Quintana Rumors: Round and round and round we go

[thedoctor]

http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/sean-ge...es/201612210195

 

I know front offices pretend to not listen to this kind of talk, but there is exasperation in Pittsburgh over always coming in second in these player derbys. A lot of their fans are sick of having a great group of prospects but an average-to-good MLB squad that seems to constantly suffer because the pricetags (whether it be money or prospects) are never met by the Pirates to bring in outside help. It explains why some fans have thrown out truly ludicrous proposals like "Meadows, Bell +" or, really anything including more than 1 of the Glasnow, Meadows, Bell group. They want to make a splash for once and really go for the throat in division rather than constantly punting away season after season because things aren't exactly right.

 

local media applying pressure. love it.

[BlackSox13]

Crazy idea to help Pitt. Trading for Q alone will not make the Pirates a contender for '17. It would provide a nice spark for the fan base but the luster would wear off in no time and once they step back and look at the team, that spark is still just a mere fart. They need more than just Q. I'm thinking meet the Pirates half way in terms of working out a trade. I can see why they don't want to part with Meadows so as an effort to meet em half way offer to leave Meadows out of the trade and make a Frazier for McCutchen deal as part of the trade package. But, the Pirates will pay for it in terms of prospects for Q. Bell, Glasnow, Keller and Hayes. The Pirates add a very stable pitcher to a very unstable rotation, get a 3B with power (better than Freese), get Meadows into CF and overall would not be adding a huge amount to their '17 payroll. That would energize the fan base as well as send a message that they are serious about '17.

 

Sox get a nice package of prospects to add to what they already have, McCutchen to play CF in a small park to help rebuild his value and potentially bring back a haul at the deadline or next winter if the Sox picked up his '18 option of 14.75M. If McCutchen were to get out of the gate strong in '17, a desperate team would pay much more for McCutchen than what the Sox might get now or later for Frazier.

 

Yes, I'm bored while I wait for the next rumor to come out.

 

Edit: screw it, scratch Hayes and make Newman part of the return. I think the Pirates are more desperate than some might think.

Edited December 22, 2016 by BlackSox13

[BlackSox13]

I have been thinking the same thing. Thanks for saying it.

I really didn't want to come across as being spiteful towards Sale now that he's gone but it was a concern of mine. But as ptatc pointed out, it's a shame Sale didn't get the chance with the White Sox. I do wish him well on the days he does not pitch against the White Sox.

[TheFutureIsNear]

If Meadows really is "untouchable" is there a package that would work. Would the Pirates do Bell, Glasnow, Keller, and Newman? Would/Should we do that?

[ptatc]

To be fair Caulfield was responding to a post of mine where I said , "Meadows has to be the headliner. Not only that but I was thinking Q could require a bigger haul than Sale since he has 1 more year and is cheaper than Sale. Plus the Sale trade had the #1 prospect in baseball who cost the Red Sox around $64M which maybe Hahn took into consideration as far as valuations go."

 

Throw in the fact that Pittsburgh as a small market team cannot compete with the free agent money and you kind of have them bent over the proverbial negotiation table . But still it's mostly the extra year of control and the cheaper contract.

I hear what you're saying. I just don't think it will play out that way. I'll be shocked if the trade Q and the prospects are equal to or greater than the haul for Sale.

 

However, it's not like I've never been wrong before, my wife and kids constantly remind me of that.

[reiks12]

If Meadows really is "untouchable" is there a package that would work. Would the Pirates do Bell, Glasnow, Keller, and Newman? Would/Should we do that?

 

I would definitely make that trade. I honestly think it is a bit of an overpay however.

 

[Balta1701]

If Meadows really is "untouchable" is there a package that would work. Would the Pirates do Bell, Glasnow, Keller, and Newman? Would/Should we do that?

If Meadows is untouchable then I can't see how them doing any deal for Quintana makes sense until they know what can happen with McCutchen.

[Chicago White Sox]

If Meadows really is "untouchable" is there a package that would work. Would the Pirates do Bell, Glasnow, Keller, and Newman? Would/Should we do that?

They should definitely do that trade if offered it, but the Pirates aren't trading four top 100 guys in the same deal and I think they'd like to keep one of Glasnow & Keller. I think if you swap out Keller for Diaz you might have something that's a bit more realistic and still a haul for us. Ultimately I think if Meadows is untouchable, then we must get both Glasnow & Bell.

[NCsoxfan]

Friend is a diehard Pirates fan and said this about Glasnow:

 

"he struggled a bit in the majors, velocity was down, and seemed unable/unwilling to throw changeups even in the minors. I wonder if they're ready to move on from him"

 

That being said, he barely pitched in the majors, right?

[Balta1701]

They should definitely do that trade if offered it, but the Pirates aren't trading four top 100 guys in the same deal and I think they'd like to keep one of Glasnow & Keller. I think if you swap out Keller for Diaz you might have something that's a bit more realistic and still a haul for us. Ultimately I think if Meadows is untouchable, then we must get both Glasnow & Bell.

If they're holding onto Meadows...then the basic question I'd ask is why they need to go out and get a #2 starting pitcher right now and why that's a priority rather than giving Bell, Meadows, and Glasnow time to develop? Yes, Quintana will still help them in 2018 and 2019, but why pay the premium price to get him in 2017 if you're transitioning Meadows into the OF?

[Dunt]

Pirates have signed Ivan Nova. Either they are preparing to trade Glasnow or they are out on Quintana.

[Balta1701]

Friend is a diehard Pirates fan and said this about Glasnow:

 

"he struggled a bit in the majors, velocity was down, and seemed unable/unwilling to throw changeups even in the minors. I wonder if they're ready to move on from him"

 

That being said, he barely pitched in the majors, right?

Yeah, he had a shoulder injury last year and only started 4 games in the bigs. That said, he threw 110 innings at AAA last year with an ERA under 2, so while they might have been a bit flustered by him getting hurt again, the numbers in the minors for a 22 year old are screaming "TOR pitcher". The thing they're worried about more than anything else with him was control.

 

See, I'm cool, I can use that abbreviation too.

[T R U]

Agreed. Hahn has said plenty of times these guys are likely starting the season in the minors and will not be rushed which makes sense when looking at the Sox roster as of now. There's only a small market for Frazier/ Robertson and literally none for Melky/Lowrie so we likely start the season with them and look to move Frazier/Robertson in July and hope that Melky/Lowrie can play well enough to get something in return. There's no need to trade Q if teams won't pay and with four years of control left he will have plenty of value at the deadline and next winter. None the less I still think a team will blink and trade for Q. As for Abreu, I don't think the Sox are too interested in trading Abreu and probably prefer to keep him around to mentor Moncada when he's ready for a call up which IMO is the right move unless a team offers a big overpay.

 

Another point is a team does not trade it's best pitcher and overall hitter for prospects that very from A to 3A experience if they are not rebuilding. This is a different and better strategy than what the Sox have used in recent years with the "rebuilding on the fly" and " retooling" routes previously taken.

 

I've taken my fair share of shots at JR but I give him credit for going ahead and rebuilding. Never thought he would do it at 80 years old but he's proved me wrong.

 

I agree, its just a strange feeling I have. Also I guess because we had the two big trades so close together and now its been pretty much silence. I do believe they are rebuilding, its just odd that so far the only two pieces to move have been the two guys who caused the most "issues". I also don't think anyone would be shocked if Moncada, Giolito, or Lopez played well enough to earn a spot on the opening day roster regardless of what Hahn is spinning. They don't have stiff competition to beat out. At worst, they play the extra year of control game and then we see them up. Again, this is assuming they perform well enough to earn a spot.

 

Well see, I still think they will trade Q but I also wouldn't be surprised in the least to see them back off of the full rebuild and do the ol White Sox retool that we all love.

[GreenSox]

No Glasgow as centerpiece please. Appears to be in decline and Sox need position players. He is at the point in his career where he should be ready to step into a rotation....but he isn't.

[Bob Sacamano]

Pirates have signed Ivan Nova. Either they are preparing to trade Glasnow or they are out on Quintana.

 

Man, if he can pitch like he did for them over those final 2 months AND traded for Q: Cole, Quintana, Nova, Taillon 1-4.

[Bob Sacamano]

No Glasgow as centerpiece please. Appears to be in decline and Sox need position players. He is at the point in his career where he should be ready to step into a rotation....but he isn't.

 

He's 22 lol

[caulfield12]

Q makes a lot more sense if they hold onto McCutcheon...

[GGajewski18]

Man, if he can pitch like he did for them over those final 2 months AND traded for Q: Cole, Quintana, Nova, Taillon 1-4.

 

Exactly. Their rotation would be very good along with their lineup. Quintana, Cole, Nova, Taillon, and Kuhl/Hutchison/Williams is a formidable 5.

 

Maybe signing of Nova is a sign that they will be going for it with McCuthen's last 2 seasons with them.

 

Quintana and Jennings for Meadows, Glasnow, Escobar, and Diaz

[Bob Sacamano]

Exactly. Their rotation would be very good along with their lineup. Quintana, Cole, Nova, Taillon, and Kuhl/Hutchison/Williams is a formidable 5.

 

Maybe signing of Nova is a sign that they will be going for it with McCuthen's last 2 seasons with them.

 

Quintana and Jennings for Meadows, Glasnow, Escobar, and Diaz

 

Sign me up.

Edited December 22, 2016 by soxfan2014

[Dick Allen]

He's 22 lol

He has been too good for GreenSox. He likes mediocre guys. Glasnow is 22 has a 2.06 ERA in 500 minor league innings and struck out over 1 an inning during his brief call up. I want the Sox to get position players, but in decline, isn't ready for a rotation spot and should be at 22 is just so far against what he has posted about far lesser prospects. It has to be a joke. Now he isn't happy with prospects.

[GreenSox]

He's 22 lol

Decline in prospect terms means they aren't making the progress they once were. May be overcome, or it may not be, but it needs to be discounted from player value.

[Feeky Magee]

Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal 3m3 minutes ago

Source: #Pirates still trying to acquire #WhiteSox’s Quintana even after deal Nova. That pursuit was first reported by @Buster_ESPN.

[YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES!]

What does the Nova signing have to do with their chances of getting Q? You guys think Glasnow might be part of a package since they don't need him anymore?

[Bob Sacamano]

What does the Nova signing have to do with their chances of getting Q? You guys think Glasnow might be part of a package since they don't need him anymore?

 

Going for it mode. Their rotation looks a lot better with both Nova and Quintana than just one or the other. Or neither. Especially if Nova pitches like he did last year for them.

Edited December 22, 2016 by soxfan2014

[bmags]

My only comment re Glasgow is while I'm all about grabbing top pitchers from Nats they couldn't get a handle on I'm less bullish we can turn around a prospect they couldn't develop themselves. They are probably better than us at this.