Trade avi in the offseason?

[Balta1701]

First and foremost, I don't think Rick would be publicly speculating on moving him if he didn't think the offers were close to his asking price for that player, so I think Avi probably is movable for a fair return.

 

With that in mind, I would say move him. We have the nightmare of all pitchers coming up next year to take over RF. With that and all the other corner OF types in our organization who could be decent, move him, take the return, add a tiny bit more to a loaded system, and play guys like Cordell and Delmonico in the first half of the season until that thing, whatever it is, takes over RF around mid season.

 

If all our other OF types bust...it isn't that expensive to pick up corner OFs who can play defense and hit 7th or 8th. Look how little teams had to pay this year for Martinez and Cabreroid.

[Balta1701]

Again, for the 100th time....these two ideas totally contradict themselves. People only want to move Avi for value, but in most cases, they freely admit the cost for corner OF's seem to be at an all-time low. You can't have it both ways. If you want to move Avi for WHATEVER you can get because of reason XYZ, I may be able to get behind that.

 

What I can't get behind is when I see "Move him if you can really get someone to blow you away, it's not like it will be tough to replace him, OF's on the open market are so cheap to acquire.."

I don't think I ever said that you need to get someone to blow you away, I said something about "Fair value" for him. I'm not expecting to get blown away by the return for him. I'm hoping we can get someone with a decent chance of being useful in a few years. I'd take that for Garcia. If we wanted to keep him while competitive it will cost us a ton of money, and if we're going to spend that money there will be plenty of options to take it. We don't need whatever Garcia is going to produce next year or likely in 2019, and another team could use that.

[bmags]

I don't think I ever said that you need to get someone to blow you away, I said something about "Fair value" for him. I'm not expecting to get blown away by the return for him. I'm hoping we can get someone with a decent chance of being useful in a few years. I'd take that for Garcia. If we wanted to keep him while competitive it will cost us a ton of money, and if we're going to spend that money there will be plenty of options to take it. We don't need whatever Garcia is going to produce next year or likely in 2019, and another team could use that.

 

Avi will cost us a ton of money but also corner outfielders are cheap

[Balta1701]

Avi will cost us a ton of money but also corner outfielders are cheap

If we're going to spend that money and it winds up being on a corner OF there will be equal or comparable options at the appropriate time.

 

I'll stand by that one.

[jenksycat]

If we're going to spend that money and it winds up being on a corner OF there will be equal or comparable options at the appropriate time.

 

I'll stand by that one.

 

If we have to spend money on a corner OF in a couple years then the rebuild was a complete failure as it means 2 of Eloy/Roberts/Rutherford failed.

 

Avi has 2 arb years left for relatively cheap. You have to keep him till the deadline next year, if he maintains this you might get a real return vs. what you would get his off season when it's still risking that this wasn't just a random good year in a sea of s***ty ones.

[hi8is]

If we have to spend money on a corner OF in a couple years then the rebuild was a complete failure as it means 2 of Eloy/Roberts/Rutherford failed.

 

Avi has 2 arb years left for relatively cheap. You have to keep him till the deadline next year, if he maintains this you might get a real return vs. what you would get his off season when it's still risking that this wasn't just a random good year in a sea of s***ty ones.

I wouldn't say "complete" so fast there and it would mean that only 1 of the 3 didn't pan out... unless I'm misunderstanding you. ( I never misunderstand anyone )

 

[Soha]

I wouldn't say "complete" so fast there and it would mean that only 1 of the 3 didn't pan out... unless I'm misunderstanding you. ( I never misunderstand anyone )

 

 

I was thinking the same thing. Rutherford or Robert could stick at CF.

 

Also we should be careful penciling in Rutherford at the MLB level. To me he's more in the range of an Adolfo prospect, where you shouldn't expect anything and hope you are pleasantly surprised.

[Leonard Zelig]

First and foremost, I don't think Rick would be publicly speculating on moving him if he didn't think the offers were close to his asking price for that player, so I think Avi probably is movable for a fair return.

 

With that in mind, I would say move him. We have the nightmare of all pitchers coming up next year to take over RF. With that and all the other corner OF types in our organization who could be decent, move him, take the return, add a tiny bit more to a loaded system, and play guys like Cordell and Delmonico in the first half of the season until that thing, whatever it is, takes over RF around mid season.

 

If all our other OF types bust...it isn't that expensive to pick up corner OFs who can play defense and hit 7th or 8th. Look how little teams had to pay this year for Martinez and Cabreroid.

 

What did Hahn say?

[BlackSox13]

What did Hahn say?

Basically said he's not sure Avi's timeline matches up with the next Sox contender. Also wasn't sure about keeping Abreu for the long term due to age and expected cost in extending him.

 

A nice way of saying those players might not be very sound investments.

[Soha]

Basically said he's not sure Avi's timeline matches up with the next Sox contender. Also wasn't sure about keeping Abreu for the long term due to age and expected cost in extending him.

 

A nice way of saying those players might not be very sound investments.

 

Ooooh, was this said recently? I didn't think Abreu would be shopped this winter, but that might indicate otherwise.

[jenksycat]

I wouldn't say "complete" so fast there and it would mean that only 1 of the 3 didn't pan out... unless I'm misunderstanding you. ( I never misunderstand anyone )

 

 

To clarify - I'm hopeful that those 3 are the outfield, but realistic me is saying none of stick in CF and we get 2 legit corners out of them. Needing to pay big bucks for a corner OF means only 1 of them panned out

[hi8is]

To clarify - I'm hopeful that those 3 are the outfield, but realistic me is saying none of stick in CF and we get 2 legit corners out of them. Needing to pay big bucks for a corner OF means only 1 of them panned out

Ah - got ya.

 

Edit: It's unanimously thought by pundits and us board lurkers that Eloy will be confined to corner duty... but the jury is still out on Robert. We don't know enough about him yet and have no clue what will actually transpire as his body develops. We also don't know enough about Rutherford to write him off from being up the middle.

 

His old A ball coach in the Yankee org was glowing about him. Read this review from mid year after he made a spectacular play:

 

"I've seen enough," he said. "Just watching him for a few games last year, you could see he had some bat speed. He can run. His arm's all right. He certainly looks like he can play center field.I like his makeup. He's a young kid, but he certainly has the tools."

 

http://www.nj.com/yankees/index.ssf/2017/0...est_ever_o.html

Edited September 24, 2017 by hi8is

[Balta1701]

To clarify - I'm hopeful that those 3 are the outfield, but realistic me is saying none of stick in CF and we get 2 legit corners out of them. Needing to pay big bucks for a corner OF means only 1 of them panned out

Honestly, if Rick Hahn thinks our window to compete starts in 2019, it might darn well make sense to move one of those guys for a Michael Conforto type, and that would be a better move long-term than signing Avi for comparable money.

[credezcrew24]

Honestly, if Rick Hahn thinks our window to compete starts in 2019, it might darn well make sense to move one of those guys for a Michael Conforto type, and that would be a better move long-term than signing Avi for comparable money.

 

It would take quite a bit more than one of those guys to get Conforto

[Balta1701]

It would take quite a bit more than one of those guys to get Conforto

Right now yes. If one of them turns into a top 20 guy next year, which both have the talent to do? And then we throw in a top 50 pitcher because we have several more of those from the load of talent we've piled up?

 

That's the kind of move we can legitimately be thinking about next offseason if we get a couple successful pieces

[greg775]

So much can change, but I'd rather the Sox not use assets to get a guy they may already have in Avi Garcia.

 

At 26, I just don't agree that Avi can't help this team win the future. I also don't think an extension would be an insanely high price.

I mean you said it all. The guy is only 26. Tim Anderson turns 25 next June 23; his age 25 season. Avi turns 27 next June 12, his age 27 season. Anderson is considered young and everybody's all pumped up bout him; Avi considered an aging non prospect. Kill the cliches and get real, people. Avi is just as good a prospect, maybe even better prospect than TA. How's that for a bold, true statement?

That said, the Sox are in a good position to not do anything cept let him play next season. No need to do anything with his contract but trading him would be stupid. You think we aren't going to need Avi and Jose for our WS team?? All prospects isn't gonna cut it.

Edited September 24, 2017 by greg775

[hi8is]

I mean you said it all. The guy is only 26. Tim Anderson turns 25 next June 23; his age 25 season. Avi turns 27 next June 12, his age 27 season. Anderson is considered young and everybody's all pumped up bout him; Avi considered an aging non prospect. Kill the cliches and get real, people. Avi is just as good a prospect, maybe even better prospect than TA. How's that for a bold, true statement?

That said, the Sox are in a good position to not do anything cept let him play next season. No need to do anything with his contract but trading him would be stupid. You think we aren't going to need Avi and Jose for our WS team?? All prospects isn't gonna cut it.

 

( aside from the sour grapes attitude... buddy )

 

[BlackSox13]

Well, TA plays a premium position that isn't flowing with an abundance talent available. Meanwhile Avi is a corner outfielder that does not draw enough walks, hit for enough power and plays a position overflowing with talent. There's no comparison to be made between TA and Avi.

 

Edit to add: TA also has five years of control left, Avi has two. Very different situations when looking a few years down the road.

Edited September 24, 2017 by BlackSox13

[hi8is]

... Meanwhile Avi ... does not draw enough walks, hit for enough power...

I think you're being a bit hard on him and discounting the next stage of his evolution as a hitter... he really is primed to start stepping into his power next year.

 

Get what you're sayin and all, thou.

[BlackSox13]

I think you're being a bit hard on him and discounting the next stage of his evolution as a hitter... he really is primed to start stepping into his power next year.

 

Get what you're sayin and all, thou.

I'm not sold that Avi will generate enough lift to truly tap into his power potential. I hope I'm wrong but 30+ walks per year and less than 20HR's is just not impressive from the RF position.

 

It's kinda moot anyway because even if Avi is on the Sox next year he will be moved from RF when Eloy is ready. Avi can't stop that runaway freight train.

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

I think you're being a bit hard on him and discounting the next stage of his evolution as a hitter... he really is primed to start stepping into his power next year.

 

Get what you're sayin and all, thou.

 

I laugh to myself when I see people still thinking Avi has power lol

[Jake]

Avi clearly has a ton of power. You can measure that, you know, and he hits the ball as hard as anyone on this team. Whether he will hit a bunch of home runs is another question.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Avi clearly has a ton of power. You can measure that, you know, and he hits the ball as hard as anyone on this team. Whether he will hit a bunch of home runs is another question.

Yep huge power . I mean he is a huge guy, strong as an ox and his HR's when hit to left center have traveled 440- 460 feet enough to know you don't hit them that far without having power. Power and the ability to translate the power into HR's are 2 different things.

[greg775]

.331 now, 18 homers, 80 RBI.

Nice job, Avi. Nobody can ever take the 2017 season away from you. It was a very good one. I can't believe how much it takes to impress some posters, but color me impressed. If there is ever a time I can't appreciate a young player's obvious improvement, I don't want to be a sports fan any more. Even defensively he had some big time highlights this season. AVI BABY.

Edited September 25, 2017 by greg775

[hi8is]

I'm not sold that Avi will generate enough lift to truly tap into his power potential. I hope I'm wrong but 30+ walks per year and less than 20HR's is just not impressive from the RF position.

 

It's kinda moot anyway because even if Avi is on the Sox next year he will be moved from RF when Eloy is ready. Avi can't stop that runaway freight train.

Can't believe I didn't notice his low walk totals. He's gonna be a VERY interesting guy to watch next year and with regard to his development of power - we'll see. This time last year everyone was clamoring to offload the dude. Now the big question is can he take the next step on his power tool?

 

I'll take that to the bank and be stoked.

 

The beauty really is it being moot.

 

If he takes the next step, awesome. Sign him to an extension at that point and pencil him in as an all-star corner and put him as a fixture in the middle of your lineup for a few years with other upcoming bats flanking him. If not, oh well - we've got options and money to spend.

 

Where the White Sox sit - it's a thing of beauty.