Teams have upped their offers in Q derby in the last week

[reiks12]

7 days until Soxfest...

[South Side Fireworks Man]

Of all the things in a Quintana deal, the surest thing is Q. If you are worried not trading him will screw everything up, you should be more worried trading him asap and just taking what they can get, will screw everything up.

 

All the guys the Wox received for Sale and Eaton look great on paper, but as of now we really don't know if any of them can really play, let alone as well as Sale or Eaton.

Can you imagine if the Sox traded Quintana for the "prospects" Borchard, Reed, Anderson and Beckham? Most of Soxtalk would be ecstatic about the haul Hahn got for Q. As KW always said, prospects are "suspects" until proven otherwise.

[Chicago White Sox]

Of all the things in a Quintana deal, the surest thing is Q. If you are worried not trading him will screw everything up, you should be more worried trading him asap and just taking what they can get, will screw everything up.

 

All the guys the Wox received for Sale and Eaton look great on paper, but as of now we really don't know if any of them can really play, let alone as well as Sale or Eaton.

I just find it hard to believe that in this market where there are literally no other TOR alternatives that offers wouldn't be strong. We all say we don't want Hahn to accept a crappy offer, but why do we think teams would allow one of their competitors to get Quintana on the cheap? For example, if the Pirates' best offer was Glasnow, Hayes, & Diaz, do you honestly think the Astros & Braves would stand pat and not top that? The only way we're going to get a crappy offer is if the market is significantly constrained from the buyer's side and demand just isn't there. And that's simply not the case based on everything we know about interest in Q. My concern is that Hahn will wait for the perfect offer, which may or not never happen by. Waiting doesn't guarantee s***, but it does put our most important asset at risk of losing signicant value from a combination of factors including injury, underperformance, & less favorable market conditions. It also pushes back this rebuild most likely due delaying the development time for whatever prospects are acquired and could greatly impact our draft position next year that has some elite talents at the top. Long story short, I simply don't see the potential reward from holding Quintana until July (or longer) worth the inherent risk and opportunity costs.

[oldsox]

We've been hearing this same 'ol stuff out of Colorado since Mark Hampton and Darryl Kile.

Those guys were pre-humidor. Q would be great for Rockettes.

[Dick Allen]

I just find it hard to believe that in this market where there are literally no other TOR alternatives that offers wouldn't be strong. We all say we don't want Hahn to accept a crappy offer, but why do we think teams would allow one of their competitors to get Quintana on the cheap? For example, if the Pirates' best offer was Glasnow, Hayes, & Diaz, do you honestly think the Astros & Braves would stand pat and not top that? The only way we're going to get a crappy offer is if the market is significantly constrained from the buyer's side and demand just isn't there. And that's simply not the case based on everything we know about interest in Q. My concern is that Hahn will wait for the perfect offer, which may or not never happen by. Waiting doesn't guarantee s***, but it does put our most important asset at risk of losing signicant value from a combination of factors including injury, underperformance, & less favorable market conditions. It also pushes back this rebuild most likely due delaying the development time for whatever prospects are acquired and could greatly impact our draft position next year that has some elite talents at the top. Long story short, I simply don't see the potential reward from holding Quintana until July (or longer) worth the inherent risk and opportunity costs.

We have no idea what the real offers are. The fact is, if you are scared not trading Quintana this offseason screws everything up, his being just as valuable is probably a better bet than even if they received the exact same package for Sale all working out.

 

I would imagine the Sox have some really nice offers, maybe one or two where they would pull the trigger, but I think they like another team's players even better and may be waiting to see if they will become involved. Ultimately what will matter is how the guys they get actually play, not where BA or Keith Law or BP or MLB.com rank them before they ever play a major league game.

[ptatc]

Of all the things in a Quintana deal, the surest thing is Q. If you are worried not trading him will screw everything up, you should be more worried trading him asap and just taking what they can get, will screw everything up.

 

All the guys the Wox received for Sale and Eaton look great on paper, but as of now we really don't know if any of them can really play, let alone as well as Sale or Eaton.

No doubt. They can't trade him for less than his value. It will hurt the team in the long run.

[ptatc]

I just find it hard to believe that in this market where there are literally no other TOR alternatives that offers wouldn't be strong. We all say we don't want Hahn to accept a crappy offer, but why do we think teams would allow one of their competitors to get Quintana on the cheap? For example, if the Pirates' best offer was Glasnow, Hayes, & Diaz, do you honestly think the Astros & Braves would stand pat and not top that? The only way we're going to get a crappy offer is if the market is significantly constrained from the buyer's side and demand just isn't there. And that's simply not the case based on everything we know about interest in Q. My concern is that Hahn will wait for the perfect offer, which may or not never happen by. Waiting doesn't guarantee s***, but it does put our most important asset at risk of losing signicant value from a combination of factors including injury, underperformance, & less favorable market conditions. It also pushes back this rebuild most likely due delaying the development time for whatever prospects are acquired and could greatly impact our draft position next year that has some elite talents at the top. Long story short, I simply don't see the potential reward from holding Quintana until July (or longer) worth the inherent risk and opportunity costs.

Well the lack of movement of any players right now would make one think there are no good offers.

[steveno89]

We have no idea what the real offers are. The fact is, if you are scared not trading Quintana this offseason screws everything up, his being just as valuable is probably a better bet than even if they received the exact same package for Sale all working out.

 

I would imagine the Sox have some really nice offers, maybe one or two where they would pull the trigger, but I think they like another team's players even better and may be waiting to see if they will become involved. Ultimately what will matter is how the guys they get actually play, not where BA or Keith Law or BP or MLB.com rank them before they ever play a major league game.

 

Well said

 

It's not just about where in the top 100 prospects a player(s) falls, but how the Sox organization sees potential acquisitions as a fit for their future.

 

Clearly the offers have not fit into what the Sox are looking for as of yet. We have to remember the Sox are not under pressure to compete this season, or next for that matter and can take their time during this process.

 

The Astros are certainly in win now mode, and the Pirates are financially strapped and Quintana offers the best chance to bring in a TOR starter they can afford that they do not develop in house.

 

Braves are sitting on the sidelines observing, along with other mystery teams perhaps

 

All it takes is one team to make a serious offer before everyone tips their hand

[NCsoxfan]

We've seen Hahn pull the trigger on two huge trades now (one player better than Q, and one worse). If he gets an offer somewhere in the middle of what he got for Sale and what he got for Eaton, then Q is probably dealt. I don't think this is very complicated at all. Most likely people are offering deals at or below what they got for Eaton which isn't enough for Q.

[Chicago White Sox]

I would imagine the Sox have some really nice offers, maybe one or two where they would pull the trigger, but I think they like another team's players even better and may be waiting to see if they will become involved. Ultimately what will matter is how the guys they get actually play, not where BA or Keith Law or BP or MLB.com rank them before they ever play a major league game.

That is exactly what I'm suggesting. That they likely have some nice offers on the table, but have specific targets (Meadows, Torres, etc) they're waiting to see if ultimately become available. Any by all means wait until spring training and see if one of those untouchables suddenly become touchable. We control THIS market and can take our time for now. But I'll keep repeating this, if one of those targets doesn't become available, don't pass up on good value right now in hopes of a perfect offer later. Nothing is promised tomorrow. If teams aren't willing to pony up in what is considered the worst free agent market for starting pitching in the history of baseball, I find it highly unlikely we'll do better at the deadline or next offseason when market conditions are less favorable.

[FT35]

We have no idea what the real offers are. The fact is, if you are scared not trading Quintana this offseason screws everything up, his being just as valuable is probably a better bet than even if they received the exact same package for Sale all working out.

 

I would imagine the Sox have some really nice offers, maybe one or two where they would pull the trigger, but I think they like another team's players even better and may be waiting to see if they will become involved. Ultimately what will matter is how the guys they get actually play, not where BA or Keith Law or BP or MLB.com rank them before they ever play a major league game.

 

Yep. They are in a position where they can afford to wait. That's why there's no rush--because they know they are in the drivers seat since they HAVE what everyone wants. Being in the drivers seat doesn't mean they are driving all the time...they can also park the car if they choose, but they still remain in the drivers seat at the negotiation table. Them NOT making a trade sends a message that they are not desperate and just itching to let Q go for the best available deal on the table at this moment. Other teams involved know that they need to meet the price or no deal. If they want Meadows over Torres they can wait. If they want Frazier over Rodgers, they can wait. Who knows who they REALLY want...we only know that they can hold out for him. Even if the market were saturated with TOR starters, Q's value would still be high enough for them to get who they wanted.

[Special K]

That is exactly what I'm suggesting. That they likely have some nice offers on the table, but have specific targets (Meadows, Torres, etc) they're waiting to see if ultimately become available. Any by all means wait until spring training and see if one of those untouchables suddenly become touchable. We control THIS market and can take our time for now. But I'll keep repeating this, if one of those targets doesn't become available, don't pass up on good value right now in hopes of a perfect offer later. Nothing is promised tomorrow. If teams aren't willing to pony up in what is considered the worst free agent market for starting pitching in the history of baseball, I find it highly unlikely we'll do better at the deadline or next offseason when market conditions are less favorable.

 

 

Don't be so sure. Some GMs may be in the hot seat and have pressure to make the playoffs. If Pittsburgh is a fringe playoff team and McCutchen is having a bounceback season, Meadows may seem more expendable. Same goes for other teams and perhaps surprise suitors that are fringe playoff teams. Q, in all likelihood will continue to pitch very well. I wouldn't take the "best" offer just to take one. He's our last extremely valuable trade chip. We should get a top-tier position player prospect headliner. Nothing less.

[GreenSox]

Considering that the trades thus far have yielded a bevy of close to the majors guys and the Sox system (at lest per Law) remains weak in younger prospects, and considering contenders appear reluctant to part with close to majors guys, perhaps a trade for one guy close but more top talent further away to make up the value, could be in order.

[spiderman]

Don't be so sure. Some GMs may be in the hot seat and have pressure to make the playoffs. If Pittsburgh is a fringe playoff team and McCutchen is having a bounceback season, Meadows may seem more expendable. Same goes for other teams and perhaps surprise suitors that are fringe playoff teams. Q, in all likelihood will continue to pitch very well. I wouldn't take the "best" offer just to take one. He's our last extremely valuable trade chip. We should get a top-tier position player prospect headliner. Nothing less.

 

Is holding Quintana until the trading deadline (or next off-season) a gamble worth taking if his value is high right now? Any fear that he won't be as good on a team that is expected to bottom out over the next year? I'd hate to see the White Sox hold out for an A+ deal if an A deal could be had right now, only to see his value diminish over the next year (injury, subpar season, etc.).

 

[shipps]

Is holding Quintana until the trading deadline (or next off-season) a gamble worth taking if his value is high right now? Any fear that he won't be as good on a team that is expected to bottom out over the next year? I'd hate to see the White Sox hold out for an A+ deal if an A deal could be had right now, only to see his value diminish over the next year (injury, subpar season, etc.).

 

Every move a GM makes is a gamble. They are used to it so I dont think Hahn would worry about it too much if he had to wait until the right deal came to him. I think he is convinced himself that the market will come to him. He isnt going to be knocking down anyones door to make trades, if you went about it that way you arent going to ever get much in return.

[SCCWS]

 

Usually trades made after February 1st are more for filling a hole than a major trade. But we shall see next week.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/a-brief-his...raining-trades/

[steveno89]

Is holding Quintana until the trading deadline (or next off-season) a gamble worth taking if his value is high right now? Any fear that he won't be as good on a team that is expected to bottom out over the next year? I'd hate to see the White Sox hold out for an A+ deal if an A deal could be had right now, only to see his value diminish over the next year (injury, subpar season, etc.).

 

A gamble? Yes, but Quintana is not just a flash in the pan pitcher coming off one great season. He has been excellent for the past 4 seasons in a row.

 

If you believe him to be as valuable as we say he is, then have the confidence to enter the season with him. I'm not suggesting that is ideal, but Q is not leaving for less than a major return.

 

A's aren't selling low on Gray, Rays are not going to trade Archer. Q is available, but for a big pricetag. I feel they stick firmly to the "three elite prospects" asking price

[Y2Jimmy0]

Keith Law has Arizona as #30. Marlins at 29, Angels at 27.

 

 

I've established this. With that Marlins trade, if he were to redo it, they'd be 30.

[shipps]

I've established this. With that Marlins trade, if he were to redo it, they'd be 30.

 

29 and 30 are interchangeable at any point. The difference means nothing.

[ChiSox59]

That is exactly what I'm suggesting. That they likely have some nice offers on the table, but have specific targets (Meadows, Torres, etc) they're waiting to see if ultimately become available. Any by all means wait until spring training and see if one of those untouchables suddenly become touchable. We control THIS market and can take our time for now. But I'll keep repeating this, if one of those targets doesn't become available, don't pass up on good value right now in hopes of a perfect offer later. Nothing is promised tomorrow. If teams aren't willing to pony up in what is considered the worst free agent market for starting pitching in the history of baseball, I find it highly unlikely we'll do better at the deadline or next offseason when market conditions are less favorable.

 

So f'in sick of this narrative.

[southsider2k5]

That is exactly what I'm suggesting. That they likely have some nice offers on the table, but have specific targets (Meadows, Torres, etc) they're waiting to see if ultimately become available. Any by all means wait until spring training and see if one of those untouchables suddenly become touchable. We control THIS market and can take our time for now. But I'll keep repeating this, if one of those targets doesn't become available, don't pass up on good value right now in hopes of a perfect offer later. Nothing is promised tomorrow. If teams aren't willing to pony up in what is considered the worst free agent market for starting pitching in the history of baseball, I find it highly unlikely we'll do better at the deadline or next offseason when market conditions are less favorable.

 

If top players aren't available, it would take a really deep and quantity based package to still give the White Sox good value.

[steveno89]

So f'in sick of this narrative.

 

I think fans do need mentally prepare for Quintana to be on our roster opening day

 

The stove seems to have considerably cooled as of late, and the likelihood he gets dealt before spring training is getting slimmer and slimmer, which is ok.

[steveno89]

If top players aren't available, it would take a really deep and quantity based package to still give the White Sox good value.

 

I'm all for depth, but the smart move is to acquire several elite prospects who have the potential to be game changers for our franchise

 

Suitors top prospects must be on the table or a deal is not getting done (see Eaton and Sale deals for reference)

 

 

[Dick Allen]

I'm all for depth, but the smart move is to acquire several elite prospects who have the potential to be game changers for our franchise

 

Suitors top prospects must be on the table or a deal is not getting done (see Eaton and Sale deals for reference)

Yes. If you aren't acquiring game changers, what's the purpose of trading him?

[ChiSox59]

Yes. If you aren't acquiring game changers, what's the purpose of trading him?

 

Because Conte de Giolito and Baron want him to, damn it!