Scoopcity from WSD

[LittleHurt05]

The Kopech / Collins stuff point me on the path that the Sox want to get as many guys as feasibly ready up next year to get some of their "lumps" early so that they can truly be positioned to turn a corner in 2019 (and presumably so the front office has an idea what they have vs. don't have) as part of that process. I presume we'll see Eloy on a similar timetable as put out for Collins (presuming Eloy keeps doing his thing).

 

In terms of Fulmer, no surprise there.

 

Exactly. You can't just hold all these guys in the minors and then call them up at the same time and expect them to all immediately succeed.

[flavum]

I know I've said this before and people can fire away again. If they have an awful season next year with that plan, the rebuild has failed and they will need to start again.

 

If the rotation is Rodon, Lopez, Giolito and Kopech, all players they are counting on for the rebuild, they better not lose 90 games. They will struggle but they can't ALL struggle that badly.

 

You're right, I do disagree. The Sox won't be a .500 team in 2018, but it will be a step forward. 76-86 would be a great season for a young team and mostly young rotation. If they happen to lose 90, it's not that much different. Kinda just depends on health and bullpen variance...and Renteria bunting.

[greg775]

I know I've said this before and people can fire away again. If they have an awful season next year with that plan, the rebuild has failed and they will need to start again.

 

If the rotation is Rodon, Lopez, Giolito and Kopech, all players they are counting on for the rebuild, they better not lose 90 games. They will struggle but they can't ALL struggle that badly.

I agree. But I'm sure if those guys somehow are awful as they adjust to the bigs we'll have tons of excuses for them. We can point to Robin Ventura's horrific start to his career, wasn't he 2 for 50 or something like that; we can point to Avi taking many years. But let's say Lopez Giolito and Kopech are all as bad as Fulmer right now, wouldn't that be alarming? I'm already a believer that Rodon will be excellent next season.

[greg775]

You're right, I do disagree. The Sox won't be a .500 team in 2018, but it will be a step forward. 76-86 would be a great season for a young team and mostly young rotation. If they happen to lose 90, it's not that much different. Kinda just depends on health and bullpen variance...and Renteria bunting.

I don't see how you can avoid a historically bad Sox season if there's no plan to fix the bullpen yet. And I would doubt that's the plan. This team is destined to get two very very high draft picks before the rebuild starts to turn into contention.

[ron883]

I agree. But I'm sure if those guys somehow are awful as they adjust to the bigs we'll have tons of excuses for them. We can point to Robin Ventura's horrific start to his career, wasn't he 2 for 50 or something like that; we can point to Avi taking many years. But let's say Lopez Giolito and Kopech are all as bad as Fulmer right now, wouldn't that be alarming? I'm already a believer that Rodon will be excellent next season.

To be honest, only a dolt who has no knowledge of these prospects would predict these guys to be as bad as Fulmer. The only way I see these guys pitching like Fulmer is if they are pitching while injured. His stuff is nowhere near what those guys have.

 

You are just conjuring up garbage hypothetical situations again, though.

[Bob Sacamano]

I don't see how you can avoid a historically bad Sox season if there's no plan to fix the bullpen yet. And I would doubt that's the plan. This team is destined to get two very very high draft picks before the rebuild starts to turn into contention.

 

Why do you assume there is no plan yet?

[jenksycat]

Why do you assume there is no plan yet?

 

Greg lives on a week by week basis with the team. So right now, a bad bullpen = 100+ losses guaranteed because you see that all the time in the MLB.

 

[Chisoxfn]

I know I've said this before and people can fire away again. If they have an awful season next year with that plan, the rebuild has failed and they will need to start again.

 

If the rotation is Rodon, Lopez, Giolito and Kopech, all players they are counting on for the rebuild, they better not lose 90 games. They will struggle but they can't ALL struggle that badly.

I don't agree, guys usually need to take a bit of lumps. The key to me is how you finish. If we are finishing the season playing really poor baseball, we have a problem. I expect we will be really really bad for the first half of next year.

[southsider2k5]

To be honest, only a dolt who has no knowledge of these prospects would predict these guys to be as bad as Fulmer. The only way I see these guys pitching like Fulmer is if they are pitching while injured. His stuff is nowhere near what those guys have.

 

You are just conjuring up garbage hypothetical situations again, though.

 

With your track record on player prognostication, I would watch who you call names.

[iamshack]

You guys should check out the podcast. Definitely one of the best White Sox (and Chicago sports) podcasts out there.

[Wanne]

Kopech - The guy is a freak. They probably let him settle in at Charlotte and call up once he's settled. He may struggle with walks when he comes up but he's going to compete. I have no problem with having him in the rotation next may. I think Jimenez would probably follow him up after the Super 2 deadline.

 

Adolfo - It really pisses me off the team has policies that revolve around Kopech being forced to cut his hair but then when a guy is an idiot and punches an inanimate object the team covers for him. How about a policy where self inflicted injuries make them lose money and they can wear their hair however they want?

 

Collins - Sox seem like they're way too high on him. I like him don't get me wrong, but I don't see him flying to the majors next year. We'll see, but I think his performance is going to decide how quick he moves.

 

I'll trust the people with they fingers on the pulse...but seems puzzling fast tracking Collins they way they're talking about.

[bighurt574]

I know I've said this before and people can fire away again. If they have an awful season next year with that plan, the rebuild has failed and they will need to start again.

 

If the rotation is Rodon, Lopez, Giolito and Kopech, all players they are counting on for the rebuild, they better not lose 90 games. They will struggle but they can't ALL struggle that badly.

 

They could still easily lose a bunch if some of those guys put up say 4.00 ERA's while taking a few early lumps, and then having a garbage bullpen when they come out after 5-6 innings. Hard to see a guy like Kopech, for example, going deep into games right away, even if he's doing pretty well.

Edited August 31, 2017 by bighurt574

[SonofaRoache]

This makes sense - "hey to be successful in the majors you need to do X, Y and Z. Once we see you make progress/hit these milestones, we'll put you on the fast track because you'll be ready".

 

 

Exactly. This is the point of the Minor Leagues. To work out your deficiencies prior to coming up, not sit there and play 2 or 3 years just to say you aren't being rushed. Collins is who he is and his line will look something like this in his best years.

 

BA- .270

OBP- .360

HR's- 25

[BaconOnAStick]

You're right, I do disagree. The Sox won't be a .500 team in 2018, but it will be a step forward. 76-86 would be a great season for a young team and mostly young rotation. If they happen to lose 90, it's not that much different. Kinda just depends on health and bullpen variance...and Renteria bunting.

Unmitigated disaster. It would mean Moncada, Jimenez, Kopech, Giolito, Lopez, Anderson and Rodon mostly failed while "surprise" guys like Leury, Delmonico and Davidson regressed badly.

 

You don't get to watch a bunch of players play well but the team still loses. That's not how baseball works, if the young players play well the team will win games. If the young players are trash they will go as far as Abreu/Avi and whatever pitching reclamation projects can take them, which as we're learning now is only the 3rd or 4th worst team in baseball.

[jenksycat]

For Collins, maybe they want to see if he can stick at catcher with the actual future rotation since by the time he comes up it would be Rodon/Kopech/Lopez/Gio? If he flops then back to AAA to solidify the bat & a future at 1b?

Edited August 31, 2017 by Jenksy Cat

[Dam8610]

Exactly. This is the point of the Minor Leagues. To work out your deficiencies prior to coming up, not sit there and play 2 or 3 years just to say you aren't being rushed. Collins is who he is and his line will look something like this in his best years.

 

BA- .270

OBP- .360

HR's- 25

 

Tack a .200 ISO on to that and you take that from the C position 25 times out of 10.

[bmags]

I could see a year next year with positive performances by our young players but a bullpen/5th/6th starter being so bad that it caps our record at 78 wins.

[Dunt]

Kopech - The guy is a freak. They probably let him settle in at Charlotte and call up once he's settled. He may struggle with walks when he comes up but he's going to compete. I have no problem with having him in the rotation next may. I think Jimenez would probably follow him up after the Super 2 deadline.

 

Adolfo - It really pisses me off the team has policies that revolve around Kopech being forced to cut his hair but then when a guy is an idiot and punches an inanimate object the team covers for him. How about a policy where self inflicted injuries make them lose money and they can wear their hair however they want?

 

Collins - Sox seem like they're way too high on him. I like him don't get me wrong, but I don't see him flying to the majors next year. We'll see, but I think his performance is going to decide how quick he moves.

 

Why do you feel Jimenez won't follow until after Super 2? Just a lower level than Kopech right now thus a little longer arrival time? I know you've seen me say it elsewhere, but I really don't think he has a lot left to prove in the minors.

[BlackSox13]

From today's red line radio podcast, white sox dave dropped some bombs:

- Sox have given up on Fulmer as a starter

- Kopech on the Kris Bryant plan next year

- Collins up to majors by ASB next year

- Adolfo injured his hand punching wall after 3 strikeout game

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/barstoolWSD/stat...258872709828609

Thanks for posting this.

 

Collins by the ASB is surprising to hear but not impossible. Good stuff from WSD.

[Bob Sacamano]

Thanks for posting this.

 

Collins by the ASB is surprising to hear but not impossible. Good stuff from WSD.

 

For sure. Dude can hit and draw walks and ben .800+ ops catcher.

Edited August 31, 2017 by soxfan2014

[BlackSox13]

For sure. Dude can hit and draw walks and ben .800+ ops catcher.

The Sox appear to have plans for certain players to get some experience next year to help make a legit push in '19. We know Giolito and Lopez will be in the rotation and now looks like Kopech joins them after they snag the extra year of control. Collins by the ASB gives the Sox the entire second half of the season for Collins to begin developing working relationships with the pitching staff as well as Narvaez. It's all about getting everything lined up for the first push in '19.

 

May as well add the possibility of Eloy coming up p by the ASB with Collins. As a whole, Jimenez is more advanced than Collins so why not Eloy by the ASB?

[Superstar Lamar]

Hopefully Smith and Narvaez develop well enough in year 2 that they feel they can wait and let Collins perfect his skills.

[Dunt]

The Sox appear to have plans for certain players to get some experience next year to help make a legit push in '19. We know Giolito and Lopez will be in the rotation and now looks like Kopech joins them after they snag the extra year of control. Collins by the ASB gives the Sox the entire second half of the season for Collins to begin developing working relationships with the pitching staff as well as Narvaez. It's all about getting everything lined up for the first push in '19.

 

May as well add the possibility of Eloy coming up p by the ASB with Collins. As a whole, Jimenez is more advanced than Collins so why not Eloy by the ASB?

 

I will put straight cash on him being up before

[BlackSox13]

I will put straight cash on him being up before

With the way Eloy is destroying the baseball, only a fool would bet against you.

[SoxAce]

Great stuff fathom. Thanks.