Bernstein: Sources say White Sox might be for sale

[Thad Bosley]

It was absolutely nuts when JR turned down the City of Chicago offer to build a stadium in the South Loop at Roosevelt + Clark in the mid 1980's. I don't know if that sight would still be available. But a few years ago the Village of Rosemont offered to build a new stadium for the bad guys on the Northside. What happens if Rosemont offers to build a new stadium for the White Sox? I would think the owner of the White Sox would seriously consider it. I would rather have a new stadium in the South Loop. But if that didn't workout, I would rather have a stadium in Rosemont than 35th + Shields.

In the long list of bone-headed decisions made by Reinsdorf over the past 36 years, this one is right there near the top.

[Dick Allen]

In the long list of bone-headed decisions made by Reinsdorf over the past 36 years, this one is right there near the top.

Except it isn't true. He didn't demand the park be built where it was. Look it up and find out the truth. He settled for the site.

 

 

[WBWSF]

JR settled for the present site after Addison/Dupage County didn't workout. If he would have accepted the South Loop site that was offered to him at the start of looking for a new stadium by the City of Chicago, The White Sox would have been playing in the South Loop these last 25 years. He rejected the South loop site because he wanted to have the stadium built in Addison on land that he owned. He also left Sarasota Florida where the White Sox had their spring training for many years. He moved them to Arizona and had them playing in a stadium on land that he owned.

[Dick Allen]

JR settled for the present site after Addison/Dupage County didn't workout. If he would have accepted the South Loop site that was offered to him at the start of looking for a new stadium by the City of Chicago, The White Sox would have been playing in the South Loop these last 25 years. He rejected the South loop site because he wanted to have the stadium built in Addison on land that he owned. He also left Sarasota Florida where the White Sox had their spring training for many years. He moved them to Arizona and had them playing in a stadium on land that he owned.

No, the South Loop site was rejected because no one wanted to pay the $65 million estimated bill for infrastructure around the park, and compensate the park district for losing the Bears. The developers actually wanted the Bears in there also. It wouldn't have been a baseball only stadium.

 

What would have helped the Sox was if parks like Camdn Yards and Petco were build before theirs. The downtown retro look would have been a lock then.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Dick Allen

[Jose Abreu]

When I first saw this, I immediately thought of Berlin, but I now have very reliable information that tells me Andrew Berlin will not be the buyer.

[Lip Man 1]

JR settled for the present site after Addison/Dupage County didn't workout. If he would have accepted the South Loop site that was offered to him at the start of looking for a new stadium by the City of Chicago, The White Sox would have been playing in the South Loop these last 25 years. He rejected the South loop site because he wanted to have the stadium built in Addison on land that he owned. He also left Sarasota Florida where the White Sox had their spring training for many years. He moved them to Arizona and had them playing in a stadium on land that he owned.

 

If memory serves I believe the Addison vote was lost by a single vote against.

 

Mark

 

[greg775]

I didn't realize the Cubs had won 11 in a row; my gosh. Are the Sox getting any attention at all in Chicago? Do the TV stations even run highlights? A story like this might be needed to keep them relevant at all.

[Balta1701]

10+ pages and I haven't seen anyone face this setup from a business aspect. For a comparison - the northside franchise sold for a high price, but because of continued team cost inflation and the seemingly successful rebuilding project, plus playing hardball on renovations, that looks like they've turned that into a strong business asset.

 

So what do the White Sox have? They look to me like an extremely undervalued asset. They are at the bottom of the league in both attendance and in TV ratings, but just like the Cubs - they have a revenue stream that does not die when they lose. The Cubs still fill that ballpark even if they are losers, the White Sox still have the parking lot revenues even when they are losers, and they throw in continued revenue sharing growth.

 

Therefore, they have a franchise that has a large potential market, substantial potential for growth, and a revenue stream that makes it difficult for them to truly lose money even if they make poor decisions. Basically, if they do a terrible job at managing the baseball side of things, they still break even unless they chose not to.

 

Throw in the ability to sign a new TV contract in 3 years and the reality that they're already in one of the oldest ballparks in MLB and if you're a 20-year investor this franchise looks to me like a huge medium- and long-term growth opportunity. You've got multiple revenue streams that could be substantially grown on a 5-year basis - without endorsing him, that's exactly what Cuban did with the Mavericks, taking them from a team averaging 14,000 tickets/game to a team averaging 20,000 tickets/game - a huge boost in interest which corresponded with boosts in media ratings and money. A team averaging 50% of its tickets sold is a bigger revenue growth opportunity than the Mavericks.

 

In the long term, this team has a stable stadium setup for 10 years with a revenue stream that, like the Cubs, supports the franchise even if they're losing, and they then have the ability to gradually start pushing towards a new stadium. While right now Illinois is in no shape to be any part of that, medium-term revenue growth by filling seats and improving the media contracts could be the basis of a multi-year lobbying campaign. That will not be easy, that will take playing politics well, that will take some luck on the state of the Illinois and Chicago budgets, that will not be pretty, but in the 10+ year window the right owner(s) could start getting close.

 

And let's face it, there's a nonzero chance that won't happen. However, if you get in right now and are in baseball's good graces, then if the state of Illinois refuses to set the clock back to before whatever ultimatum you give them, you could be the first franchise to relocate in decades. Right now baseball is hesitant on both expansion and relocation. If the Rays are able to do something about their stadium before their 2027 lease comes up, then it's hard to see which team would actually be a candidate to move. If MLB doesn't expand before that time (something that, as an owner you would have a strong voice in), then markets like Vegas (esp. if the NFL opens it up), Portland, and other markets could be strong candidates to take on the franchise.

 

Finally, again even if they do a terrible job, they have continued growth of franchise value and continued growth of shared revenue streams on top of all that.

 

If I had a couple billion to play with...this franchise would be an extremely tempting asset. The current ownership has been getting by and surviving, but successful franchises are several Ledecky's ahead of them. The Sox are an asset that will not lose money because of established deals and it's an asset that you can project multiple lines of revenue growth over the long term. If you're an effective ownership group, there are billions of dollars of unrecognized revenue potential here.

[caulfield12]

Only the Oakland A's and Rays would seem to be in trouble (for different reasons).

 

The jury's still out on Miami (with Stanton and Fernandez they have two headliners) and Cleveland's in an improved position this year and going forward.

 

One big decision that will impact the White Sox will be whether the Cubs start their own independent network or not. If it's only Comcast bidding for the Sox and Cubs simultaneously, we know which team will get squeezed.

 

Realistically, this offseason would be the perfect time to start that mini-rebuild because they can immediately inject a ton of life with AA and AAA position prospects within a year or so of the majors. It might even mean taking another risk and selling high on Eaton while waiting on Abreu. But that would probably require a new owner's determination to "peak" in 2019 instead of rolling the dice again in 2017.

 

The other major consideration is timing that huge free agent class after 2018 with being the "final pieces" to having a really good team in 2019.

 

Of course, waiting another two years will be hard, but at least there'd be a bigger payoff in the end than fielding .500 teams the next three seasons and/or losing Q, Sale or Rodon to injury.

[Y2Jimmy0]

10+ pages and I haven't seen anyone face this setup from a business aspect. For a comparison - the northside franchise sold for a high price, but because of continued team cost inflation and the seemingly successful rebuilding project, plus playing hardball on renovations, that looks like they've turned that into a strong business asset.

 

So what do the White Sox have? They look to me like an extremely undervalued asset. They are at the bottom of the league in both attendance and in TV ratings, but just like the Cubs - they have a revenue stream that does not die when they lose. The Cubs still fill that ballpark even if they are losers, the White Sox still have the parking lot revenues even when they are losers, and they throw in continued revenue sharing growth.

 

Therefore, they have a franchise that has a large potential market, substantial potential for growth, and a revenue stream that makes it difficult for them to truly lose money even if they make poor decisions. Basically, if they do a terrible job at managing the baseball side of things, they still break even unless they chose not to.

 

Throw in the ability to sign a new TV contract in 3 years and the reality that they're already in one of the oldest ballparks in MLB and if you're a 20-year investor this franchise looks to me like a huge medium- and long-term growth opportunity. You've got multiple revenue streams that could be substantially grown on a 5-year basis - without endorsing him, that's exactly what Cuban did with the Mavericks, taking them from a team averaging 14,000 tickets/game to a team averaging 20,000 tickets/game - a huge boost in interest which corresponded with boosts in media ratings and money. A team averaging 50% of its tickets sold is a bigger revenue growth opportunity than the Mavericks.

 

In the long term, this team has a stable stadium setup for 10 years with a revenue stream that, like the Cubs, supports the franchise even if they're losing, and they then have the ability to gradually start pushing towards a new stadium. While right now Illinois is in no shape to be any part of that, medium-term revenue growth by filling seats and improving the media contracts could be the basis of a multi-year lobbying campaign. That will not be easy, that will take playing politics well, that will take some luck on the state of the Illinois and Chicago budgets, that will not be pretty, but in the 10+ year window the right owner(s) could start getting close.

 

And let's face it, there's a nonzero chance that won't happen. However, if you get in right now and are in baseball's good graces, then if the state of Illinois refuses to set the clock back to before whatever ultimatum you give them, you could be the first franchise to relocate in decades. Right now baseball is hesitant on both expansion and relocation. If the Rays are able to do something about their stadium before their 2027 lease comes up, then it's hard to see which team would actually be a candidate to move. If MLB doesn't expand before that time (something that, as an owner you would have a strong voice in), then markets like Vegas (esp. if the NFL opens it up), Portland, and other markets could be strong candidates to take on the franchise.

 

Finally, again even if they do a terrible job, they have continued growth of franchise value and continued growth of shared revenue streams on top of all that.

 

If I had a couple billion to play with...this franchise would be an extremely tempting asset. The current ownership has been getting by and surviving, but successful franchises are several Ledecky's ahead of them. The Sox are an asset that will not lose money because of established deals and it's an asset that you can project multiple lines of revenue growth over the long term. If you're an effective ownership group, there are billions of dollars of unrecognized revenue potential here.

 

Great post, Balta. I agree with most of this. This team is in Chicago and is in a division with Cleveland, Minnesota, and Kansas City. Sox could be a financial monster if run properly.

 

[southsider2k5]

Only the Oakland A's and Rays would seem to be in trouble (for different reasons).

 

The jury's still out on Miami (with Stanton and Fernandez they have two headliners) and Cleveland's in an improved position this year and going forward.

 

One big decision that will impact the White Sox will be whether the Cubs start their own independent network or not. If it's only Comcast bidding for the Sox and Cubs simultaneously, we know which team will get squeezed.

 

Realistically, this offseason would be the perfect time to start that mini-rebuild because they can immediately inject a ton of life with AA and AAA position prospects within a year or so of the majors. It might even mean taking another risk and selling high on Eaton while waiting on Abreu. But that would probably require a new owner's determination to "peak" in 2019 instead of rolling the dice again in 2017.

 

The other major consideration is timing that huge free agent class after 2018 with being the "final pieces" to having a really good team in 2019.

 

Of course, waiting another two years will be hard, but at least there'd be a bigger payoff in the end than fielding .500 teams the next three seasons and/or losing Q, Sale or Rodon to injury.

 

The Yankees are having trouble getting full buy in from the cable networks on their baseball station, as are the Dodgers amongst others. Guess who will have a vested interest in NOT having another baseball network for CSN to compete against?

[Lip Man 1]

Only the Oakland A's and Rays would seem to be in trouble (for different reasons).

 

The jury's still out on Miami (with Stanton and Fernandez they have two headliners) and Cleveland's in an improved position this year and going forward.

 

One big decision that will impact the White Sox will be whether the Cubs start their own independent network or not. If it's only Comcast bidding for the Sox and Cubs simultaneously, we know which team will get squeezed.

 

Realistically, this offseason would be the perfect time to start that mini-rebuild because they can immediately inject a ton of life with AA and AAA position prospects within a year or so of the majors. It might even mean taking another risk and selling high on Eaton while waiting on Abreu. But that would probably require a new owner's determination to "peak" in 2019 instead of rolling the dice again in 2017.

 

The other major consideration is timing that huge free agent class after 2018 with being the "final pieces" to having a really good team in 2019.

 

Of course, waiting another two years will be hard, but at least there'd be a bigger payoff in the end than fielding .500 teams the next three seasons and/or losing Q, Sale or Rodon to injury.

 

Craig Kenney has already publicly stated the Cubs are starting their own network in 2019. I suspect it will net them money we can't even imagine, especially if they reamin one of the best teams in baseball over the next few seasons.

 

Mark

 

[greg775]

Great post, Balta. I agree with most of this. This team is in Chicago and is in a division with Cleveland, Minnesota, and Kansas City. Sox could be a financial monster if run properly.

Sox really screwed up after 2005. It looked like the Sox would own the city of Chicago and own that division. Instead the team almost immediately became a nonreactor in the division and now is the laughingstock of Chicago. Pretty strange how the Sox didn't build on winning. They got complacent and it's been a steady, sad decline since a WS title that should have started years of dominance in a pathetic division full of small market teams.

Edited August 13, 2016 by greg775

[Thad Bosley]

Our Sox are in a 56 year ownership slump. What a collective disaster it's been for more than half a century now between the Allyns, the second coming of Veeck (although he was instrumental in keeping the team in Chicago back in the mid 70s), and then of course the last 36 years of overall ineffectiveness by Reinsdorf & Co. It's been an 0-3 with three strikeouts at the top of the house since 1961, without a doubt.

 

The record of ineptitude under the three owners has really been astonishing if you think about it. No playoff appearances in the 24 years from the World Series in 1959 until 1983, and then only four in the 32 years after that. It's quite a testament to the great fan base then that it's stuck with the team lo these many decades despite the glaring lack of results by the team during these past five decades plus. At least there was 2005 buried in those 56 years for the fans to cling onto and be proud of.

 

The next owner (and boy, how exciting is it to be starting to have real conversations about THIS inevitability!) will have the golden opportunity to awaken this slumbering, underperforming giant that is the large market CHICAGO White Sox, and do what the last three owners have miserably failed to do - bring sustainable, winning baseball to the White Sox and it's well deserving fans. Very much looking forward to turning the page on the malaise of the current ownership and moving into a new and exciting era.

 

White Sox Renaissance - BRING IT ON!!

 

Edited August 13, 2016 by Thad Bosley

[caulfield12]

The Yankees are having trouble getting full buy in from the cable networks on their baseball station, as are the Dodgers amongst others. Guess who will have a vested interest in NOT having another baseball network for CSN to compete against?

 

Yes, but the Yankees look to be caught in a rebuilding period when they are charging the highest prices in baseball for their media products as well as in-game experience.

 

The Dodgers haven't been able to threaten the World Series and things look even bleaker with Kershaw out and Seager/Turner the two best hitters in that line-up.

 

The situation the Cubs are looking at is completely unique in baseball should they win at least one World Series in the next three years...the closest parallel is Boston, but even that might not being doing it justice because of the advantages the city of Chicago provides over Boston.

 

It has been pretty obvious with the White Sox pulling back on the total amount of giveaway items available on the weekends...as well as a lot of sponsorships that aren't taking place at all because the Sox don't want to set the bottom of their marketing deals so low, making it more difficult to renegotiate or raise the rates again when the team finally turns its performance level around. At a certain point, making these deals at 50 or 25 cents on the dollar becomes disadvantageous to the franchise moving forward. The marketing basically has to wait on the team, because Sox fans are tired of this whole mired in mediocrity thing, not when there's no light at the end of the tunnel.

Edited August 13, 2016 by caulfield12

[Lip Man 1]

Sox really screwed up after 2005. It looked like the Sox would own the city of Chicago and own that division. Instead the team almost immediately became a nonreactor in the division and now is the laughingstock of Chicago. Pretty strange how the Sox didn't build on winning. They got complacent and it's been a steady, sad decline since a WS title that should have started years of dominance in a pathetic division full of small market teams.

 

Agree with this, but 2005 wasn't the first time. The Sox had a nice run 81-83 capping by winning the division and didn't capitalize. They had a better run 1990 through 94 with a new ballpark to boot but they couldn't capitalize, JR's hard line approach helping to force the labor impasse and neuter his own teams chances didn't help matters.

 

Mark

Edited August 13, 2016 by Lip Man 1

[Thad Bosley]

Agree with this, but 2005 wasn't the first time. The Sox had a nice run 81-83 capping by winning the division and didn't capitalize. They had a better run 1990 through 94 with a new ballpark to boot but they couldn't capitalize, JR's hard line approach helping to force the labor impasse and neuter his own teams chances didn't help matters.

 

Mark

Bump

[captain54]

I think the notion of JR selling off his share of the team is BS. Everyone involved takes a hit on the capital gains tax. Upon his passing his heirs will be handed over a tidy sum with the sale of the club, which I'm sure is now held in trust

 

I also believe JR wants nothing more than one more trip to the World Series before the end of his day

 

All of this logically explains the reluctance to rebuild. 3 yrs from now is a long time, but if the Sox can keep reloading and strike gold like they did in 05, gives them much more to work with in renewing the TV deal. By then, it will most likely be a Hawks/Sox/Bulls network, and it's any bodies guess as whether the Sox are gonna command the same $$$ as they do now

Edited August 14, 2016 by captain54

[greg775]

I think the notion of JR selling off his share of the team is BS. Everyone involved takes a hit on the capital gains tax. Upon his passing his heirs will be handed over a tidy sum with the sale of the club, which I'm sure is now held in trust

 

I also believe JR wants nothing more than one more trip to the World Series before the end of his day

 

All of this logically explains the reluctance to rebuild. 3 yrs from now is a long time, but if the Sox can keep reloading and strike gold like they did in 05, gives them much more to work with in renewing the TV deal. By then, it will most likely be a Hawks/Sox/Bulls network, and it's any bodies guess as whether the Six are gonna command the same $$$ as they do now

Yes but JR might want to see his heirs get the large sum of money now. Why wait until he's gone? He can bring joy to a lot of family members and partners now with the massive money they get following a sale.

[captain54]

Assuming his estate is held in trust, upon his passing his heirs' tax burden is minimal. I'm not a tax attorney, but I believe it's almost nothing.

 

If the franchise was purchased for $20 M, and is now worth $1 Billion, that's 20% of $980 M that has to be covered among the investors in capital gains tax

Edited August 14, 2016 by captain54

[caulfield12]

Except he only owns like 15% of the team, personally.

 

So that would be roughly $118 million or so (after tax)....not close to a billion.

[captain54]

Except he only owns like 15% of the team, personally.

 

So that would be roughly $118 million or so (after tax)....not close to a billion.

 

July 28, 2013. Chicago Tribune

 

Reinsdorf reportedly owned 4 percent to 5 percent of the team at the beginning but has gradually increased his stake. Four partners told the Tribune that Reinsdorf now owns 14 percent. Reinsdorf said that figure is "significantly understated" but declined to provide another amount.

 

"No partner knows what I own," Reinsdorf said.

[southsider2k5]

Yes, but the Yankees look to be caught in a rebuilding period when they are charging the highest prices in baseball for their media products as well as in-game experience.

 

The Dodgers haven't been able to threaten the World Series and things look even bleaker with Kershaw out and Seager/Turner the two best hitters in that line-up.

 

The situation the Cubs are looking at is completely unique in baseball should they win at least one World Series in the next three years...the closest parallel is Boston, but even that might not being doing it justice because of the advantages the city of Chicago provides over Boston.

 

It has been pretty obvious with the White Sox pulling back on the total amount of giveaway items available on the weekends...as well as a lot of sponsorships that aren't taking place at all because the Sox don't want to set the bottom of their marketing deals so low, making it more difficult to renegotiate or raise the rates again when the team finally turns its performance level around. At a certain point, making these deals at 50 or 25 cents on the dollar becomes disadvantageous to the franchise moving forward. The marketing basically has to wait on the team, because Sox fans are tired of this whole mired in mediocrity thing, not when there's no light at the end of the tunnel.

 

There is no way in hell the Cubs are more popular than the Yankees. I think that Chinese water has a bit too much lead in it.

[southsider2k5]

I think the notion of JR selling off his share of the team is BS. Everyone involved takes a hit on the capital gains tax. Upon his passing his heirs will be handed over a tidy sum with the sale of the club, which I'm sure is now held in trust

 

I also believe JR wants nothing more than one more trip to the World Series before the end of his day

 

All of this logically explains the reluctance to rebuild. 3 yrs from now is a long time, but if the Sox can keep reloading and strike gold like they did in 05, gives them much more to work with in renewing the TV deal. By then, it will most likely be a Hawks/Sox/Bulls network, and it's any bodies guess as whether the Sox are gonna command the same $$ as they do now

 

They would still pay a capital gains tax on the inheritence.

[bmags]

I highly doubt capital gains will play any consideration here. They aren't "saving" on taxes by keeping their investment in the six. That tax will be there whenever they liquidate there stake in the white sox. The benefit is they get to use the rest of their investment gains on whatever they want! Which isn't the case now.

 

But yeah considering the value of their investment may be inflated partially due to public investment in the white sox infrastructure I also have little care for their tactics to save on taxes.