time. I wouldn't think he would have looked that far ahead to see the promotional day. this seems more like couple of days before he pitched, he told the team what jersey he wanted and the clubhouse guy said he couldn't have that due to the promotion.

 

It's possible he knew earlier but I doubt it.

 

He knew in spring training that he didn't want to pitch in that uniform. The team must have had the promotion set long before that. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together and figure out who was going to be pitching that day. It's just a horrible lack of communication and planning all around.

[Iwritecode]

A team should not have to plan promotions around what their players like or dislike.

 

Agreed. But they should do absolutely everything in their power to make sure the players are comfortable when they take the field to perform the job the team is paying them millions of dollars to do.

[Dick Allen]

Every one of your goddamned posts is this "I told you so" bulls***.

 

You have a lot of knowledge, and you're a smart guy...how about you post something original instead of always trying to make others look stupid?

I'm just pointing out people talk out of both sides of their mouth, and if it can somehow be blamed on Robin, eventually it will.

 

A grown man took a knife to a bunch of uniforms because he didn't want to wear them pitching a game where he's paid millions of dollars to pitch. Sorry, and don't get me wrong, I like Sale and hope the Sox don't use this as an excuse to trade him, but this is all on Sale and no one else.

 

As to when this happened. It happened during BP. You would think someone would have been in the clubhouse, but as someone said, what are you going to do if you saw Sale taking a knife to a bunch of uniforms?

 

I would either watch in disbelief, or get away from the crime scene as quickly as possible. I am not really sure.

 

It is really a bizarre action.

[Dick Allen]

They obviously tried Sale's method of keeping it quiet and in the clubhouse before now, because the only thing we knew about was the LaRoche blow up.

 

They seem to be trying something different now with the suspension.

I think the 4 are known. There was an argument with Robin about being yanked a couple of years ago. Another one with Robin with the Victor Martinez stuff. The spring training KW tirade, and this one.

[ptatc]

He knew in spring training that he didn't want to pitch in that uniform. The team must have had the promotion set long before that. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together and figure out who was going to be pitching that day. It's just a horrible lack of communication and planning all around.

I see it now. It's odd that an untucked jersey makes that big of a difference. However, he did tell them he didn't like it earlier.

[Texsox]

You're a very smart guy and successful professional and I've noticed you have strong feelings about this. In the final analysis you are probably right. I have taken the side of Sale on this, assuming he didn't wield the knife near any other human being, just ripped up the uniforms.

I will say if Sale had just torn up his uniform and refused to pitch, that would have been more effective. He would have had the hammer of public opinion on his side: "Cy Young candidate doesn't feel comfortable in collared throwback jersey, does not want to risk health of his arm and performance, refused to pitch.' That would have really embarrassed the Sox.

 

Sale should have thought this through. Just destroying his own uniform or throwing it in the trash without a knife incident would have made him a hero. Hey no billion dollar pitcher should risk his arm health if he's not motivated to pitch that day.

 

I guess you are right in whipping out a knife like a madman by the letter of employment law might warrant a suspension. I wish Sale had done it the other way though to embarrass the White Sox. I really feel it is a horrible organizaion.

 

Now everyone take Sale's side so Greg switches

 

This is right up there with Koufax refusing to pitch on the sabbath.

[greg775]

Now everyone take Sale's side so Greg switches

 

This is right up there with Koufax refusing to pitch on the sabbath.

I kind of respect ptatc and figured I should think it through if he's so adamant about Sale being a real bad guy here. The knife bothers me but I really believe if he just destroyed his one uniform or threw it in the trash he'd be a natural hero. Nowadays ... you can't risk a billion dollar arm. If he's not comfortable ... he don't pitch. He had the hammer and kinda blew it by raging through all the unis. But do I back Sale more than the Sox on this ... of course. Sale Away With Me Baby.

[greg775]

Health is not an issue.

If your brain is telling you you don't want to be out there, you don't think it's possible he f***s up his arm that game? The mind can control the body can it not? Do you want a billion dollar arm pitching when the mind is so upset and making the body so uncomfortable?? Kinda risky to me.

[southsider2k5]

Agreed. But they should do absolutely everything in their power to make sure the players are comfortable when they take the field to perform the job the team is paying them millions of dollars to do.

 

I think the onus is the opposite. When you are being paid to do a job, a reasonable request, such as wearing a promo jersey which funds your salary, shouldn't be a big deal.

[Texsox]

Let's start an all-time list of players who have refused to play because of the jersey

 

1. Chris Sale

 

 

Anyone know of anyone else? In the history of sports?

[chitownsportsfan]

I really want to like Chris Sale. I really don't like him much anymore. He's a redass if there has ever been one on the South Side. He wants to win sure, but if that includes throwing temper tantrums on a semi annual basis he can forget it. All he's done is remove himself from two starts. That doesn't help winning.

[Eminor3rd]

Great post again. You are on fire lately.

I am not raging mad, but I don't think he should have been suspended at all. Make him pay for the uniforms. What the hell did he do that was so bad? He asked the team to not wear them. They should have figured something out at that point. I know you can't be bigger than the team, but don't forget you are dealing with an inept organization. Everybody in baseball with half a brain knows Ventura shouldn't still be manager and it's a joke he is.

Cmon. Ventura has shown "beyond a shadow of a doubt" that this hasn't worked out. The way the Sox play, the clownish way the Sox have dropped games the last two seasons at least, has to be maddening to a competitor like Sale. Just maddening.

The guy is so good compared to the rest of the bums on this team (apologies to Anderson, Abreu, Eaton, Robertson, Q, maybe Frazier) I think it's ok he freak out. He made the reasonable request and they denied it and he destroyed the jerseys. Fine. Make him pay for them. He's Chris Sale ... he should freak out having to work for these inept clowns.

 

Repeat: Any organization that still has Robin managing at this point is not to be taken seriously. Case closed.

 

Is this a joke post?

 

Any organization whose player's are allowed to literally destroy jerseys in temper tantrums and NOT be punished shouldn't be taken seriously. That behavior is completely ridiculous and wouldn't be tolerated anywhere.

[greg775]

Let's start an all-time list of players who have refused to play because of the jersey

 

1. Chris Sale

 

 

Anyone know of anyone else? In the history of sports?

Those are the worst jerseys in the history of sports, though.

 

Is this a joke post?

 

Any organization whose player's are allowed to literally destroy jerseys in temper tantrums and NOT be punished shouldn't be taken seriously. That behavior is completely ridiculous and wouldn't be tolerated anywhere.

It's not a joke. This is the best pitcher in baseball. Make him pay for the jerseys. Fine him if you must. Pitch him.

Edited July 26, 2016 by greg775

[SCCWS]

Let's start an all-time list of players who have refused to play because of the jersey

 

1. Chris Sale

 

 

Anyone know of anyone else? In the history of sports?

 

No but I think it got more ( and worse) national publicity than Tim Duncan refusing to wear a tie to the White House.

 

[Texsox]

Those are the worst jerseys in the history of sports, though.

 

 

It's not a joke. This is the best pitcher in baseball. Make him pay for the jerseys. Fine him if you must. Pitch him.

 

Now I understand your love for Hillary. Hillary is the best politician in America. Vote her. Ignore her bad behavior. I do admire your consistency across all areas of life.

[captain54]

lol, there are an awful lot of assumptions here for someone who is talking about knowing the whole story.

 

Nothing, and let me say it again, NOTHING, has been said that even remotely supports the idea that the Sox reversed course on this. Considering that Sale has thrown both Kenny Williams AND Robin Ventura under the bus at different points this year, you don't think he would have mentioned this pertinent fact while complaining about the rest of the incident? Not a chance.

 

If you really need the full proof an account of all of this before you are allowed to have thoughts on the subject, it would make sense if you weren't adding ideas that have zero proof at all to the discussion.

 

As far as zero proof.. I'll repeat .. you weren't there.. you have NO IDEA what happened…and are in NO position to cast judgement on any opinion as to what actually occurred...

 

I never assumed any of my scenarios were true..and just because the notion that a reversal wasn't mentioned by Sale means squat… Its all media speak…

 

All Sale wanted to get across from the statement was that Ventura wasn't in his corner…

 

"Consider this".. means, keep an open mind before you rush to judgement…..a judgement that as usual, on your part, blindly defends the Sox organization...

Edited July 26, 2016 by captain54

[southsider2k5]

As far as zero proof.. I'll repeat .. you weren't there.. you have NO IDEA what happened…and are in NO position to cast judgement on any opinion as to what actually occurred...

 

I never assumed any of my scenarios were true..and just because the notion that a reversal wasn't mentioned by Sale means squat… Its all media speak…

 

All Sale wanted to get across from the statement was that Ventura wasn't in his corner…

 

"Consider this".. means, keep an open mind before you rush to judgement…..a judgement that as usual, on your part, blindly defends the Sox organization...

 

My thoughts are based on what has actually been reported. If new or different information comes out, those views can change. I wouldn't think it would be obvious to say this, but this is obviously based on what is reported so far, Chris Sale has reacted like a petulant child to this situation.

 

By the way, if you don't like judgements, you probably should find something else to do than to post on a message board that is full of them. Quite literally every single post made on here has some level of assumptions based on what the posters have seen and heard, and none of us ever know the entire situation before posting, as none of us are employed by the Chicago White Sox. If you are that bother by opinions that aren't like your own, you probably should delete your account and find a safer place to read.

[Texsox]

All Sale wanted to get across from the statement was that Ventura wasn't in his corner…

 

"Consider this".. means, keep an open mind before you rush to judgement…..a judgement that as usual, on your part, blindly defends the Sox organization...

 

So you want a manager to back a player who refuses to play and destroys team property?

[chitownsportsfan]

Now I understand your love for Hillary. Hillary is the best politician in America. Vote her. Ignore her bad behavior. I do admire your consistency across all areas of life.

 

why do the admins and mods here do so much trolling? I'm honestly asking. It contributes quite a bit to all the arguing and toxicity. Between this post and the trolling by SS2K and Eminor you guys set an awful example. Hard to tell regular posters to behave when the admins and mods can't even bother.

[captain54]

By the way, if you don't like judgements, you probably should find something else to do than to post on a message board that is full of them. Quite literally every single post made on here has some level of assumptions based on what the posters have seen and heard, and none of us ever know the entire situation before posting, as none of us are employed by the Chicago White Sox. If you are that bother by opinions that aren't like your own, you probably should delete your account and find a safer place to read.

 

I don't need any advice from you on whether or not I should or shouldn't be posting and/or reading other posts on sox talk, or any other board.. thanks….

 

I can handle an opinion from the average fan that really isn't based on anything… What I can't handle is your relentless defending of the organization irregardless

of the situation.. or whether or not fan criticism is justified…We get you have a low opinion of the fan who choses to criticize the organization… Feel free to ease up on that … anytime...

 

[Green Line]

I just can't get behind the double standard being made for professional athletes by some here. If any of us acted the way Chris Sale did, we would be out of a job in a heartbeat and possibly arrested. Its a sad indictment on society that so many people are OK or understanding of what Sale did just because he is a star player. He is paid millions of dollars to go out there and pitch every 5 days, and wearing a special promotional jersey is a small request in the big scheme of things, especially when there is 0 evidence to suggest that the jersey was somehow going to risk injuring him.

[greg775]

You guys think I'm crazy. Looks like I hit a home run. Sale did have health concerns in mind in his quotes Monday.

 

“When I saw that there was something in the way of that 100 percent winning mentality, I had an issue,” Sale said. “I tried to bring it up and say, ‘Hey listen, these are my thoughts and concerns,’ and they got pushed away because of the business deal that was set in place. I’ll never understand why we need to do something on the business side on the field that might impede us winning a game.

“[The ’76 uniforms] are uncomfortable and unorthodox. I didn’t want to go out there and not be at the top of my game in every aspect that I need to be in. Not only that, but I didn’t want anything to alter my mechanics. … There’s a lot of different things that went into it. Looking bad had absolutely zero to do with it. Nothing.”

[greg775]

I just can't get behind the double standard being made for professional athletes by some here. If any of us acted the way Chris Sale did, we would be out of a job in a heartbeat and possibly arrested. Its a sad indictment on society that so many people are OK or understanding of what Sale did just because he is a star player. He is paid millions of dollars to go out there and pitch every 5 days, and wearing a special promotional jersey is a small request in the big scheme of things, especially when there is 0 evidence to suggest that the jersey was somehow going to risk injuring him.

Great post, but he tried to talk sense into the higher-ups. Cmon they could have worn the uniforms on a day he didn't pitch. If he was at all concerned about mechanics, push him back a day. There may be no evidence the jersey could hurt him, but the mind is a powerful thing. If he feels he's in danger ... scrap the uniforms. Sale obviously will want out of town ASAP now and we'll get fleeced in a trade probably.

[southsider2k5]

I don't need any advice from you on whether or not I should or shouldn't be posting and/or reading other posts on sox talk, or any other board.. thanks….

 

I can handle an opinion from the average fan that really isn't based on anything… What I can't handle is your relentless defending of the organization irregardless

of the situation.. or whether or not fan criticism is justified…We get you have a low opinion of the fan who choses to criticize the organization… Feel free to ease up on that … anytime...

 

But somehow I need your advice? At least be consistent. It isn't that difficult. Or just scroll past the post. Feel free to try either, at any time. Afterall, you were the one who jumped in on me first.