southsider2k5 Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 QUOTE (raBBit @ Aug 15, 2016 -> 12:16 PM) Burdi's camp was caught off guard by the call up to Charlotte. They were expecting him to skip AAA entirely. Still hearing from another in the org to expect Burdi up this year. Personally, I don't see any incentive for the Sox to call up Burdi this year but they have been less concerned with service time stipulations than other orgs. Rodon being the only real exception to memory. I swear the difference between the two was how quickly they signed. Rodon went to the week before the deadline. Burdi was pretty much instant. Burdi gets the call up, Rodon didn't. I really think the Sox use it as a signing incentive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 QUOTE (raBBit @ Aug 15, 2016 -> 01:09 PM) I disagree with this in regards to Rodon, but your last sentence is a very practical potentiality. I think with Rodon the Sox saw a Boras client who they expected to be in their rotation for seven seasons. Given the timing of Rodon's call up, it's pretty obvious the Sox wanted to have ~6.85 years of Rodon instead of ~6.2 or whatever the segmented seasons would come out to. With Burdi, the need to control his service time/salary is much lesser. Rodon was an elite prospect with the best agent. Burdi is a good prospect with mid market agency. If Burdi ends up in pen, his future salaries are not inconsequential but certainly pale in comparison to the nine digit potential Carlos Rodon has on the open market. As far as Burdi's call up, I heard a bit more. The Sox losing Gonzalez and having to call up Ranaudo for a spot start complicates things. Burdi getting called up after his outing tomorrow would make a lot of sense, but after Gonzalez went down, he may be held back a bit solely because of the way the roster breaks down. Plenty of other moves they can make to have both here. DFA Turner and/ or Albers, send down Beck or Kahnle. Lot of guys who can go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 15, 2016 -> 12:26 PM) I swear the difference between the two was how quickly they signed. Rodon went to the week before the deadline. Burdi was pretty much instant. Burdi gets the call up, Rodon didn't. I really think the Sox use it as a signing incentive. Doesn't help much that Rodon's agent is Boras. There was no way it wasn't going to last until the deadline to sign. We all knew that. Edited August 15, 2016 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Aug 15, 2016 -> 01:42 PM) Doesn't help much that Rodon' agent is Boras. There was no way it wasn't going to last until the deadline to sign. We all knew that. And I really think he lost a year of free agency because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whisox05 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 1 inning, 1bb, 3 ks sofar. Still pitching Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I really have little problem with him being called up this year, those who talk about "starting his clock" I'm not sure know what that means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whisox05 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) Final line for tonight. 2 innings, 2 hits, 1 bb, 5 ks and the save Edited August 17, 2016 by WhiteSoxLifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 If Williams/Hahn insist on drafting players in the first round to fill relief roles, I have no problem starting the clock. But poor organizational building, including stuff such as this, is why the Sox are where they are organizationally and with the major league team: hopelessly non-competitive when trying to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (GreenSox @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:00 AM) If Williams/Hahn insist on drafting players in the first round to fill relief roles, I have no problem starting the clock. But poor organizational building, including stuff such as this, is why the Sox are where they are organizationally and with the major league team: hopelessly non-competitive when trying to win. Show me how many #26 overall draft picks contributed more than a decent relief pitcher the last 24 years. Nate Jones is about a half a season away from matching all of their WAR totals combined. But keep thinking they should have drafted a first ballot HOFer there. Besides, relievers values are only going higher. Edited August 17, 2016 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 best guys picked between #25 and #30: Alan Trammell Mike Trout George Brett Mike Schmidt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:17 AM) best guys picked between #25 and #30: Alan Trammell Mike Trout George Brett Mike Schmidt Trout was #25. Burdi was #26. The other guys were drafted in 1976, 1971, and 1971. So 40-45 years ago. If Burdi is a solid relief pitcher, the Sox will have drafted well at #26. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 09:04 AM) Show me how many #26 overall draft picks contributed more than a decent relief pitcher the last 24 years. Nate Jones is about a half a season away from matching all of their WAR totals combined. But keep thinking they should have drafted a first ballot HOFer there. Besides, relievers values are only going higher. Noah Syndergaard #38 in 2010 Blake Swihart was #26 in 2011 Joey Gallo #39 in 2012 Aaron Judge #32 in 2013 Michael Kopech #33 in 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:40 AM) Noah Syndergaard #38 in 2010 Blake Swihart was #26 in 2011 Joey Gallo #39 in 2012 Aaron Judge #32 in 2013 Michael Kopech #33 in 2014 I like how he asked for #26 picks and you only gave one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 If Burdi ends up a closer/set up guy or a starter that plays in the majors its a nice pick by the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:04 AM) Show me how many #26 overall draft picks contributed more than a decent relief pitcher the last 24 years. Nate Jones is about a half a season away from matching all of their WAR totals combined. But keep thinking they should have drafted a first ballot HOFer there. Besides, relievers values are only going higher. The point is that you don't draft CEILING relief pitchers in the first round. You hope for better...some will work out and others won't. I they don't work out as starters then they can be reliever. Your logic would field a 60 win team...let's use our first round picks for guys were confident can be relievers and utility infielders...whoopee! What the Sox lack are impact players. These players must usually be drafted or signed internationally. Williams and Hahn have done a particularly poor job at org building. And let's be honest. Burdi was drafted to help the pen THIS year; Now that even Williams, Hahn and their Ouiji Board have to realize the Sox aren't in it, it's time to develop him as a starter. Edited August 17, 2016 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 There's never been a decent reliever picked at #26 so obviously it was a bad pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (GreenSox @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:48 AM) The point is that you don't draft CEILING relief pitchers in the first round. You hope for better...some will work out and others won't. I they don't work out as starters then they can be reliever. Your logic would field a 60 win team...let's use our first round picks for guys were confident can be relievers and utility infielders...whoopee! What the Sox lack are impact players. These players must usually be drafted or signed internationally. Williams and Hahn have done a particularly poor job at org building. And let's be honest. Burdi was drafted to help the pen THIS year; Now that even Williams, Hahn and their Ouiji Board have to realize the Sox aren't in it, it's time to develop him as a starter. Too bad Courtney Hawkins wasn't available. If the guy can pitch, it's a good pick. The Tigers took Andrew Miller with the #8 pick. He's a reliever. I bet there are a lot of teams drafting 1-26 that year that would have loved to have had him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 09:43 AM) I like how he asked for #26 picks and you only gave one. I like how I contributed to the salient point that GreenSox was making which is questioning the type of talent we ought to be selecting with the #26 pick, by showing recent picks at either #26 or after the 26th pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:57 AM) There's never been a decent reliever picked at #26 so obviously it was a bad pick. You are missing the point. #26 picks historically haven't been all that great. Not just the White Sox but league wide. In fact, the White Sox drafted one of the most successful #26 overall picks in the last 25 years, Mark Johnson. Not exactly a guy you can build a team around. If this guy is successful, it's a good pick. Even though he's ONLY a reliever. Like those guys aren't getting more important by the minute these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 11:08 AM) I like how I contributed to the salient point that GreenSox was making which is questioning the type of talent we ought to be selecting with the #26 pick, by showing recent picks at either #26 or after the 26th pick. So no matter what kind of career he has, if Burdi is a career relief pitcher, you are with GreenSox, it was a terrible pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 No I'm not missing the point, just taking your silly argument to a ridiculous end. It was reported that scouts thought he could possibly be a starter and even reports that the Sox intended to make him one. Spending a couple years attempting to make him a top of the rotation starter is a much better option with minimal downside. After a year or two if that didn't work just make him a reliever again. The extra innings of experience would serve him well anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:11 AM) So no matter what kind of career he has, if Burdi is a career relief pitcher, you are with GreenSox, it was a terrible pick. Nope, I am not of that mind at all. But I do understand where GreenSox is going with all of this, which is that in the first round it does stand to reason that you would be far more motivated to select a talent along the lines of a potential future star position player or starting pitcher, before going after a reliever. So if we passed on a future Syndergaard or an Aaron Judge or Michael Kopech in favor of a reliever, then we better hope said reliever turns out to be closer to the Goose Gossages and Bruce Sutters of the world, or else this pick could look like a missed opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (GreenSox @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 10:48 AM) The point is that you don't draft CEILING relief pitchers in the first round. You hope for better...some will work out and others won't. I they don't work out as starters then they can be reliever. Your logic would field a 60 win team...let's use our first round picks for guys were confident can be relievers and utility infielders...whoopee! What the Sox lack are impact players. These players must usually be drafted or signed internationally. Williams and Hahn have done a particularly poor job at org building. And let's be honest. Burdi was drafted to help the pen THIS year; Now that even Williams, Hahn and their Ouiji Board have to realize the Sox aren't in it, it's time to develop him as a starter. Burdi isn't a "ceiling" closer. He has three pitches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 11:14 AM) No I'm not missing the point, just taking your silly argument to a ridiculous end. It was reported that scouts thought he could possibly be a starter and even reports that the Sox intended to make him one. Spending a couple years attempting to make him a top of the rotation starter is a much better option with minimal downside. After a year or two if that didn't work just make him a reliever again. The extra innings of experience would serve him well anyway. Agree. This small sample size should have no barring on his future role. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 QUOTE (Hatchetman @ Aug 17, 2016 -> 11:14 AM) No I'm not missing the point, just taking your silly argument to a ridiculous end. It was reported that scouts thought he could possibly be a starter and even reports that the Sox intended to make him one. Spending a couple years attempting to make him a top of the rotation starter is a much better option with minimal downside. After a year or two if that didn't work just make him a reliever again. The extra innings of experience would serve him well anyway. This is the exact path that the Sox followed with Chris Sale. Just because he is called up as a reliever today, doesn't mean he is a reliever forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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