2017 Democratic Thread

[Reddy]

Reddy on Medicare for all - Meaningless bill that won't pass

 

Reddy on Better Deal press conference people have already forgotten- This is a game changer!

You have understood my positions. Well done!

[GoSox05]

It's a meaningless bill that won't pass being used as a political football to get 2020 hopefuls Bernie-points. That's all. There's very little to see here in the short term.

 

It's also just a bad bill. I support single payer - not this bill.

 

 

It's a good bill, that if anything is bringing attention to medicare for all, that is becoming a more popular idea in this country every day.

 

 

You keep saying that you support single payer, but seem to say it's a bad idea every time Bernie Sanders or others try to get things passed.

 

 

It's just the same pessimistic attitude from Democrats over and over. The party of "we won't be able to do that".

Edited September 14, 2017 by GoSox05

[bmags]

It's a good bill, that if anything is bringing attention to medicare for all, that is becoming a more popular idea in this country every day.

 

 

You keep saying that you support single payer, but seem to say it's a bad idea every time Bernie Sanders or others try to get things passed.

 

 

It's just the same pessimistic attitude from Democrats over and over. The party of "we won't be able to do that".

 

It is a downpayment on intent. The bill itself will need to change, and it clearly is likely the workability will largely be more in line with a medicare buy-in, however, this is the only new policy the democrats have introduced that has generated publicity that cuts through the daily noise and has organic excitement. DACA/Dream act I consider separate but has very good mobilization by some great grass roots orgs.

 

Sanders is basically the only democrat that matters right now until someone can show the same ability to form a message.

[Reddy]

It's a good bill, that if anything is bringing attention to medicare for all, that is becoming a more popular idea in this country every day.

 

 

You keep saying that you support single payer, but seem to say it's a bad idea every time Bernie Sanders or others try to get things passed.

 

 

It's just the same pessimistic attitude from Democrats over and over. The party of "we won't be able to do that".

 

- Every independent analysis determined that it was underfunded by $14-17 trillion over the next ten years

 

- He estimates $438 billion per year in savings solely on administrative costs, even though administrative waste only comes out to $215 billion per year, and overtreatment, failures of care coordination, pricing failures, fraud, and abuse are all still possible avenues of administrative waste in any system

 

- He said that he could decrease public spending on prescription drugs by $324 billion. Public spending on prescription drugs is only $305 billion.

 

- He said that we could simply pay for most of our prescriptions through Canada, cause he is somehow under the impression that there's no such thing as differential pricing, and that Canada's government would subsidize and negotiate on behalf of hundreds of millions of Americans (hint: they said they wouldn't)

 

- He said his 6.2% payroll tax will fall ONLY on employers. He somehow doesn't realize that the legal incidence of a tax is separate from the economic incidence of a tax.

 

- The single payer bill failed in Vermont due to costs, and in California is failing too. Probably because it costs twice the state's entire budget. Not their entire healthcare budget. The whole budget.

 

- It promises more comprehensive coverage than Medicare or the world's best single payer systems, without any details about controlling costs, without measures to check demand for services, without accounting for sticky wages in the healthcare industry, and without dealing with any impact to R&D.

 

 

Edited September 15, 2017 by Reddy

[bmags]

It may end up being a rebranded public option, but that shows more political aptitude than we've seen in 7 or so years from them.

[Reddy]

It is a downpayment on intent. The bill itself will need to change, and it clearly is likely the workability will largely be more in line with a medicare buy-in, however, this is the only new policy the democrats have introduced that has generated publicity that cuts through the daily noise and has organic excitement. DACA/Dream act I consider separate but has very good mobilization by some great grass roots orgs.

 

Sanders is basically the only democrat that matters right now until someone can show the same ability to form a message.

He's not a Democrat.

 

Chuck Schumer says hi.

[bmags]

He is at this moment the leader of the Democrats. Chuck Schumer could say carbon tax is the #1 priority in 2020 and no other dems would be asked about it.

 

If Sanders said it, everyone would be pressured to fall in line.

 

ANd that's fine, actual party leaders don't need to be the ones advancing the agenda as much as executing it.

[LittleHurt05]

https://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20170914/ed...nder-jon-police

 

I find this crazy. I recognize Edison Park would be an area of a lot of police officers. But to me the Burge era and the after-effects is one of the biggest influencing events in Chicago of the last 30 years. I'm glad they are teaching Chicago history though, that is pretty cool.

 

I live next to Edison Park. I find nothing about this crazy.

[bmags]

I live next to Edison Park. I find nothing about this crazy.

 

Yeah I didn't mean I'm surprised by the push back but I find their arguments for not including this in a Chicago history to be crazy.

 

 

[GoSox05]

He's not a Democrat.

 

Chuck Schumer says hi.

 

 

Why are liberals so obsessed with pointing out that Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat?

 

It's just amazing.

[bigruss]

Why are liberals so obsessed with pointing out that Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat?

 

It's just amazing.

Or the infuriating part to me is that they claim this, and hate that he has the spotlight instead of other Dems and then BLAME him for it.

 

For f***s sake, stop blaming him and figure out why your party members aren't getting the same reaction. Have some damn accountability and self awareness in your party.

[Brian]

Why are liberals so obsessed with pointing out that Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat?

 

It's just amazing.

 

Its something Hillary is saying a lot on her book tour while blaming him, partly, for her loss.

[bigruss]

Yeah I didn't mean I'm surprised by the push back but I find their arguments for not including this in a Chicago history to be crazy.

The system that protects cops runs deep.

[bmags]

Its something Hillary is saying a lot on her book tour while blaming him, partly, for her loss.

 

It is equally annoying that Sanders can critique Clinton's campaign/DNC without hand clenching, while any criticism of Sanders from Clinton is seen as outside the lines.

 

 

[Reddy]

Why are liberals so obsessed with pointing out that Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat?

 

It's just amazing.

Because he's just the worst. Haha

[Reddy]

It is equally annoying that Sanders can critique Clinton's campaign/DNC without hand clenching, while any criticism of Sanders from Clinton is seen as outside the lines.

this.

[GoSox05]

Because he's just the worst. Haha

 

I'm glad most people don't think this way.

 

 

There is a reason why other Democratic senators are jumping behind Sanders and this bill. They know what the future of the party is and it isn't Clinton and the "centrist wing".

 

 

[Reddy]

I'm glad most people don't think this way.

 

 

There is a reason why other Democratic senators are jumping behind Sanders and this bill. They know what the future of the party is and it isn't Clinton and the "centrist wing".

A large chunk of the Democratic base actually falls into the #NeverSanders camp as well. It would be wise not to discount that growing faction.

[StrangeSox]

Reddy on Medicare for all - Meaningless bill that won't pass

 

Reddy on Better Deal press conference people have already forgotten- This is a game changer!

 

[StrangeSox]

A large chunk of the Democratic base actually falls into the #NeverSanders camp as well. It would be wise not to discount that growing faction.

how many of the "#neversanders" people were also PUMA dopes back in 2008?

[StrangeSox]

Facebook Enabled Advertisers to Reach ‘Jew Haters’

After being contacted by ProPublica, Facebook removed several anti-Semitic ad categories and promised to improve monitoring.

 

Monetizing antisemitism, Zuck 2020!

[Heads22]

It's more that - if Bernie wants to help form the vision and the future of the Democratic party, if these ideals are so important to him - register as a Democrat. For me, it's never been so much #NeverSanders, but if you want to influence the direction of the party, actually join it.

[Reddy]

how many of the "#neversanders" people were also PUMA dopes back in 2008?

Legit don't know what that is.

 

A lot of us are smart, middle of the road "establishment" Democrats who supported Hillary, support Chuck Schumer and Nancy Pelosi, and support keeping the party united when we've got SUCH an opportunity to win and win big.

[Reddy]

It's more that - if Bernie wants to help form the vision and the future of the Democratic party, if these ideals are so important to him - register as a Democrat. For me, it's never been so much #NeverSanders, but if you want to influence the direction of the party, actually join it.

100%

 

I have very little respect for Sanders anymore. He cares more about his ego than he does actually advancing his causes, and what Heads said is a testament to that.

[StrangeSox]

Legit don't know what that is.

 

A lot of us are smart, middle of the road "establishment" Democrats who supported Hillary, support Chuck Schumer and Nancy Pelosi, and support keeping the party united when we've got SUCH an opportunity to win and win big.

 

"Party unity my ass," the contingent of Hillary supporters who said they would refuse to support Obama after he won the nomination.

 

I think pelosi is a great leader even if there are often times I disagree with her politics. I've been surprised by Schumer so far, expecting a much bigger step down from Reid. I voted Clinton last November and would do so again if they were holding another election tomorrow.

 

But the base of the party, or at leasta decent portion of it, is or is moving substantially to the left of centrism. The American people as a whole seem to be fed up with the status quo. People by and large continue to struggle economically even if the stock market is surging and some segments of society are doing very well. Doubling down on the 90's and 00's era politics isn't going to appeal to these people.

 

Sanders "independent" label is a gimmick, but he's always been a reliable vote for Democratic policies. He seems to have single handedly given a voice to the people looking to push the Democratic party as a whole leftward on multiple issues. I don't think he'd be a particularly strong president or leader of the party as a whole, but he does represent an important base and ignoring that is no better than the hardcore Bernie people who insist on their own version of purity politics.