Police keep killing black people

[Jenksismyhero]

Also important to keep in mind the cops were called because someone was reportedly shooting a gun out of a window. So when they responded they assumed, maybe rightly, that this guy is the one with the gun and was hiding it. You make a move like that, it looks like you're reaching for a gun.

 

 

[StrangeSox]

Dude, come on. The guy was laying face down on the ground and there were multiple officers there. Nothing about their actions is justifiable. They could have cuffed him at any time before they murdered him.

[Chicago White Sox]

I first read this story last week from Connor Friedersdorf and I'll never watch the video. I cannot believe he was acquitted. This was not a "snap decision". They had this guy here following orders MULTIPLE times.

 

And now the family will go to civil court, certainly get restitution from the tax payers.

I honestly was nervous for the guy just watching the video. The cop basically tells him “if you f*** up at all I’m going to shoot you” and then proceeds to play the craziest game of Simon Says ever all while having an assault rifle pointed at the suspect. I honestly think a lot of people would have been shot in that situation which to me proves the cop is to blame for this guy losing his life.

Edited December 8, 2017 by Chicago White Sox

[bmags]

If you're that guy though, why on earth are you reaching behind your back?????? He just warned you 5 seconds prior that he would shoot you! I'm shocked he was acquitted, but would not have been shocked by a hung jury.

 

SIX. MINUTES.

 

SIX. MINUTES. following inane, stupid instructions. What on earth does crawling accomplish?

 

They expect civilians from unknown distances to correctly diagnose a situation so correctly that they can take lethal action with no consequence. It's insane.

[BigSqwert]

It's mind-boggling that after seeing something like this, there are so many people out there nitpicking the victim and what he should or shouldn't have done. This is a straight-up murder by a spineless piece of s*** cop.

 

I look forward to apologists digging up dirt on the victim where maybe he stole a pack of cigarettes as a teen, telling us he was no angel.

[bmags]

I honestly was nervous for the guy just watching the video. The cop basically tells him “if you f*** up at all I’m going to shoot you” and then proceeds to play the craziest game of Simon Says ever all while having an assault rifle pointed at the suspect. I honestly think a lot of people who would have been shot in that situation which to me proves the cop is to blame for this guy losing his life.

 

My experience of being mugged at knifepoint was that so much adrenaline shoots up you are prone to very sudden movements, i can't imagine what it's like to have 6 cops surround you with guns that clearly aren't going to engage in a clearing up of misunderstanding.

[Jenksismyhero]

He was shouting at the guy for four minutes straight with a gun pointed at him. Some of his commands included laying down, crawling, putting your hands up and keeping your legs crossed, all simultaneously.

 

Why on earth do we not hold police, who had their service weapons personally engraved with "YOU'RE f***D," to a higher standard than we're holding the civilians they're murdering? How confident are you in how you'd react in a literal life-and-death situation with the adrenaline flowing while someone is shouting contradictory orders at you while telling you they're going to shoot you?

 

I'm 100% confident that I would never, ever make it look like i'm reaching for a gun behind my back as cops have their guns aimed at me. My hands would be open and my palms would be facing towards the cops at all times.

 

And I think we hold cops to a higher standard, but we also recognize that we're asking them to perform jobs that are inherently dangerous, something you and I would not voluntarily do. So they get latitude in making decisions. I think far too often hindsight is used against those guys unfairly. There are clear and obvious cases of murder out there. This, IMO, is a grey area and not the slam dunk you all think it is. I think a murder conviction would have been fair, but I'm not outraged he got off given the pretty clear order that if the guy put his hand behind his back he's going to get shot.

 

 

[bmags]

I wish that when a suit comes up in civil court and a monetary penalty occurs, that both the city and individual can be found at fault and forced to pay.

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

Dude, come on. The guy was laying face down on the ground and there were multiple officers there. Nothing about their actions is justifiable. They could have cuffed him at any time before they murdered him.

 

So that's a failure in police protocol, procedure and training.

[StrangeSox]

that's the thing, jenks. You don't know. You absolutely have no way of knowing how you'd react in a situation that intense with that much adrenaline flowing through you until you're put in the situation. You're generally more just reacting, not even thinking, and it may have just been an instinctual reach to hike up his shorts rather than anything conscience at all.

 

I honestly can't believe you're attempting even a soft defense here.

 

Watch that video, tell me what this guy did that was so wrong he deserved to die for it. Tell me why the cops couldn't have de-escalated and ended the whole thing at any point peacefully instead of making him play macabre simon says until he makes a mistake and gets murdered.

[Quin]

It's mind-boggling that after seeing something like this, there are so many people out there nitpicking the victim and what he should or shouldn't have done. This is a straight-up murder by a spineless piece of s*** cop.

 

I look forward to apologists digging up dirt on the victim where maybe he stole a pack of cigarettes as a teen, telling us he was no angel.

 

He might've smoked weed once or consensually sexted.

[StrangeSox]

So that's a failure in police protocol, procedure and training.

 

Which resulted in the murder of an innocent person.

 

It's almost like the militarization of police forces including a whole "civilians vs. police" (police are civilians) and "occupying force" mentality is a deep problem throughout the country.

[southsider2k5]

that's the thing, jenks. You don't know. You absolutely have no way of knowing how you'd react in a situation that intense with that much adrenaline flowing through you until you're put in the situation. You're generally more just reacting, not even thinking, and it may have just been an instinctual reach to hike up his shorts rather than anything conscience at all.

 

I honestly can't believe you're attempting even a soft defense here.

 

Watch that video, tell me what this guy did that was so wrong he deserved to die for it. Tell me why the cops couldn't have de-escalated and ended the whole thing at any point peacefully instead of making him play macabre simon says until he makes a mistake and gets murdered.

 

See that is the funny thing, that doesn't apply only to the victim.

[bmags]

I'm 100% confident that I would never, ever make it look like i'm reaching for a gun behind my back as cops have their guns aimed at me. My hands would be open and my palms would be facing towards the cops at all times.

 

And I think we hold cops to a higher standard, but we also recognize that we're asking them to perform jobs that are inherently dangerous, something you and I would not voluntarily do. So they get latitude in making decisions. I think far too often hindsight is used against those guys unfairly. There are clear and obvious cases of murder out there. This, IMO, is a grey area and not the slam dunk you all think it is. I think a murder conviction would have been fair, but I'm not outraged he got off given the pretty clear order that if the guy put his hand behind his back he's going to get shot.

 

That order is INSANE after 6 minutes of opportunity to pat him down. There is no possible reason that crawling toward them makes any sense.

 

"Hey, we are worried that you may have a weapon, so I'm going to have you do an activity where you go in motion as opposed to you lying on the ground with your hands above your head where we can come pat you down and cuff you"

 

That situation created the murder, not the f***ing civilian who. did. nothing.

[BigSqwert]

See that is the funny thing, that doesn't apply only to the victim.

 

I'm fairly certain playing a sadistic game of Simon Says for 6 minutes isn't in the police handbook.

[StrangeSox]

See that is the funny thing, that doesn't apply only to the victim.

 

Sorry, I'm more sympathetic to the innocent random person than the trained man who carries a gun every day and does this thing for a living who murdered this person.

[StrangeSox]

COPS ARE CIVILIANS

 

they and society viewing them as anything but is part of the problem. they're not an occupying military force, they're not soldiers, they're civilians.

[bmags]

See that is the funny thing, that doesn't apply only to the victim.

 

6 minutes of dialogue. No visible weapon. Guns drawn. Yeah, when you have a gun drawn at someone, you have a bit more responsibility.

 

Amazing.

 

It really is comical how the trained professionals are allowed to make mistake after mistake with no consequences but the untrained civilians make a mistake and death is an appropriate consequence.

[Jenksismyhero]

that's the thing, jenks. You don't know. You absolutely have no way of knowing how you'd react in a situation that intense with that much adrenaline flowing through you until you're put in the situation. You're generally more just reacting, not even thinking, and it may have just been an instinctual reach to hike up his shorts rather than anything conscience at all.

 

I honestly can't believe you're attempting even a soft defense here.

 

Watch that video, tell me what this guy did that was so wrong he deserved to die for it. Tell me why the cops couldn't have de-escalated and ended the whole thing at any point peacefully instead of making him play macabre simon says until he makes a mistake and gets murdered.

 

Honestly i'm not sure if it was so easy. I'm not a cop. Neither are you. I don't know how easy it is to determine if a guy 20 feet in front of you has a gun in his pants and the best way to find that out. Maybe it does take 6 minutes and requires some instructions including crawling towards you.

 

I'm very curious what the testimony was in regards to the procedure followed here. Did he totally violate procedure or did he follow his training?

 

 

[Jenksismyhero]

COPS ARE CIVILIANS

 

they and society viewing them as anything but is part of the problem. they're not an occupying military force, they're not soldiers, they're civilians.

 

This is nonsense. They're not just civilians. They're asked to do things civilians would never do. Hence, they get some leeway in their decision making.

[bmags]

I'm sure the fit the procedure to fit the innocence.

 

But the reality is if the procedure ended up with a dead unarmed man who was begging for his life, there should be some major procedural changes.

 

Except in america, where we should just say "well, they risk their lives, what's a dead innocent person or 200 a year...?"

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archiv...-punish/547868/

 

“If this situation happened exactly as it did that time, I would have done the same thing," Brailsford said testifying in his Maricopa County Superior Court trial.

 

And isn't that always the case?

 

Shaver could be partially seen walking from the alcove into the hallway a split second after Sgt. Langley shouted for them to stop. Shaver raised his hands in the air prior to any further command, round the alcove into the hallway and immediately dropped to his knees with his hands in the air facing the officers … Sgt. Lanley shouted for both of them to get on the ground. Shaver placed his hands in front of him and laid down on the ground on the south side of the hallway with his hands extended above his head. In the video, Shaver appeared to be wearing a dark colored shirt and dark shorts. No weapon was visible in the video, but also it was not clear Shaver did not have a weapon from the camera view. Shaver was, however, obviously compliant and offered no resistance at that point.

 

Sgt. Langley asked Shaver if there was anyone else in the room and Shaver answered that there was no one else in the room … Sgt. Langley then calmly asked if both of them could understand him … Sgt. Langley then stated, “Alright, if you make another mistake, there is a very severe possibility you are both going to get shot, do you understand?”

 

Shaver responded “Yes” to this question … Sgt. Langley then began to talk when Shaver started to ask a question by saying “What’s––”. Sgt. Langley told Shaver to shut up and stated that he was not there to be tactful and diplomatic with Shaver and they need to obey his commands. At that point, Shaver’s outstretched arms had both palms facing up so the officers could see his hands. As Sgt. Langley was saying they needed to obey his commands. Shaver moved both his arms in front of his face in a similar manner to what would occur when someone is lying on their stomach and intending to rest their head in their crossed arms. Sgt. Langley took note of this and asked Shaver if he had told Shaver to move. Shaver immediately moved his hand back out in front of him with his palms facing up and said, “I’m sorry. No, sir.”

 

Sgt. Langley then ordered Shaver to place his hands on the back of his head and interlace his fingers. Shaver was again compliant. Sgt. Langley then told Shaver to cross his left foot over his right foot. Shaver complied with this but appeared confused as to which foot Sgt. Langley had ordered him to cross. He crossed his feet both ways before finally crossing his feet as Sgt. Langley had instructed. Sgt. Langley then asked again who else was in the room and Shaver responded with “nobody.”

 

Sgt. Langley then asked if both of them were drunk and they both responded that they were not … He then told Shaver that he turn his eyes down and look at the carpet and not move. He further instructed that Shaver needed to keep his fingers interlaced on his head and his legs crossed. Sgt. Langley then told Shaver that if he moved, it would be considered a threat and the officers would have to deal with that and Shaver “may not survive it.” Shaver acknowledged with “yes sir” when asked if he understood this.

[southsider2k5]

I'm sure the fit the procedure to fit the innocence.

 

But the reality is if the procedure ended up with a dead unarmed man who was begging for his life, there should be some major procedural changes.

 

Except in america, where we should just say "well, they risk their lives, what's a dead innocent person or 200 a year...?"

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archiv...-punish/547868/

 

 

 

And isn't that always the case?

 

This is the other side of the coin.

 

Line of Duty Deaths: 119

9/11 related illness: 3

Aircraft accident: 2

Animal related: 1

Assault: 5

Automobile crash: 24

Boating accident: 2

Drowned: 5

Duty related illness: 2

Exposure to toxins: 1

Gunfire: 43

Heart attack: 12

Motorcycle crash: 4

Stabbed: 1

Struck by vehicle: 3

Unidentified: 1

Vehicle pursuit: 5

Vehicular assault: 5

 

 

[StrangeSox]

So two orders of magnitude fewer police are killed by gunfire than police kill in a year.

[bmags]

This is the other side of the coin.

 

And I support looking at policies and ways we can reduce deaths of police officers, including charging people with crimes that injure or kill police.

 

I, uh, also think the flip side should occur.

 

 

[BigSqwert]

And I support looking at policies and ways we can reduce deaths of police officers, including charging people with crimes that injure or kill police.

 

I, uh, also think the flip side should occur.

 

There will always be those out there who think the police can do no wrong.