Is this a PR Disaster for the Sox?

[Hatchetman]

I'm bitter as hell. I've been a fan since I was 6 in 1977. Little did I know what that would entail at the time.

 

Regardless, this isn't a PR disaster. The franchise is already a laughing stock, I'm not sure what could possibly be a disaster at this point. If the boat is already sunk, what worse can happen?

[StrangeSox]

If you can't buy the team from Reinsdorf's ownership group, there's not much that you can do about it.

 

Au contraire mon ami, I can b**** on Soxtalk about it!

[bmags]

Au contraire mon ami, I can b**** on Soxtalk about it!

 

Truth. It's goin down.

[Black_Jack29]

Au contraire mon ami, I can b**** on Soxtalk about it!

 

And that'll totally fix everything!

 

A friend of mine is a huge Mets fan, but doesn't spend his time on message boards b****ing about how the Wilpons screwed his team by getting into bed with Madoff. He's had to focus his energy on the adult aspects of life, such as getting laid off and dealing with a child who has vision problems due to a birth defect.

Edited August 2, 2016 by Black_Jack29

[Lip Man 1]

And that'll totally fix everything!

 

A friend of mine is a huge Mets fan, but doesn't spend his time on message boards b****ing about how the Wilpons screwed his team by getting into bed with Madoff. He's had to focus his energy on the adult aspects of life, such as getting laid off and dealing with a child who has vision problems due to a birth defect.

 

Some fans are more fortunate then your friend so they are able to focus their energies on something they are passionate about...the Chicago White Sox.

 

Different strokes for different folks. Sweeping generalizations are rarely correct or accurate in my opinion.

 

If fans aren't able to vent, or post opinions why is this web site available?

 

Mark

[southsider2k5]

Some fans are more fortunate then your friend so they are able to focus their energies on something they are passionate about...the Chicago White Sox.

 

Different strokes for different folks. Sweeping generalizations are rarely correct or accurate in my opinion.

 

If fans aren't able to vent, or post opinions why is this web site available?

 

Mark

 

Seeing as you are venting, your last line is misleading, at best. But again, this is a message board, so people are able to respond to that.

[StrangeSox]

And that'll totally fix everything!

 

A friend of mine is a huge Mets fan, but doesn't spend his time on message boards b****ing about how the Wilpons screwed his team by getting into bed with Madoff. He's had to focus his energy on the adult aspects of life, such as getting laid off and dealing with a child who has vision problems due to a birth defect.

 

Cool, I'm posting during work hours so it's win-win for me.

[caulfield12]

Honestly, it feels like they didn't do anything at the trade deadline because neither Williams nor Hahn will man up and take responsibility for the failure of the last two offseasons.

 

Probably both were scrambling around to stake out the opposite position of the other, and neither wanted to go to JR, so pretty much nothing got done. Surprise!!!

 

It doesn't make any sense not to have gotten together a MONTH AGO and started trading assets like Robertson, Cabrera and Frazier. If this front office could only for ONCE get on the same freaking page and go to JR collectively and tell him they screwed up and the only way out of it is to do XYZ, then there would at least be a glimmer of hope.

 

Then JR can decide whether to keep both of them or fire both of them. Instead, it's like Ozzie vs. KW where it feels like they're positioning for one to survive the other and have total control.

 

 

In the offseason, we can get Betts or Bradley, Jr., or Bogaerts for Sale. Great. The team is in exactly the same position it was...unless Rodon or Fulmer decide to impersonate Cy Young contenders. We needed to make the kind of move that would bring in 2-3 potential starters offensively...or 2-3 future starting pitchers, like the proposed trade with the Dodgers.

 

This was the PERFECT time to strike like the Yankees did and load up on prospects who will be coming up in 2017-18 and no later than 2019. Even the Pirates sold off, because they know they have the core in place (other than McCutcheon) for the next 3-4 years and won't gamble it all for another wild card game. Brewers, Padres, everyone ended up looking better than us.

 

 

But excellent, we have another outfield version of Carlos Sanchez or Micah Johnson to entertain us for the next couple of months in Tilson. And we get to see how Dan Jennings does in high leverage situations. Oh, boy.

Edited August 2, 2016 by caulfield12

[elrockinMT]

Well things aren't going well on a number of fronts for this organization including the worst stretch of sustained bad baseball since the period from 1968-1980 if they have their seventh losing season in ten years this year...but moving? Just can't see it because of the good stadium lease and the money the franchise is making.

 

And make no bones about it, they are in good shape financially.

 

Mark

Lip I think there were some pretty good years between 1968-1980. 72-73-74 with Dick Allen and the Winnning Ugly of 77 were exciting years. People were charged up

[SCCWS]

The Cubs have been the most popular team in Chicago since the mid-80s. Win or lose, they have fans.

 

Same goes for the Red Sox in the Northeast. Their fan base hasn't changed much since 2004.

 

Wrong. The Red Sox have become a corporate boom since the late 90's. With corporations buying up blocks of box and grandstand sections, the average fan is forced to compete for the non-season ticket seats. That has driven up demand and price and was the reason they got creative adding seats instead of building a new stadium.

 

[Black_Jack29]

If fans aren't able to vent, or post opinions why is this web site available?

 

I thought that this web site was for the purpose of serious baseball discussion, not childish emotional incontinence.

 

But apparently I was wrong about that.

 

[Black_Jack29]

Wrong. The Red Sox have become a corporate boom since the late 90's. With corporations buying up blocks of box and grandstand sections, the average fan is forced to compete for the non-season ticket seats. That has driven up demand and price and was the reason they got creative adding seats instead of building a new stadium.

 

Most other teams have made done the same thing. The average fan can't afford to purchase box or club-level seats for a family of four at the Cell these days.

 

The reason why they added seats to Fenway, rather than build a new stadium is the same reason why they did it a Wrigley: nobody wants those stadiums torn down. They're iconic.

 

You're also forgetting that a larger chunk of baseball's revenue is coming from TV deals these days. Ticket sales don't drive the bulk of revenue that they used to.

Edited August 2, 2016 by Black_Jack29

[Rowand44]

And that'll totally fix everything!

 

A friend of mine is a huge Mets fan, but doesn't spend his time on message boards b****ing about how the Wilpons screwed his team by getting into bed with Madoff. He's had to focus his energy on the adult aspects of life, such as getting laid off and dealing with a child who has vision problems due to a birth defect.

You could probably focus your energy on something other than telling people how to be a fan as well.

[caulfield12]

The White Sox are pretty lucky to have anyone left to tell other fans how to act/behave.

 

The Score guys were doing the exact same thing yesterday afternoon....everyone questioning the front office or ownership was told quite bluntly...why be a fan of that team if it bothers you so much or you don't trust them to make the right decisions?

 

Well, that leads to the whole point of fandom...none of us started following the White Sox franchise because of the ownership group or GM, it's because of the uniform itself, and the players who wear that jersey. So I'll have to disagree on that point, that just because you don't believe in the front office or JR means you have to stop being a fan of the team itself. That's pretty much ridiculous.

[SCCWS]

Honestly, it feels like they didn't do anything at the trade deadline because neither Williams nor Hahn will man up and take responsibility for the failure of the last two offseasons.

 

Probably both were scrambling around to stake out the opposite position of the other, and neither wanted to go to JR, so pretty much nothing got done. Surprise!!!

 

It doesn't make any sense not to have gotten together a MONTH AGO and started trading assets like Robertson, Cabrera and Frazier. If this front office could only for ONCE get on the same freaking page and go to JR collectively and tell him they screwed up and the only way out of it is to do XYZ, then there would at least be a glimmer of hope.

 

Then JR can decide whether to keep both of them or fire both of them. Instead, it's like Ozzie vs. KW where it feels like they're positioning for one to survive the other and have total control.

 

 

In the offseason, we can get Betts or Bradley, Jr., or Bogaerts for Sale. Great. The team is in exactly the same position it was...unless Rodon or Fulmer decide to impersonate Cy Young contenders. We needed to make the kind of move that would bring in 2-3 potential starters offensively...or 2-3 future starting pitchers, like the proposed trade with the Dodgers.

 

This was the PERFECT time to strike like the Yankees did and load up on prospects who will be coming up in 2017-18 and no later than 2019. Even the Pirates sold off, because they know they have the core in place (other than McCutcheon) for the next 3-4 years and won't gamble it all for another wild card game. Brewers, Padres, everyone ended up looking better than us.

 

 

But excellent, we have another outfield version of Carlos Sanchez or Micah Johnson to entertain us for the next couple of months in Tilson. And we get to see how Dan Jennings does in high leverage situations. Oh, boy.

 

A couple of thoughts:

 

1. We are not getting Bradley or Bogaerts for Sale. They are All-Stars playing prime positions. Betts + some prospect package is very doable.

2. Kudos to the Yankees for getting a bunch of prospects but that does not mean their coming up will improve them. Prospects are still a crap shoot. But the yankees gave up relief pitching which is often a crap shoot in itself.

3. I think the FO screwd up not getting something for Robertson, Shields or Gonzo since there seemed to be a market for pitching.

[Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm]

I guess maybe I didnt clarify that collectively what has happened in the past few years has been a PR disaster with yesterday just being a small part of that PR disaster.

 

Yesterday alone definitely is something the public would forget about soon enough but everything that has happened over time? Nah I cant forget how messy this has all been. Its not just one guy either, its the whole damn thing.

 

 

My apologies for using the word "ridiculous". I didn't mean that towards you or other posters.

 

I should have been more clear... what I meant was, the Sox FO/PR know that the average fan isn't going to stop watching because they didn't blow up the team. They'll still get their cable TV money, MLB.tv money, ticket and consession sales, merch licensing... etc. They are catering towards the 99% and not the 1% who see through their bulls*** and complacency with mediocrity.

 

You would think that trading Chris Sale would put off A LOT of fans - but I can't speak to the vibe in Chicago as I live pretty far away.

 

I think if the Sox were competing with a really great team, were a couple games back, gave up.... and then they blew it up (white flag trade anyone?) I think that the fanbase would then respond accordingly.

Edited August 2, 2016 by Charlie Haeger's Knuckles

[Black_Jack29]

A couple of thoughts:

 

1. We are not getting Bradley or Bogaerts for Sale. They are All-Stars playing prime positions. Betts + some prospect package is very doable.

 

I don't see how Betts and Bradley are all that different in value. Betts is younger than Bradley and can also play CF.

 

If Dombrowski isn't willing to give up his two best prospects in a deal for Sale, I think that one of the "B" outfielders needs to be part of the package.

 

If DD isn't amenable to either of those scenarios, I don't see how trading Sale to the Red Sox benefits the White Sox.

 

[Soxfest]

Fans are growing tired of JR country club that is Sox baseball last 36 years. Overall his body of work as a owner overall not good.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

Honestly, it feels like they didn't do anything at the trade deadline because neither Williams nor Hahn will man up and take responsibility for the failure of the last two offseasons.

 

Probably both were scrambling around to stake out the opposite position of the other, and neither wanted to go to JR, so pretty much nothing got done. Surprise!!!

 

It doesn't make any sense not to have gotten together a MONTH AGO and started trading assets like Robertson, Cabrera and Frazier. If this front office could only for ONCE get on the same freaking page and go to JR collectively and tell him they screwed up and the only way out of it is to do XYZ, then there would at least be a glimmer of hope.

 

Then JR can decide whether to keep both of them or fire both of them. Instead, it's like Ozzie vs. KW where it feels like they're positioning for one to survive the other and have total control.

 

 

In the offseason, we can get Betts or Bradley, Jr., or Bogaerts for Sale. Great. The team is in exactly the same position it was...unless Rodon or Fulmer decide to impersonate Cy Young contenders. We needed to make the kind of move that would bring in 2-3 potential starters offensively...or 2-3 future starting pitchers, like the proposed trade with the Dodgers.

 

This was the PERFECT time to strike like the Yankees did and load up on prospects who will be coming up in 2017-18 and no later than 2019. Even the Pirates sold off, because they know they have the core in place (other than McCutcheon) for the next 3-4 years and won't gamble it all for another wild card game. Brewers, Padres, everyone ended up looking better than us.

 

 

But excellent, we have another outfield version of Carlos Sanchez or Micah Johnson to entertain us for the next couple of months in Tilson. And we get to see how Dan Jennings does in high leverage situations. Oh, boy.

 

I'm just choosing to believe they're gona pick a direction and go with it. I think they're gona rebuild. I'm hoping that's what it is. If it's another half assed off-season, I'll just quit watching and b****ing on a message board.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

The White Sox are pretty lucky to have anyone left to tell other fans how to act/behave.

 

The Score guys were doing the exact same thing yesterday afternoon....everyone questioning the front office or ownership was told quite bluntly...why be a fan of that team if it bothers you so much or you don't trust them to make the right decisions?

 

Well, that leads to the whole point of fandom...none of us started following the White Sox franchise because of the ownership group or GM, it's because of the uniform itself, and the players who wear that jersey. So I'll have to disagree on that point, that just because you don't believe in the front office or JR means you have to stop being a fan of the team itself. That's pretty much ridiculous.

It's silly honestly. It's a fan's choice to complain if something is wrong with their team. If someone's b****ing on here, I let them go. Vent if ya need to vent. As long as they're not attacking people and acting ridiculous it's fine IMO.

[Bigsoxhurt35]

I don't see how Betts and Bradley are all that different in value. Betts is younger than Bradley and can also play CF.

 

If Dombrowski isn't willing to give up his two best prospects in a deal for Sale, I think that one of the "B" outfielders needs to be part of the package.

 

If DD isn't amenable to either of those scenarios, I don't see how trading Sale to the Red Sox benefits the White Sox.

I've always thought that this trade is a lot more doable in the off-season and honestly, I think Sale will be traded to Boston sometime this winter meetings. I think Boston will fall apart due to their pitching and cave for Sale. What will it be? Not sure.

[gosoxgo2005]

And that team in the north hasn't won a world series in over 100 years. I imagine their fan base will increase if they became a dynasty like the Yankees. That will be especially bad for the White Sox if they continue to be inept.

 

I think a lot of fans younger people will shift towards rooting for the Cubs because they are such a likable team. Rizzo, Bryant, Maddon, Theo, you name it. They have fun and it resonates with the casual fan, in my humble opinion. I hate the Cubs, but I love each and every player on that team. They have a swag, they expect victory and they are going to win a lot of baseball games in the next decade

[SCCWS]

I don't see how Betts and Bradley are all that different in value. Betts is younger than Bradley and can also play CF.

 

If Dombrowski isn't willing to give up his two best prospects in a deal for Sale, I think that one of the "B" outfielders needs to be part of the package.

 

If DD isn't amenable to either of those scenarios, I don't see how trading Sale to the Red Sox benefits the White Sox.

 

The importance of centerfield. Betts can and did play center field for Boston. But Bradley forced the move to RF. Bradley may have the most best/accurate arm from CF in baseball. Betts may be a little better offensively but he is not the CF Bradley is. He is a good RF. He also has a Fenway swing and as you state is younger.

 

If Moncada and Benintendi are ML ready after this year, they might be tempted to move Betts + for Q. Seems like rumors in Boston was Sale was really not for sale and won't be in the winter.

[chitownsportsfan]

I thought that this web site was for the purpose of serious baseball discussion, not childish emotional incontinence.

 

But apparently I was wrong about that.

 

new to the Internet?

[chitownsportsfan]

Says the guy who could not get enough of Avi Garcia and Carlos Sanchez.

 

they suck bro. wtf is your problem? Every single time I un ignore one of your posts you're trolling and I immediately regret it.

 

here, let me spell it out for you: AVI GARCIA AND CARLOS SANCHEZ BOTH f***ING.

 

god forbid I'd like to give younger players a shot rather than bringing in endless veteran retreads or never will be anythings like Micah f***ing Johnson and JB Shuck. Guess what? BOTH AVI AND SANCHEZ, WHO COULD HAVE GIVEN THE SOX YOUNG COST CONTROLLED 2-4 WAR PlAY, ARE BELOW REPLACEMENT! THE CORNERSTONE OF THE PEAVY TRADE IS NOTHING! YEA HIGH FIVE ME BRUH!

 

AWESOME!

 

f*** this entire org right now. it's pathetic.

 

People here in Seattle are pissed off well at least they made more than one f***ing move.

Edited August 2, 2016 by chitownsportsfan