Bob Sacamano Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Mar 7, 2017 -> 12:11 PM) To further elaborate on this...yes, I prefer Moncada to Robles, but I still think the Sox could've gotten more for Sale. I think they knocked the Eaton trade out of the park, but I was hoping for another player from Boston. Devers was probably a pipe dream but I don't know why the Sox couldn't get at least one of Travis/Swihart/Dalbec in addition to the 4 players they received. Or even one of those guys instead of the 4th piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I would have preferred Benentendi and Devers to Moncada and Kopech based on what the team needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCsoxfan Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 QUOTE (miracleon35th @ Mar 7, 2017 -> 01:55 PM) I would have preferred Benentendi and Devers to Moncada and Kopech based on what the team needs. Benintendi wasn't on the table period though, and they weren't dealing Moncada AND Devers. I highly doubt anyone would've wanted Kopech and Devers headlining the package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (NCsoxfan @ Mar 7, 2017 -> 01:06 PM) Benintendi wasn't on the table period though, and they weren't dealing Moncada AND Devers. I highly doubt anyone would've wanted Kopech and Devers headlining the package. Yeah, people need to stop thinking that it was even a possibility. What reason did Boston have to trade him? If we wanted to win a WS this year, would we trade Tim Anderson as part of a deal? I realize that's stretching it (a lot), but not only is Benintendi their top prospect, one of the best in baseball, but a part of their lineup going forward. He wasn't coming to Chicago at any point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (miracleon35th @ Mar 7, 2017 -> 12:55 PM) I would have preferred Benentendi and Devers to Moncada and Kopech based on what the team needs. Benintendi was never on the table as far as we know, and there is no way the Sox were not going to get at least one quality pitching prospect back as a headliner for Sale. Getting Kopech was a very important piece of the deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 The deal was awesome for the Sox, whats the issue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 08:38 AM) The deal was awesome for the Sox, whats the issue? That's debatable. While I'm not upset about our return, I still think we could've gotten more. Moncada/Kopech and Diaz as a wild card are fine, but I wish our 3rd piece was better. I know Devers would be unrealistic, but I feel like getting Groome over Basabe would have been a better reflection of Sale's value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSoxFanMike Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Moncada/Kopech/Devers/Diaz = Slam Dunk Moncada/Kopech/Basabe/any of Dalbec, Swihart, Travis/Diaz = Very Nice Moncada/Kopech/Basabe/Diaz = Decent That's how I see it. I agree with Jose Abreu above. They didn't do terrible but they could've done better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:04 AM) Moncada/Kopech/Devers/Diaz = Slam Dunk Moncada/Kopech/Basabe/any of Dalbec, Swihart, Travis/Diaz = Very Nice Moncada/Kopech/Basabe/Diaz = Decent That's how I see it. I agree with Jose Abreu above. They didn't do terrible but they could've done better. What makes people think this was available? Secondly, how long would you have been willing to wait out the Red Sox to try to get this? It essentially took from the trading deadline to the GM meetings to arrive at this deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:11 AM) What makes people think this was available? Secondly, how long would you have been willing to wait out the Red Sox to try to get this? It essentially took from the trading deadline to the GM meetings to arrive at this deal. I can't tell if this board underrates how valuable a top 5 and top 20 prospect is to a team, or if its the underrating of prospects in the 50-150 range, where because of the anchoring of the top talent suddenly seem like "throw-ins" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) Although I also believe they could've gotten Groome over say Diaz, the fact that the Eaton deal probably never materializes right after seals it for me. I highly doubt they'd get those guys if Eaton was dealt first before Sale. I have 0 issues with the Sale return. I really like Basabe as a prospect. Add in the other 2 with a wildcard in Diaz? Holy s***. Edited March 8, 2017 by SoxAce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSoxFanMike Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (bmags @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:17 AM) I can't tell if this board underrates how valuable a top 5 and top 20 prospect is to a team, or if its the underrating of prospects in the 50-150 range, where because of the anchoring of the top talent suddenly seem like "throw-ins" I believe Sale is worth 3 top 50 prospects. I feel like the Sox might have been able to pry Devers away had the Price injury happened earlier but I guess it wasn't meant to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:34 AM) I believe Sale is worth 3 top 50 prospects. I feel like the Sox might have been able to pry Devers away had the Price injury happened earlier but I guess it wasn't meant to be. There is a difference between a "top 50 prospect" and the #1 or #2 prospect in baseball Other than Benintendi, Moncada is arguably the most prized prospect in baseball right now Kopech is a top 20 mlb prospect Basabe is a top 150 mlb prospect, possibly top 100 with a good season Diaz is an interesting throw in with a 70 grade fastball. Could turn into a relief option? Devers was never going to be included in this deal, as Boston knew that their package was better than the Nationals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:11 AM) What makes people think this was available? Secondly, how long would you have been willing to wait out the Red Sox to try to get this? It essentially took from the trading deadline to the GM meetings to arrive at this deal. Based on what Hahn & DD have revealed, they didn't spend much time negotiating the pieces after Moncada & Kopech. The conversation basically went from Devers to Basabe & Diaz. That's a huge drop-off in asking price. DD didn't even have to ask the rest of his front office if they were ok with giving up Basabe & Diaz. To me, that suggests the Sox could have done a little better on the back-end of the deal if they pushed a bit harder. My guess is they didn't want to risk the Red Sox backing out on including Moncada and were much higher than on Basabe & Diaz than most national publications (which Hahn's commentary suggests). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 08:58 AM) That's debatable. While I'm not upset about our return, I still think we could've gotten more. Moncada/Kopech and Diaz as a wild card are fine, but I wish our 3rd piece was better. I know Devers would be unrealistic, but I feel like getting Groome over Basabe would have been a better reflection of Sale's value. They clearly couldn't get more. You could argue that a package of Robles/Giolito/Lopez from Washington is better but then you don't same prospect from Boston for Eaton. This was a long process. I'm pretty sure the Sox extracted the maximum value that they could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (steveno89 @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:55 AM) There is a difference between a "top 50 prospect" and the #1 or #2 prospect in baseball Other than Benintendi, Moncada is arguably the most prized prospect in baseball right now Kopech is a top 20 mlb prospect Basabe is a top 150 mlb prospect, possibly top 100 with a good season Diaz is an interesting throw in with a 70 grade fastball. Could turn into a relief option? Devers was never going to be included in this deal, as Boston knew that their package was better than the Nationals Moncada has the chance to be one of the best players in baseball. Kopech could be the best pitcher in baseball. 1 writer that everyone hates has him as the best pitching prospect in the game currently. That was the best you could possibly do IMO. Keep in mind that Hostetler comes from the Schuerholz method of scouting. Athletes at premium positions. Basabe is an athletic CF. Diaz is a great 4th piece because if he's kept in bullpen, he should come really quick. There's no reason to complain about it. Our initial expectations were too high. It doesn't matter what we think Chris Sale was worth anymore. The market showed us exactly what he was "worth" and every writer/analyst widely praised the deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 08:58 AM) That's debatable. While I'm not upset about our return, I still think we could've gotten more. Moncada/Kopech and Diaz as a wild card are fine, but I wish our 3rd piece was better. I know Devers would be unrealistic, but I feel like getting Groome over Basabe would have been a better reflection of Sale's value. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Assuming Devers was never going to be apart of the deal, I think the only way the Sale haul could have realistically been better is if Hahn pushed for Dalbec over Diaz, which I would have preferred. Still, I like the haul the Sox received so I'm at peace with the trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 08:58 AM) That's debatable. While I'm not upset about our return, I still think we could've gotten more. Moncada/Kopech and Diaz as a wild card are fine, but I wish our 3rd piece was better. I know Devers would be unrealistic, but I feel like getting Groome over Basabe would have been a better reflection of Sale's value. There's a significant difference between asking for Basabe and asking for Groome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 10:06 AM) They clearly couldn't get more. You could argue that a package of Robles/Giolito/Lopez from Washington is better but then you don't same prospect from Boston for Eaton. This was a long process. I'm pretty sure the Sox extracted the maximum value that they could. That's the big thing here. Look at both trades together and see if sending Sale to Washington gets you less for Eaton. The Eaton trade is the potential steal here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:18 AM) Although I also believe they could've gotten Groome over say Diaz, the fact that the Eaton deal probably never materializes right after seals it for me. I highly doubt they'd get those guys if Eaton was dealt first before Sale. I have 0 issues with the Sale return. I really like Basabe as a prospect. Add in the other 2 with a wildcard in Diaz? Holy s***. This is an interesting thought. I wonder how much thought was given to the entire package for the two players (Sale/Eaton) because we know that if Sale is dealt to Washington, they don't get the Eaton package for sure. I wonder if the combination of deals is what did it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 09:34 AM) I believe Sale is worth 3 top 50 prospects. I feel like the Sox might have been able to pry Devers away had the Price injury happened earlier but I guess it wasn't meant to be. There are 30 MLB teams, how many have 3 top 50 prospects? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 10:43 AM) There are 30 MLB teams, how many have 3 top 50 prospects? Good point. Some don't even have 1. Edited March 8, 2017 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSoxFanMike Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 10:43 AM) There are 30 MLB teams, how many have 3 top 50 prospects? Uh...the Red Sox did before the trade. The Nationals before the Eaton deal as well, maybe the Dodgers, Brewers, Padres, Braves, and Yankees too. My point isn't that Hahn got robbed in this trade. Moncada and Kopech at the front end were great gets. I'm simply saying he probably could've gotten one more impact piece had he been a little more persistent in the negotiations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Mar 8, 2017 -> 10:49 AM) Uh...the Red Sox did before the trade. The Nationals before the Eaton deal as well, maybe the Dodgers, Brewers, Padres, Braves, and Yankees too. My point isn't that Hahn got robbed in this trade. Moncada and Kopech at the front end were great gets. I'm simply saying he probably could've gotten one more impact piece had he been a little more persistent in the negotiations. That's just it though. Not every team wants to deal away that much. This is likely the best offer they received. All we heard was reluctance to part with guys from the Yankees and Braves side (doubt either interest was sincere enough). Dodgers, Brewers and Padres were never connected. Nationals are moot since we received 2 of them the next day. That leaves only Red Sox. Red Sox don't have to pay 3 top 50 guys if the best offer for Sale (their's) only includes 2. Edited March 8, 2017 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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