President Donald Trump: The Thread

[Jose Abreu]

I know what happened, and I'm not defending it. I'm just saying that calling all the people who voted for Trump "racist" is a terrible thing to do. Why draw conclusions from my comments like that? Ahhh because you wanted to I'm guessing.

 

Not at all what he said.

 

60 million Americans voted for a deeply and openly racist man who never apologized for any of it.

 

 

[bmags]

The "both sides" improvised remark was so, so awful.

 

I don't think it was improvised. I think it came from Miller.

 

 

[caulfield12]

I recommend everyone reading the book "Everybody Lies" ... author interview excerpt follows. In the book, he argues with solid statistical backing that Obama would have won by 6% more in 2008/12 if not for racist elements in the electorate.

 

Not close to fifty million, but a realistic estimate is at least FIVE to SEVEN million.

 

 

 

As a barometer of our national consciousness, Google is as accurate (and predictive) as it gets. In 2016, when the Republican primaries were just beginning, most pundits and pollsters did not believe Trump could win. After all, he had insulted veterans, women, minorities, and countless other constituencies.

 

But Stephens-Davidowitz saw clues in his Google research that suggested Trump was far more serious than many supposed. Searches containing racist epithets and jokes were spiking across the country during Trump’s primary run, and not merely in the South but in upstate New York, Western Pennsylvania, Eastern Ohio, rural Illinois, West Virginia, and industrial Michigan.

 

Stephens-Davidowitz saw in the Google Trends data a racially polarized electorate, and one primed to respond to the ethno-nationalist rhetoric of Trump.

 

There were earlier signs, too. On Obama’s 2008 election night, Stephens-Davidowitz found that “one in every hundred Google searches that included the word ‘Obama’ also included ‘KKK’” or the n-word. Searches for racist websites like Stormfront also spiked.

 

.....

 

 

Seth Stephens-Davidowitz

The first thing was that the level of racism in this country was a lot higher than I had realized. I think a lot of people thought that Trump would be done as soon as he started saying all these racially charged things. I think when you look at this internet data, you see the demand for this type of material.

 

I mean, I had even been studying white nationalist sites like Stormfront for a long time, long before most people knew about it, and still I was shocked by how widespread the appeal of these sites were.

 

Sean Illing

This is what we should’ve been paying attention to, not these outdated polling methods.

 

Seth Stephens-Davidowitz

You can't really predict using surveys who's going to turn out in an election because everybody says they're going to vote, nobody wants to admit that they have no intention of voting. But you can predict who's going to vote based on their Google searches. People search how to vote, or where to vote, or polling places weeks before an election and that predicts that turnout will be high.

 

In this election, you saw very, very clearly in the data that there was a huge decrease in these searches in cities with enormous African-American populations, for example. It was very clear in the Google search data that black turnout was going to be way down in 2016, and that was one of the reasons Clinton did so much worse than the polls predicted.

 

https://www.vox.com/conversations/2017/6/13...-everybody-lies

Edited August 13, 2017 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

I know what happened, and I'm not defending it. I'm just saying that calling all the people who voted for Trump "racist" is a terrible thing to do. Why draw conclusions from my comments like that? Ahhh because you wanted to I'm guessing. But I'm not going to assume like you did. So why don't you tell me why you chose to take my simple defense of 10s of millions of nice people, and come to the conclusion that I support the actions of a domestic, racist terrorist? Please tell me how you arrived there.

 

"Nice people" whose very silence condones the actions of overt racists...with maybe ten notable exceptions in the Republican Party today.

 

We all remember huge arguments back and forth over the Berkeley protests...but this guy actually killed one, four were in critical condition at latest report and a total of NINETEEN injured by his intentional actions. There's no moral equivalency there.

 

If you watch the two or three videos and still aren't repulsed by his actions, I'm not sure what can even be said anymore.

 

 

 

Former KKK leader David Duke strikes out at Trump for condemning a white nationalist rally: 'It was White Americans who put you in the presidency'

 

In a series of tweets Duke questioned why the president, whom he usually supports, is attacking white Americans who put him "in the presidency."

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/former-kkk-l...-200532936.html

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by caulfield12

[pettie4sox]

Jerksticks...

 

The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.

 

There are a s*** ton of racist motherf***ers in this country.

 

Try to live a day in a minority's shoes and then you can talk mate.

 

These people were driven underground and hiding like the cockroaches and then decided crawl out of their holes when this inept reality tv star came on the scene.

[StrangeSox]

Nazi sympathizing President still hasn't condemn white Nazi terrorism because they're his core base.

 

[caulfield12]

"What do you say to people who say the president wasn't specific enough, he wasn’t hard enough?” Pirro asked Huckabee. “Are these Trump haters who just will look for any reason to dump on the president?”

Huckabee responded with a touch of incredulity.

 

“[W]hat is he supposed to say?” he said. “Is he supposed to do what Barack Obama used to do and jump to a conclusion, and make a decision about something, like he did in Ferguson, Missouri, which turned out to be totally untrue? The president has to be careful.”

 

Huckabee said that Trump “condemned” the fact that a “coward” had driven into a crowd of people. “What else is he supposed to do at that point?”

 

Trump has not always been “careful” in jumping to conclusions in the immediate aftermath of apparent terror attacks. He called a violent incident that occurred in the Philippines a “terrorist attack” even though officials there later deemed it a robbery. He similarly rushed to decry terrorism after attacks in London and Paris. If anything, Saturday was an aberration. Rarely, if ever, has Trump been this “careful” after violence occurs that he assumes has been committed by Muslim extremists.

 

And while Huckabee accused President Obama of rushing to judgement after Michael Brown was killed in Ferguson, the former president was actually criticized for waiting too long to address the situation there, something he acknowledged in an interview the following year.

 

“When Ferguson happened, there was a gap between how quickly we could pull together a police task force, recommendations. And so in that lag, it feels as if I haven’t spoken to the moment as effectively,” Obama said. “I suspect that if I were to do it over again, there might be something I could say that would’ve crystallized it more effectively.”

 

http://www.thedailybeast.com/mike-huckabee...hoo&ref=yfp

Edited August 13, 2017 by caulfield12

[StrangeSox]

The United States Dpt of Justice brought a civil rights violation action against Donald Trump personally because he refused to permit black people to rent apartments in his buildings. The Dpt of Justice said all he needed to do was agree to rent to minorities. He refused. Instead he spent a fortune in legal fees fighting to keep minorities out of his buildings. On the eve of trial he caved and signed the Consent Decree. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

In the late 80s, Donald Trump argued that the death penalty should be re-instated for the 'Central Park 5', and when the accused were later found not guilty through DNA evidence, he refused to admit he was wrong and still thought they were guilty. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

When the first African American President was elected, Donald J. Trump attacked the legitimacy of the President's citizenship with full knowledge that his attack was 100% based upon a lie. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

During a television interview during his campaign he was asked about David Duke and the KKK and he outright refused to denounce him or his views (he finally renounced him weeks later after being forced to do so because of the political firestorm). Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

Then he refused to denounce the murder of a Muslim on a train in Seattle. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

Then he refused to denounce the bombing of a mosque last week. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

And this weekend he refused to denounce the views of Nazis. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

But "nice" people voted for him.

[Chicago White Sox]

The United States Dpt of Justice brought a civil rights violation action against Donald Trump personally because he refused to permit black people to rent apartments in his buildings. The Dpt of Justice said all he needed to do was agree to rent to minorities. He refused. Instead he spent a fortune in legal fees fighting to keep minorities out of his buildings. On the eve of trial he caved and signed the Consent Decree. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

In the late 80s, Donald Trump argued that the death penalty should be re-instated for the 'Central Park 5', and when the accused were later found not guilty through DNA evidence, he refused to admit he was wrong and still thought they were guilty. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

When the first African American President was elected, Donald J. Trump attacked the legitimacy of the President's citizenship with full knowledge that his attack was 100% based upon a lie. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

During a television interview during his campaign he was asked about David Duke and the KKK and he outright refused to denounce him or his views (he finally renounced him weeks later after being forced to do so because of the political firestorm). Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

Then he refused to denounce the murder of a Muslim on a train in Seattle. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

Then he refused to denounce the bombing of a mosque last week. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

And this weekend he refused to denounce the views of Nazis. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

But "nice" people voted for him.

I'm not sure what your point is here? I hate Trump as much as anyone, but just because Trump is racist doesn't mean that his entire voter is if that's what you're going after here. Plenty of people voted for him simply because they are fiscally and/or socially conservative or just wanted something different than the Washington norm. There is obviously a subset of his voter base that is dumb, ignorant, & even hateful, but you seem to be suggesting the majority of republicans fall into this bucket, which is completely false.

[StrangeSox]

They are, at best, perfectly okay with voting for an explicitly racist and sexist man and enabling that ideology. They rewarded his disgusting behavior and gross incompetence time and time again.

 

An overwhelming majority of Republicans voted for exactly what we've been getting for six months now. Even if you want to say they somehow didn't realize it, 80%+ still approve of him after everything we've seen. They like this. They want this. They aren't "nice" people.

Edited August 13, 2017 by StrangeSox

[Chicago White Sox]

They are, at best, perfectly okay with voting for an explicitly racist and sexist man and enabling that ideology. They rewarded his disgusting behavior and gross incompetence time and time again.

 

An overwhelming majority of Republicans voted for exactly what we've been getting for six months now.

I'm not going to defend anyone that voted for Trump, but I don't agree it makes them racist or were ok with enabling that type of ideology. I think most hardcore Republicans simply voted party lines and the majority of independents just wanted something different than your typical US politician. I don't excuse them for not thinking about the bigger picture, because quite frankly they are at fault for that, but I doubt very many of them said to themselves "I'm ok with racism" when voting for Trump. These scumbags in Virginia are the loud, vocal minority that have used Trump to come out of their holes and feel comfortable expressing their hatred filled beliefs. They do not reflect the vast majority of the Republican Party base.

[StrangeSox]

Trump's racism was front and center during his whole campaign. Rapists and drug dealers led off his campaign. Judge Curiel. Muslim ban. His history as a land lord. His birtherism.

 

If you voted for Trump, yeah, you were saying you were at least okay with all of that. The Republican base never once made him pay a price for any of it. The Republican base willingly nominated him. The leadership rallied behind him. If none of that was enough to make the voters and leaders say "whoa, I can't support this guy," what the hell is?

Edited August 13, 2017 by StrangeSox

[TaylorStSox]

I'm certainly not conservative, but the rhetoric in this thread over the last few pages is nauseating. Trump is an idiot and bigot, but people vote for idiots all the time because they fall on the side of one of their values. That doesn't mean you completely support all their values. All these false equivalence rants in this thread read like angsty drunken prose.

 

I know both neo nazis and antifas. It kind of happens when you have friends associated with punk and hardcore. They both suck. Both groups are filled with misguided, young, priveldged white males that are disenfranchised for reasons they don't even understand.

[StrangeSox]

It doesn't mean you completely support everything he's done, but it means you're okay with it and he never crossed a personal line that meant he went too far to lose your support.

[StrangeSox]

I guess the tl;dr is that voting for Trump is literally voting to enable his ideology

[TaylorStSox]

It doesn't mean you completely support everything he's done, but it means you're okay with it and he never crossed a personal line that meant he went too far to lose your support.

It means if you live in the Rust Belt, in an area with a crippled economy and no middle class jobs, you're more than likely willing to vote for a bigot if he's promising to bring jobs back. This is the unfortunate reality for some. Those few swayed the election. It doesn't mean those people support racism. It means they valued feeding their family over social issues.

[Middle Buffalo]

The United States Dpt of Justice brought a civil rights violation action against Donald Trump personally because he refused to permit black people to rent apartments in his buildings. The Dpt of Justice said all he needed to do was agree to rent to minorities. He refused. Instead he spent a fortune in legal fees fighting to keep minorities out of his buildings. On the eve of trial he caved and signed the Consent Decree. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

In the late 80s, Donald Trump argued that the death penalty should be re-instated for the 'Central Park 5', and when the accused were later found not guilty through DNA evidence, he refused to admit he was wrong and still thought they were guilty. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

When the first African American President was elected, Donald J. Trump attacked the legitimacy of the President's citizenship with full knowledge that his attack was 100% based upon a lie. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

During a television interview during his campaign he was asked about David Duke and the KKK and he outright refused to denounce him or his views (he finally renounced him weeks later after being forced to do so because of the political firestorm). Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

Then he refused to denounce the murder of a Muslim on a train in Seattle. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

Then he refused to denounce the bombing of a mosque last week. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

And this weekend he refused to denounce the views of Nazis. Donald J. Trump is a racist.

 

But "nice" people voted for him.

None of this means that everyone who voted for Trump is racist, or that everyone who voted for someone other than Trump is not racist.

 

Sadly, many people vote for the R or D and don't give much thought to anything else.

 

Sure, Trump is attractive to the neo-Nazi types, and he has strong support in that group of voters. However, that doesn't mean everyone who voted for Trump is, therefore, a neo-Nazi.

[StrangeSox]

I never said it made them racist. I said it made them okay with voting for a racist who would and has enabled racist policies. That, to me, means they're not actually nice people.

 

Republicans still stand solidly behind Trump despite all of his jobs rhetoric being so obviously empty, but him actually carrying through on the xenophobia and racist policies (mainly via DHS and sessions).

 

When can we actually hold Republican voters responsible for their support and their votes?

[TaylorStSox]

StrangeSox's bs narrative is just as dangerous as the bs spewed by these neo conservative idiots.

[StrangeSox]

Yes, clearly saying people who voted for Trump are okay with Trump's ideology is just as bad as neo Nazis.

 

Weren't you just complaining about ridiculous false equivalencies?

[Middle Buffalo]

It doesn't mean you completely support everything he's done, but it means you're okay with it and he never crossed a personal line that meant he went too far to lose your support.

By this rationale, all of the people who voted for Obama are "okay with" (whatever that means) every decision he made and every stance he took on issues. Good and bad. They are "okay with" 100% of what Obama did/said because Obama did/said it.

 

That's idiotic.

[Chicago White Sox]

It means if you live in the Rust Belt, in an area with a crippled economy and no middle class jobs, you're more than likely willing to vote for a bigot if he's promising to bring jobs back. This is the unfortunate reality for some. Those few swayed the election. It doesn't mean those people support racism. It means they valued feeding their family over social issues.

100% this. They fell for Trump's lies, but they voted for him out of desperation, not because they were ok with racism.

 

The partisanship in this country really sucks. I'm a liberal, but under no circumstance do I think it's ok to come out of yesterday's f***ed up events and try to give themselves a political edge. Both sides of the aisle should be out there ripping these scumbags for what they are and I saw plenty of Republicans do so yesterday on Twitter. Trump's statements were cowardly but those fall on Trump alone and not on the people that voted for him or share his political party.

[TaylorStSox]

Yes, clearly saying people who voted for Trump are okay with Trump's ideology is just as bad as neo Nazis.

 

Weren't you just complaining about ridiculous false equivalencies?

You're bending over backwards to create this narrative that does nothing but continue to disenfranchise people. Why don't you focus on the reasons this idiot was elected instead of trying to label them.

[StrangeSox]

He was nominated by the base in large part thanks to his xenophobia and racism. Plenty of polling on where Trump supporters throughout the primary and the general bear this out. Refusing to hold anyone accountable for supporting, or at least not having that as a bright line, is part of the problem of politics in this country.

 

Misdiagnosing political trends or causes is still not equivalent to neo Nazis, and that sort of both sidesism is also part of the same problem of accountability.

Edited August 13, 2017 by StrangeSox

[TaylorStSox]

He was nominated by the base in large part thanks to his xenophobia and racism. Plenty of polling on where Trump supporters throughout the primary and the general bear this out. Refusing to hold anyone accountable for supporting, or at least not having that as a bright line, is part of the problem of politics in this country.

 

Misdiagnosing political trends or causes is still not equivalent to neo Nazis, and that sort of both sidesism is also part of the same problem of accountability.

Where does this xenophobia come from?