2017 Republican Thread

[Reddy]

^ that goes for everyone jumping on that bandwagon.

[caulfield12]

So much for Greg and Rabbit being "the only ones that get picked on" at Filibuster.

 

Reddy gets credit for not playing the persecution complex card and admitting he needs to frame his arguments in a way that would get through to moderates and even a few alt-righters.

[Reddy]

Reddy cried about personal attacks you must have missed it. But yeah go ahead and praise him for thinking black people are mostly drug dealers who need governmental help to accomplish things and that his whiteness is why he is/was so awesome at everything (his account).

Brother you ran away once others started criticizing your stance and you could no longer defend it. Please.

 

On another note, I just got out of my Political Communications class, and we talked about "if you're explaining, you're losing." I gotta start framing my arguments in a way that I don't need to do damage control after the fact. So thanks y'all!

Edited May 24, 2017 by Reddy

[Chicago White Sox]

Brother you ran away once others started criticizing your stance and you could no longer defend it. Please.

 

On another note, I just got out of my Political Communications class, and we talked about "if you're explaining, you're losing." I gotta start framing my arguments in a way that I don't need to do damage control after the fact. So thanks y'all!

If you don't want to constantly do damage control, stop being a douche and talking down to everyone. We all get you live in big fancy New York City, but that doesn't make you an expert on all political & social issues. Stop making assumptions about the rest us and assuming we know less than you. Maybe you'd actually learn something if you actually listened to raBBit and tried to understand his experiences rather than screaming "white privilege" every time because they're diffent from your own.

[greg775]

I don't like the topic of white privilege because I don't agree with the protests on campuses where unsuspecting students get drawn into it when all they are doing is trying to study in a library and they get accosted by groups of loud people demanding you "admit your privilege."

Very rude. Very bad. Very scary.

 

I'll tell you one thing: This white privilege thing from what I've been reading (not saying it's true) is hurting a great university. I was reading about Missouri's enrollment being way down and dorms closing and businesses closing, etc., cause the protests killed enrollment. If this isn't true, maybe the MU grads on here can fill us in.

 

Laugh at me all you want but the basketball team may be very important in bringing Missouri back. That team figures to be sensational this season and sports can change the feelings on a campus quickly.

 

This white privilege thing is bothersome to me on many levels.

Edited May 24, 2017 by greg775

[Quin]

Basketball will be important in bringing back students. Decline in enrollment isn't entirety due to protests, the whole state has had declining high school graduation and surrounding states have stepped their game up.

[southsider2k5]

You know for an absolute fact that I neither said nor believe that. Way to be intentionally disingenuous.

 

You seem to be the only one who doesn't see it.

[caulfield12]

https://www.yahoo.com/tv/sean-hannity-says-...-023551813.html

 

Hannity agrees to give up on the Seth Rich story for now with Fox News bleeding viewers steadily the past two weeks

Edited May 24, 2017 by caulfield12

[Reddy]

You seem to be the only one who doesn't see it.

People see the thing they want to in order to make it fit their narrative.

[Reddy]

If you want to take the easy way out, sure stay in your bubble. But it would be nice if you actually weren't disenfranchising the people you pretend so hard to care about, but have heard so much about from your other like minded friends.

 

We reward one thing in this country above all else, and it is not race.

 

Stating statistical fact is not disenfranchising anyone. It's raising awareness so maybe people like you can wake up to your ignorance. Are you seriously suggesting I pretend those facts aren't real, because by doing so it'll protect the feelings of our marginalized communities? Isn't THAT showing even less respect for them? You think they can't handle the reality of their situation? You think they don't have the mental fortitude to see that reality and overcome it? You think we should pull the wool over their eyes, and people like me shouldn't talk about the issue, because doing so "disenfranchises" them? Really?

 

The irony.

[Jenksismyhero]

People see the thing they want to in order to make it fit their narrative.

 

Which is exactly what you do. You feel so much white guilt you wrongly assume that ALL minorities are in stereotypical positions of being poor, being in single parent families, having to deal drugs, etc. because of the White Man.

 

Just own up to it. You wrote it. No one is inferring what you meant. We're basing it on the plain meaning of the words you used. It was an ignorant thing to say and it shows that your extreme view here about racism is based on some pretty ignorant assumptions.

Edited May 24, 2017 by JenksIsMyHero

[southsider2k5]

People see the thing they want to in order to make it fit their narrative.

 

That works both ways you know. Especially when you have no practical knowledge of which you speak.

[southsider2k5]

Stating statistical fact is not disenfranchising anyone. It's raising awareness so maybe people like you can wake up to your ignorance. Are you seriously suggesting I pretend those facts aren't real, because by doing so it'll protect the feelings of our marginalized communities? Isn't THAT showing even less respect for them? You think they can't handle the reality of their situation? You think they don't have the mental fortitude to see that reality and overcome it? You think we should pull the wool over their eyes, and people like me shouldn't talk about the issue, because doing so "disenfranchises" them? Really?

 

The irony.

 

You are using simple statistics to try to say something that really isn't true. Misunderstanding a statistic to make a perceived social statement doesn't make it a fact. As I said, if it were a fact, you would be able to prove it by showing that affluent blacks are raising poor children at a higher rate than other races are. If it were truly a racial problem, you should be able to remove things like generational wealth and educational achievement and still see the same issue.

 

Can you prove that? I don't believe you can.

 

And yes, when people like you consistently send the message that you need to deal drugs to make money, it has an effect on young minds. When you constantly send the message that you are black so you won't succeed because you aren't white like me, it has an effect on young minds. When you have parents who were raised to believe the messages that you are preaching here about not succeeding because of race and the like, it has an effect on young minds. The only barrier between people like you and the child's success is an educational system that has to attempt to unbrainwash them into believing that their one true ticket out is education. And really that goes for anyone. Let's not pretend that generationally poor white areas of the country see some huge success rate that generationally poor black families don't.

[illinilaw08]

You are using simple statistics to try to say something that really isn't true. Misunderstanding a statistic to make a perceived social statement doesn't make it a fact. As I said, if it were a fact, you would be able to prove it by showing that affluent blacks are raising poor children at a higher rate than other races are. If it were truly a racial problem, you should be able to remove things like generational wealth and educational achievement and still see the same issue.

 

Can you prove that? I don't believe you can.

 

And yes, when people like you consistently send the message that you need to deal drugs to make money, it has an effect on young minds. When you constantly send the message that you are black so you won't succeed because you aren't white like me, it has an effect on young minds. When you have parents who were raised to believe the messages that you are preaching here about not succeeding because of race and the like, it has an effect on young minds. The only barrier between people like you and the child's success is an educational system that has to attempt to unbrainwash them into believing that their one true ticket out is education. And really that goes for anyone. Let's not pretend that generationally poor white areas of the country see some huge success rate that generationally poor black families don't.

 

Generationally poor white areas are, I think, somewhat different than generationally poor black areas. Most generationally poor white areas are rural areas. People settled there for industry and then industry fled. High relocation costs and increased cost of living in urban areas are among the factors keeping generationally poor white areas poor. Those are certainly problems that need to be addressed, and are not easy problems to answer.

 

That's different than the generationally poor black areas. Discriminatory education and housing policies (among other things) helped create pockets of poor, disproportionately minority areas in big cities. There are jobs and industry in those cities, but generations of minorities lacked the same degree of access to those jobs. The degree of access is better now, but there is still progress to be made.

 

I agree that education starts at home in the vast majority of cases. And that a higher education is the ticket to escape generational poverty. But let's also not pretend that the reasons for generations of poor families in Appalachia are the same as the reasons for generations of poor families in Englewood.

 

[caulfield12]

All you have to do is trace RFK's campaign route in 1968 almost fifty years later.

 

Migrant farm worker communities out West.

Pine Ridge Reservation, Boone County SD, still the poorest in the country

Appalachia

Rural Mississippi

 

Etc.

 

The only area that significantly changed over that time was the Rust Belt, with lost factory jobs hurting Pittsburgh, the northern 2/3rds of Ohio, Cleveland, Detroit/All of Michigan particularly hard.

Edited May 24, 2017 by caulfield12

[Reddy]

Which is exactly what you do. You feel so much white guilt you wrongly assume that ALL minorities are in stereotypical positions of being poor, being in single parent families, having to deal drugs, etc. because of the White Man.

 

Just own up to it. You wrote it. No one is inferring what you meant. We're basing it on the plain meaning of the words you used. It was an ignorant thing to say and it shows that your extreme view here about racism is based on some pretty ignorant assumptions.

 

I've said that exactly zero times, and I've said that I DON'T believe that at least four times by now. You're going full Hannity on this. It's pathetic.

 

[Reddy]

You are using simple statistics to try to say something that really isn't true. Misunderstanding a statistic to make a perceived social statement doesn't make it a fact. As I said, if it were a fact, you would be able to prove it by showing that affluent blacks are raising poor children at a higher rate than other races are. If it were truly a racial problem, you should be able to remove things like generational wealth and educational achievement and still see the same issue.

 

Can you prove that? I don't believe you can.

 

And yes, when people like you consistently send the message that you need to deal drugs to make money, it has an effect on young minds. When you constantly send the message that you are black so you won't succeed because you aren't white like me, it has an effect on young minds. When you have parents who were raised to believe the messages that you are preaching here about not succeeding because of race and the like, it has an effect on young minds. The only barrier between people like you and the child's success is an educational system that has to attempt to unbrainwash them into believing that their one true ticket out is education. And really that goes for anyone. Let's not pretend that generationally poor white areas of the country see some huge success rate that generationally poor black families don't.

 

Again. I can't even engage with you on this because your assumptions and your firmly held beliefs about me, how I fight, where I stand, and my experience with the groups we're talking about is so wildly off base, that nothing I say will change your mind. You feel the way you do about me, and there's absolutely nothing I can do to change that, so I won't waste my time.

 

But you are fundamentally incorrect about every damn thing you think you've gleaned from this discussion.

 

[southsider2k5]

All you have to do is trace RFK's campaign route in 1968 almost fifty years later.

 

Migrant farm worker communities out West.

Pine Ridge Reservation, Boone County SD, still the poorest in the country

Appalachia

Rural Mississippi

 

Etc.

 

The only area that significantly changed over that time was the Rust Belt, with lost factory jobs hurting Pittsburgh, the northern 2/3rds of Ohio, Cleveland, Detroit/All of Michigan particularly hard.

 

And note that despite some of those areas being predominantly white, the generational poverty has not changed. "White Privilege" hasn't made a difference for sure.

[caulfield12]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/24/politics/bla...rich/index.html

 

In other relatively unsurprising news, yet another GOP Congressman tried to keep the Seth Rich story alive...again. Gingrich, Fox News, Hannity, MSM, where does it end?

[southsider2k5]

Again. I can't even engage with you on this because your assumptions and your firmly held beliefs about me, how I fight, where I stand, and my experience with the groups we're talking about is so wildly off base, that nothing I say will change your mind. You feel the way you do about me, and there's absolutely nothing I can do to change that, so I won't waste my time.

 

But you are fundamentally incorrect about every damn thing you think you've gleaned from this discussion.

 

I am not surprised you feel that way at all. I don't think you are at all cognizant of the way you think in terms of what is really happening. Even the completely false ideas as "examples" you used reflect what people who have no real experience with poverty view it from the outside. Of course you feel like you are benevolently crusading for the people you are trying to look out for. The reality is that what you are talking about is so far removed, it isn't helpful at all. It only serves to further the problems and obscure the solutions, ensuring that more people stay a slave to poverty.

[Reddy]

I am not surprised you feel that way at all. I don't think you are at all cognizant of the way you think in terms of what is really happening. Even the completely false ideas as "examples" you used reflect what people who have no real experience with poverty view it from the outside. Of course you feel like you are benevolently crusading for the people you are trying to look out for. The reality is that what you are talking about is so far removed, it isn't helpful at all. It only serves to further the problems and obscure the solutions, ensuring that more people stay a slave to poverty.

 

And I feel exactly the same way about you. Your opinion about the issue is so wrapped up in ignorance and a refusal to recognize that if you take a black person and white person with exactly the same qualifications, or having committed exactly the same crime, the white person will almost always get the job/loan/lesser sentence/etc. The white person will almost always win out over the black/minority person. That is borne out in statistic after statistic, which you can poo poo all you want because of your "personal experience", but personal experience means exactly jack s*** compared to statistical fact. You're succumbing to an N=1 fallacy and yet you cling to it and let it inform your every belief in life. That's what all conservatives do. I guess I can't blame you, but I don't respect your opinion for that reason.

[southsider2k5]

And I feel exactly the same way about you. Your opinion about the issue is so wrapped up in ignorance and a refusal to recognize that if you take a black person and white person with exactly the same qualifications, or having committed exactly the same crime, the white person will almost always get the job/loan/lesser sentence/etc. The white person will almost always win out over the black/minority person. That is borne out in statistic after statistic, which you can poo poo all you want because of your "personal experience", but personal experience means exactly jack s*** compared to statistical fact. You're succumbing to an N=1 fallacy and yet you cling to it and let it inform your every belief in life. That's what all conservatives do. I guess I can't blame you, but I don't respect your opinion for that reason.

 

You aren't relying on fact. You are relying on feeling and emotions and trying to make your stats fit it. This is why the goalposts of what you are talking about keeps changing in your "facts".

[Reddy]

You aren't relying on fact. You are relying on feeling and emotions and trying to make your stats fit it. This is why the goalposts of what you are talking about keeps changing in your "facts".

And you're relying on extremely limited and biased personal experience, regardless of the statistical realities in this country.

 

So there, let's just discount both of our opinions as meaningless, and let others draw the conclusions they wish to draw through their own research, should they feel compelled to do it.

[southsider2k5]

And you're relying on extremely limited and biased personal experience, regardless of the statistical realities in this country.

 

So there, let's just discount both of our opinions as meaningless, and let others draw the conclusions they wish to draw through their own research, should they feel compelled to do it.

 

Except the statistics are just that, statistics. It is what they are being made into that is the problem.

[Reddy]

Except the statistics are just that, statistics. It is what they are being made into that is the problem.

 

statistics... are just.... statistics....

 

conservativism in a nutshell: rely on personal small sample experience and deny the relevance of broad, large sample statistical analysis. unreal.

 

I assume you're not a moneyball guy either, are ya SS? You must be an "eye-test" and "good face" kind of guy.