Quintana Rumors: Round and round and round we go

[SoxAce]

The Morosi report seems like a White Sox leak.

 

Could be. Cashman is pretty good friends with Hahn (and KW for that matter).

[bmags]

Holy crap I found something strange in the internet. Check out this entirely reasonable article and comment section from yankees fans:

http://www.pinstripealley.com/yankees-rumo...-trade-interest

[bmags]

Sale netted #1 and #30, so 2 top 50 isn't out of the question, Q is nearly as good as Sale if hype is ignored and production analyzed. So, fine, how about Torres, Frazier, Andujar, Montgomery?

 

My problem isn't necessarily with a Torres/Frazier package, it's mostly how our hypotheticals throw in additional top 100 prospects like they are of little consequence. I think the above trade is closer to possilbe but it would not shock me if Frazier is one Yanks want to keep due to him being a reasonable bet for 2017.

[Dam8610]

My problem isn't necessarily with a Torres/Frazier package, it's mostly how our hypotheticals throw in additional top 100 prospects like they are of little consequence. I think the above trade is closer to possilbe but it would not shock me if Frazier is one Yanks want to keep due to him being a reasonable bet for 2017.

 

Would you trade Q for a bunch of rookie and A ballers? I wouldn't, too much risk.

[steveno89]

Sale netted #1 and #30, so 2 top 50 isn't out of the question, Q is nearly as good as Sale if hype is ignored and production analyzed. So, fine, how about Torres, Frazier, Andujar, Montgomery?

 

I would definitely take a Torres, Frazier, Andujar and Montgomery for Quintana

 

Quintana's four years of control for $38 million make him a huge bargain

 

I am reading a bunch of articles suggesting "Maybe Mateo + Kaprielian" or "Justus Sheffield" as a centerpiece should get it done and am laughing

 

Judge frightens me. He strikes out far too often and I don't know how long his 6'7" , 275 lb body will hold up. Mateo is a good fielder and very fast, but I am not sure how his hit tool will hold up. Rutherford is very far away from the major leagues

 

 

[almagest]

Holy crap I found something strange in the internet. Check out this entirely reasonable article and comment section from yankees fans:

http://www.pinstripealley.com/yankees-rumo...-trade-interest

I was expecting proposals like "We'll give them Texiera and Headley for Quintana, Robertson and Frazier" but those are all actually sane. They seem to be thinking the same as us - they've got a ton of hitting prospects and we have the pitching they used to have need.

 

[Dam8610]

MLB Network: "Quintana isn't an ace, he's a solid #2."

 

I swear Quintana could be an All-Star for the next three years, win a Cy Young and 20 games and people would still go "Well, he's good but..."

 

A top 10 pitcher in baseball for the last 4 years is a #2? Tough to be an Ace these days.

[username]

Yeah to be honest I think the Yankees are unlikely to deal the guys on the cusp of the majors, like Frazier/Judge/etc. Their OF is extremely old/mediocre and they're looking to compete in the near future (if not now) if they're trading major prospects for a guy like Q.

 

I'm also skeptical about their willingness to trade Torres, after his monster AFL and a ton of prospect helium. But he's still unlikely to make an impact for a few years so I wouldn't rule it out.

 

I think the Yankees come to the Sox with something along the lines of Mateo + Rutherford + a high ceiling arm or two. Not sure I'd take that but Rutherford has really shot up the rankings recently. If the Sox can net Torres and Rutherford ++ I'd be all over that.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Username

[bmags]

Would you trade Q for a bunch of rookie and A ballers? I wouldn't, too much risk.

 

I would for the right rookies and a ballers because I don't find that to be a helpful descriptor for the type of talent you are getting back. I value Torres much higher than Judge even though Judge made show last year.

[bmags]

I was expecting proposals like "We'll give them Texiera and Headley for Quintana, Robertson and Frazier" but those are all actually sane. They seem to be thinking the same as us - they've got a ton of hitting prospects and we have the pitching they used to have need.

 

Also their logic that the yankees will need to stay under luxury tax after recent CBA changes and Q helps with that.

[SoxAce]

I wonder how Greg Bird's shoulder is doing. He would be an interesting buy low guy to target if Yanks like Austin/Ford enough.

[Dam8610]

I was expecting proposals like "We'll give them Texiera and Headley for Quintana, Robertson and Frazier" but those are all actually sane. They seem to be thinking the same as us - they've got a ton of hitting prospects and we have the pitching they used to have need.

 

Yeah, a couple of them started at Torres + Frazier and said more would need to be added.

[steveno89]

I was expecting proposals like "We'll give them Texiera and Headley for Quintana, Robertson and Frazier" but those are all actually sane. They seem to be thinking the same as us - they've got a ton of hitting prospects and we have the pitching they used to have need.

 

I firmly believe that 4 cheap years of Quintana is equal to (possibly even greater than) the value of three seasons of Sale at the same dollar amount

 

 

[BRIRO2017]

A top 10 pitcher in baseball for the last 4 years is a #2? Tough to be an Ace these days.

 

He's a number 2. He wasnt even a number 1 on a bad team. Ever. Being a number 1, on a good team, is something Q hasnt even approached. Abreu and Ordonez get/got most of their "numbers" when their team is/was buried. Quintana has much to prove to ever be considered a 1.

[steveno89]

Yeah, a couple of them started at Torres + Frazier and said more would need to be added.

 

Two seasons and a few months rental of Miller got the Yankees Frazier + Sheffield

 

3 months of Chapman got them Torres plus more

 

4 years of Quintana should absolutely get the White Sox Torres + Frazier ++

[caulfield12]

Assuming the Yankees view Frazier as a core player due to his proximity to the big leagues (and need to replenish their OF with young talent), it would have to be Torres and Rutherford as your two headliners with Mateo (somewhere between Robles, but closer to Basabe) as the wild card third piece or four players and the last two being bigger question marks.

Edited December 19, 2016 by caulfield12

[steveno89]

He's a number 2. He wasnt even a number 1 on a bad team. Ever. Being a number 1, on a good team, is something Q hasnt even approached. Abreu and Ordonez get/got most of their "numbers" when their team is/was buried. Quintana has much to prove to ever be considered a 1.

 

The past three seasons have Quintana at #7 of all starting pitchers in WAR. I'm not sure how that is not considered to be an ace by any stretch?

 

 

[Dam8610]

I would for the right rookies and a ballers because I don't find that to be a helpful descriptor for the type of talent you are getting back. I value Torres much higher than Judge even though Judge made show last year.

 

I get that the potential can be higher on the younger guys, but the bust rate is a lot higher. I'm not saying take a Judge over a Torres, that would be insane (incidentally, Judge is the type of player I could see the Sox FO falling in love with that they need to avoid like the plague). What I'm saying is if you're taking a Torres for a Q, that's not nearly enough and I'd rather have a Frazier than a Rutherford as the second piece so that we're not looking at extremely high bust rates on the whole return. Like it or not, someone who's made it to AAA while maintaining their prospect status is a lot more likely to give you a solid everyday contributor than the guy who may someday be a superstar, but is in A ball today.

[caulfield12]

What is the Yankees' projected outfield and DH situation right nowv?

 

Gardner, Ellsbury....?

[steveno89]

Assuming the Yankees view Frazier as a core player due to his proximity to the big leagues (and need to replenish their OF with young talent), it would have to be Torres and Rutherford as your two headliners with Mateo (somewhere between Robles, but closer to Basabe) as the wild card third piece or four players and the last two being bigger question marks.

 

Mateo and Judge are both very overrated prospects in my opinion.

 

Judge is massive at 6'7" , 275 lbs and I worry about how a frame like that will hold up over time. He strikes out far too often for my liking. He will be 25 years old in April, and is not exactly a "young" prospect.

 

Mateo is a good fielder and has great speed, but I worry about his hit tool. He did not exactly tear up high A this season at age 21, and I'm concerned AA pitching will eat him alive. He put up a below average ISO of .125

[Dam8610]

He's a number 2. He wasnt even a number 1 on a bad team. Ever. Being a number 1, on a good team, is something Q hasnt even approached. Abreu and Ordonez get/got most of their "numbers" when their team is/was buried. Quintana has much to prove to ever be considered a 1.

 

He wasn't a #1 on the White Sox because they also happened to have a Top 3-5 pitcher in all of baseball, his name is Chris Sale, you may have heard of him. Being the White Sox #2 behind Sale makes Q no less of a top 10 pitcher in all of baseball over the last 4 years, and if a top 10 pitcher in MLB isn't an Ace, I don't know what is.

[bmags]

I get that the potential can be higher on the younger guys, but the bust rate is a lot higher. I'm not saying take a Judge over a Torres, that would be insane (incidentally, Judge is the type of player I could see the Sox FO falling in love with that they need to avoid like the plague). What I'm saying is if you're taking a Torres for a Q, that's not nearly enough and I'd rather have a Frazier than a Rutherford as the second piece so that we're not looking at extremely high bust rates on the whole return. Like it or not, someone who's made it to AAA while maintaining their prospect status is a lot more likely to give you a solid everyday contributor than the guy who may someday be a superstar, but is in A ball today.

 

I understand you, but let's assume with an actual second bidder that the astros would deal Musgrove, Martes and Tucker for Q. You have 2 near major leaguers there in Musgrove/Martes (musgrove is)

 

The Yankees get involved but insist they need Frazier for next year but offer Gleybar Torres, Blake Rutherford, Andjuhar and Chance Adams

 

Which would you take? Though inherently riskier, I would take Yankees package.

[BRIRO2017]

The past three seasons have Quintana at #7 of all starting pitchers in WAR. I'm not sure how that is not considered to be an ace by any stretch?

 

He's had zero pressure. It's like the pressure of a back up QB vs a starter.

[BRIRO2017]

He wasn't a #1 on the White Sox because they also happened to have a Top 3-5 pitcher in all of baseball, his name is Chris Sale, you may have heard of him. Being the White Sox #2 behind Sale makes Q no less of a top 10 pitcher in all of baseball over the last 4 years, and if a top 10 pitcher in MLB isn't an Ace, I don't know what is.

He's not an ace.

[mmmmmbeeer]

He's had zero pressure. It's like the pressure of a back up QB vs a starter.

 

Neither has Chris Sale....is he an ace?