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Price rising for Sale and Q


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QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Oct 19, 2016 -> 02:30 PM)
This is something I'd agree with in the past, but since it hasn't been working, they either need to go all in (for once) or sell, and it annoys me that we're *reportedly* trying to half-ass it again (or, at least, we were in July).

 

 

I've seen nothing that suggests they are half-assing it again. I think they are rebuilding.

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QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 08:13 AM)
I've seen nothing that suggests they are half-assing it again. I think they are rebuilding.

My interpretation is that trading Sale but requiring Bradley and his 4 years of control in return is a half-sell, half-buy type of thing.

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Am I that delusional as I watch these playoffs to think the White Sox are not that far off?

 

I don't see stacked lineups and deep rotations. Hell the Dodgers only have two starting pitchers and one of them is the definition of lightening in a bottle.

 

The Giants offense was abysmal and the Dodgers are not much better.

 

 

 

 

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QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 10:30 AM)
Am I that delusional as I watch these playoffs to think the White Sox are not that far off?

 

I don't see stacked lineups and deep rotations. Hell the Dodgers only have two starting pitchers and one of them is the definition of lightening in a bottle.

 

The Giants offense was abysmal and the Dodgers are not much better.

 

The White Sox had 2 players above .800 OPS and 1 just under, the Dodgers have 4 players above .800 OPS and 1 just under it. The Cleveland Indians had 5 players above an .800 OPS and one just under.

 

It took us 3 of our top prospects to net Todd Frazier and his .760 OPS.

 

How do you expect we double our elite offensive players without spending $200 million or gutting our already poor farm system.

 

And that's before bullpens.

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QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 03:30 PM)
Am I that delusional as I watch these playoffs to think the White Sox are not that far off?

 

I don't see stacked lineups and deep rotations. Hell the Dodgers only have two starting pitchers and one of them is the definition of lightening in a bottle.

 

The Giants offense was abysmal and the Dodgers are not much better.

 

I have had same thought. Sale, Q and Rodon is a pretty nasty 3 man playoff rotation.

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QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 11:32 AM)
I don't understand why some non-Sox fans think that trading for Quintana would be much easier than trading for Sale. To me, Q is more consistent and controlled for an extra year. I still think Sale would get a better return, but Q wouldn't be that far behind. He's VERY undervalued.

 

Sale would get a better return in most cases. As I have pointed out before, just read Sox Talk. There are numerous postings through the years of fans saying they are going to a Sale start. Rarely do you see someone choosing a Q start to attend. Around baseball, acquiring Sale could generate ticket and merchandise sales. Now Boston sells out most games anyway so they would not care about ticket sales as much getting the best fit. But Sale could be a box office prize for a team like the Mets.

I would think Q would get 60-70% of the return Sale would. But I also am on record that Sale is probably not tradeable while Q is.

 

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QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 11:30 AM)
Am I that delusional as I watch these playoffs to think the White Sox are not that far off?

 

I don't see stacked lineups and deep rotations. Hell the Dodgers only have two starting pitchers and one of them is the definition of lightening in a bottle.

 

The Giants offense was abysmal and the Dodgers are not much better.

With the stars and scrubs roster, limited payroll flexibility and nothing coming up through the minors of value, trading one or more of our stars is the only way to add significant value and depth. Plus, could you imagine how hosed this franchise would be if we lost either Sale or Quintana. Look at the negative impact Abreu's slump had on the entire team offensively simply because we lack depth.

 

I'd be open to dealing Sale, Abreu, Eaton and or Robertson. Give me one or two major league or major league ready players, and a couple prospects. Plus I can add one or two players with the money I just traded away.

 

Imagine if we did a total rebuild. The talent Sale, Quintana, Eaton, Abreu and Robertson would bring back would be huge.

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QUOTE (striker @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 12:25 PM)
With the stars and scrubs roster, limited payroll flexibility and nothing coming up through the minors of value, trading one or more of our stars is the only way to add significant value and depth. Plus, could you imagine how hosed this franchise would be if we lost either Sale or Quintana. Look at the negative impact Abreu's slump had on the entire team offensively simply because we lack depth.

 

I'd be open to dealing Sale, Abreu, Eaton and or Robertson. Give me one or two major league or major league ready players, and a couple prospects. Plus I can add one or two players with the money I just traded away.

 

Imagine if we did a total rebuild. The talent Sale, Quintana, Eaton, Abreu and Robertson would bring back would be huge.

Robertson would be a pure salary dump. The Sox would be lucky to get 2 lottery ticket prospects for him, IMO.

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QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 12:26 PM)
Robertson would be a pure salary dump. The Sox would be lucky to get 2 lottery ticket prospects for him, IMO.

 

There isn't really any surplus value in Roberson's deal. The one guy in the pen who could move the needle in a deal is Nate Jones.

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QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 10:30 AM)
Am I that delusional as I watch these playoffs to think the White Sox are not that far off?

 

I don't see stacked lineups and deep rotations. Hell the Dodgers only have two starting pitchers and one of them is the definition of lightening in a bottle.

 

The Giants offense was abysmal and the Dodgers are not much better.

 

I've been definitely thinking the same. If you look at who made the playoffs this year, who is a shoe in to make it again next year?

 

Red Sox? Probably, deep system and tons of talent under control

Indians? They'll be tough with Carrasco, Brantley, Salazar, and Gomes back

Rangers? Would be lucky to be a .500 team next year, window is closing

Blue Jays? Bautista and Encarnacion are FAs, they'll take a step back

Orioles? Their window is almost shut

 

Houston will probably be pretty good next year, Detroit is cutting money, Royals are cutting money and probably trading Davis, Mariners do anything for you? Angels suck...

 

Who says the Sox couldn't be a playoff team with a few smart moves?

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QUOTE (Dunt @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 02:10 PM)
I've been definitely thinking the same. If you look at who made the playoffs this year, who is a shoe in to make it again next year?

 

Red Sox? Probably, deep system and tons of talent under control

Indians? They'll be tough with Carrasco, Brantley, Salazar, and Gomes back

Rangers? Would be lucky to be a .500 team next year, window is closing

Blue Jays? Bautista and Encarnacion are FAs, they'll take a step back

Orioles? Their window is almost shut

 

Houston will probably be pretty good next year, Detroit is cutting money, Royals are cutting money and probably trading Davis, Mariners do anything for you? Angels suck...

 

Who says the Sox couldn't be a playoff team with a few smart moves?

There's the rub!

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QUOTE (Dunt @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 03:10 PM)
I've been definitely thinking the same. If you look at who made the playoffs this year, who is a shoe in to make it again next year?

 

Red Sox? Probably, deep system and tons of talent under control

Indians? They'll be tough with Carrasco, Brantley, Salazar, and Gomes back

Rangers? Would be lucky to be a .500 team next year, window is closing

Blue Jays? Bautista and Encarnacion are FAs, they'll take a step back

Orioles? Their window is almost shut

 

Houston will probably be pretty good next year, Detroit is cutting money, Royals are cutting money and probably trading Davis, Mariners do anything for you? Angels suck...

 

Who says the Sox couldn't be a playoff team with a few smart moves?

 

COMMON SENSE DOES!

 

We have TRIED this for long enough. CHRIS SALE CANNOT BEAT THE AL CENTRAL. For 2+ years he has gotten hit pretty hard by EVERY team ESPECIALLY the friggin' Twins.

 

He can net us 3-5 high ceiling prospects WITHOUT QUESTION.

 

Despite the biased/Cubs fanboy media says, the White Sox have a very solid foundation BEFORE you factor in what Sale/Jones/Abreu/Frazier/Melky could bring in.

 

Quintana

Rodon

Eaton

Anderson

Collins

Fulmer

Burdi

Hansen

 

+ other prospects with real potential such as Adams, Danish, Engel, ext

 

 

The White Sox could clear payroll WHILE getting a SURPLUS of elite young talent.

 

It is a no brainer.

 

 

 

 

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QUOTE (Carpe Diem @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 01:53 PM)
COMMON SENSE DOES!

 

We have TRIED this for long enough. CHRIS SALE CANNOT BEAT THE AL CENTRAL. For 2+ years he has gotten hit pretty hard by EVERY team ESPECIALLY the friggin' Twins.

 

He can net us 3-5 high ceiling prospects WITHOUT QUESTION.

 

Despite the biased/Cubs fanboy media says, the White Sox have a very solid foundation BEFORE you factor in what Sale/Jones/Abreu/Frazier/Melky could bring in.

 

Quintana

Rodon

Eaton

Anderson

Collins

Fulmer

Burdi

Hansen

 

+ other prospects with real potential such as Adams, Danish, Engel, ext

 

 

The White Sox could clear payroll WHILE getting a SURPLUS of elite young talent.

 

It is a no brainer.

Welcome, solid voice of reason.

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QUOTE (Carpe Diem @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 03:53 PM)
COMMON SENSE DOES!

 

We have TRIED this for long enough. CHRIS SALE CANNOT BEAT THE AL CENTRAL. For 2+ years he has gotten hit pretty hard by EVERY team ESPECIALLY the friggin' Twins.

 

He can net us 3-5 high ceiling prospects WITHOUT QUESTION.

 

Despite the biased/Cubs fanboy media says, the White Sox have a very solid foundation BEFORE you factor in what Sale/Jones/Abreu/Frazier/Melky could bring in.

 

Quintana

Rodon

Eaton

Anderson

Collins

Fulmer

Burdi

Hansen

 

+ other prospects with real potential such as Adams, Danish, Engel, ext

 

 

The White Sox could clear payroll WHILE getting a SURPLUS of elite young talent.

 

It is a no brainer.

 

 

Quintana reminds me of Jon Lester...no reason to think he won't age well. Even after his contract expires he can pitch another 5-6 high quality years.

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QUOTE (Carpe Diem @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 01:57 PM)
Quintana reminds me of Jon Lester...no reason to think he won't age well. Even after his contract expires he can pitch another 5-6 high quality years.

Welcome, he whom speaks to himself.

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QUOTE (Dunt @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 02:10 PM)
I've been definitely thinking the same. If you look at who made the playoffs this year, who is a shoe in to make it again next year?

 

Red Sox? Probably, deep system and tons of talent under control

Indians? They'll be tough with Carrasco, Brantley, Salazar, and Gomes back

Rangers? Would be lucky to be a .500 team next year, window is closing

Blue Jays? Bautista and Encarnacion are FAs, they'll take a step back

Orioles? Their window is almost shut

 

Houston will probably be pretty good next year, Detroit is cutting money, Royals are cutting money and probably trading Davis, Mariners do anything for you? Angels suck...

 

Who says the Sox couldn't be a playoff team with a few smart moves?

 

Why would the Rangers window be closing? They were without Darvish, Choo and half their pitching staff for most of the year. Their offense isn't going anywhere. It should actually improve without Moreland and Fielder. Beltre will be a year older, but Odor, Mazara and Profar all made big jumps forward this year.

 

The Yankees should carry over their positive momentum as well.

 

The Royals won't be worse unless they deal Cain/Hosmer/Moustakas/Duffy. They're also freeing up salary with Volquez and Morales likely departing. If they can get a return similar to Miller/Giles/Kimbrel for Davis, they'll bring back Holland on an incentives-based deal. Soria can't be any worse. Same with Gordon. Otherwise, they hold and try to compete for one last year through the deadline.

Edited by caulfield12
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I think the Rangers are bogus and the Tigers will continue to slide back. Royals will win 85ish.

But the Angels could get a lot better, the Yankees will be decent and the Astros may have take a small step back to take a leap forward if they can develop pitching(they foolishly traded young pitching last offseason). Seattle will be solid.

 

It's easy to concoct a lineup where the Sox look like a contender. And Hahn can trade the good prospects we have for proven veterans. But I just don't see the defense or the pitching depth to really contend. And the usual usual Hahn moves for players that other teams are openly trying to dump just won't get it done.

I'm not sure that Hahn is capable of much else.

But if he is, a trade of Sale could make this a better ballclub.

Get a young CF and 3B or catcher in here and give the young pitching a year to pull together and see what happens.

Edited by GreenSox
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Mazara and Profar were arguably their two worst offensive players, after Moreland and Fielder.

 

You have a healthy Choo, two superior catchers in Chirinos and Lucroy, Beltre, Darvish and numerous pitchers back, Odor and then Andrus had a really good season as well.

 

Desmond faded in the second half...along with Profar and Mazara, but they also have the advantage of a huge tv contract to pad the payroll down there. They also are saving a ton of money that looked like a sunk cost with the Fielder insurance settlement.

 

When you've got Darvish/Hamels and that bullpen, you've always got a chance.

Edited by caulfield12
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QUOTE (hi8is @ Oct 23, 2016 -> 12:57 AM)
Sale or Quintana sure are looking good to the Dodgers right about now.

Not sure what the Dodgers have to give up for a guy like Sale. Seager is unavailable, probably Pederson, too. Puig is not nearly enough.

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