The Sexual Assault problem

[Brian]

Bret Ratner the next scumbag to be called out

 

https://www.avclub.com/six-actresses-accuse...SocialMarketing

 

The least surprising one to be revealed IMO.

[bmags]

I dunno, I guess I've always assumed that this sort of thing happens in circles where the powerful, wealthy, famous, etc run. Obviously it happens outside of those circles as well, but when you have people with power, influence and money, people will look the other way a lot of times in order to share in those things.

 

I by no means want to get into a big debate about human sexuality, but humans will be humans, and drunken humans will be even worse. Luckily, most of us tend to obey some of these arbitrary laws meant to protect certain members of society, but not everyone will. And if you are someone that has something to offer those around you, a lot of secrets are kept.

 

I know it isn't a hot take by any means, but it doesn't shock me at all that some of the worst in humans tends to come out in excess when you allow people to feast on power, wealth and influence.

 

I'm not shocked when I hear the ability of weinstein to bully silence, or radner, or halperin. Shocked by the numbers and sad about it. And I think the sad and unfair thing is in their mind they are somewhat playing a game of hollywood and the lack of distance to reality emboldens them.

 

But I did not believe child actors or children in general would be part of that. There are a lot of touchpoints with hollywood actors and films moreso than the power meetings with director and casting. If low-level tech people knew an actor was innappropriate with children, yeah I'm just shocked that doesn't go through to at least journalists prior.

[iamshack]

I'm not shocked when I hear the ability of weinstein to bully silence, or radner, or halperin. Shocked by the numbers and sad about it. And I think the sad and unfair thing is in their mind they are somewhat playing a game of hollywood and the lack of distance to reality emboldens them.

 

But I did not believe child actors or children in general would be part of that. There are a lot of touchpoints with hollywood actors and films moreso than the power meetings with director and casting. If low-level tech people knew an actor was innappropriate with children, yeah I'm just shocked that doesn't go through to at least journalists prior.

Well, think about the courage that would require. And these are people who are trying to break into an industry and realize their dreams. Takes a lot to risk that. I assume some of these stories have been shared with journalists before and weren't published, for a variety of reasons.

[Kyyle23]

Well, think about the courage that would require. And these are people who are trying to break into an industry and realize their dreams. Takes a lot to risk that. I assume some of these stories have been shared with journalists before and weren't published, for a variety of reasons.

 

Hell, Olivia Munns lawyer told her not to do anything because of Ratners power in the industry. You need both courage and a lawyer to be brave as well

 

[bmags]

Hell, Olivia Munns lawyer told her not to do anything because of Ratners power in the industry. You need both courage and a lawyer to be brave as well

 

We are talking about victims coming out, and I am talking about ancillary characters participating in cover up. THe courage of victims to come forward and the rest of their lives have people associating them to the worst part of their lives is incredible. The lack of courage of people who just want to keep an associate producer job so would put up, with this case, with a possible serial child molester is scary to me.

[southsider2k5]

Just like we see in politics, people will do anything for their shot at glory. They will say and do just about anything, including ignoring horrible crimes to climb the ladder.

[iamshack]

We are talking about victims coming out, and I am talking about ancillary characters participating in cover up. THe courage of victims to come forward and the rest of their lives have people associating them to the worst part of their lives is incredible. The lack of courage of people who just want to keep an associate producer job so would put up, with this case, with a possible serial child molester is scary to me.

I admittedly haven't read these other accounts, but I suspect Spacey was considered more of a drunken pervert than a "molester."

 

I get that sexual interaction with minors is considered rape/assault regardless of consent, but I suspect most that are around the industry assume a fair share of these minors are just as interested as these acts as the offenders, and thus justify their looking the other way in that regard.

[StrangeSox]

NPR’s top editor accused of sexual harassment by two women

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/st...m=.d025bfc89588

He's resigned

[bmags]

I admittedly haven't read these other accounts, but I suspect Spacey was considered more of a drunken pervert than a "molester."

 

I get that sexual interaction with minors is considered rape/assault regardless of consent, but I suspect most that are around the industry assume a fair share of these minors are just as interested as these acts as the offenders, and thus justify their looking the other way in that regard.

 

For your first paragraph I agree with this, I would be surprised if that was true that's why I was asking for clarification.

 

Second paragraph makes me ill just to read. I truly hope there were no more victims.

[iamshack]

ss2k is right...it goes on in politics, the music industry, the film industry, sports...anything where those that have made it have large quantities of wealth, power, influence.

 

This is the dirty side of those industries that most people assume "comes with the territory," and choose not to discuss because most of the time, it is very inconvenient/damaging to do so.

[Balta1701]

ss2k is right...it goes on in politics, the music industry, the film industry, sports...anything where those that have made it have large quantities of wealth, power, influence.

 

This is the dirty side of those industries that most people assume "comes with the territory," and choose not to discuss because most of the time, it is very inconvenient/damaging to do so.

Academia has just been starting to confront its version of this in the past few years, but then Betsy Devos happened.

[Steve9347]

Thank God I never decided to be a scumbag.

[Reddy]

Well, think about the courage that would require. And these are people who are trying to break into an industry and realize their dreams. Takes a lot to risk that. I assume some of these stories have been shared with journalists before and weren't published, for a variety of reasons.

THIS.

[Reddy]

I admittedly haven't read these other accounts, but I suspect Spacey was considered more of a drunken pervert than a "molester."

 

I get that sexual interaction with minors is considered rape/assault regardless of consent, but I suspect most that are around the industry assume a fair share of these minors are just as interested as these acts as the offenders, and thus justify their looking the other way in that regard.

This as well. The reality in this business is that people will also do whatever it takes to get ahead. If that means put a famous person in a questionable situation for blackmail purposes, there ARE people in this business that would do it. Humans suck, all around.

 

NOT saying that's what Rapp did. He's a pretty good guy from all I know. I haven't met him personally, but many friends have, and I've met close friends of his as well. But there are people who are ruthless on BOTH sides of this coin.

[Chicago White Sox]

I’m sorry, but what business are you in Reddy? I guess I’m missing your connection to Kevin Spacey here.

[Chicago White Sox]

This as well. The reality in this business is that people will also do whatever it takes to get ahead. If that means put a famous person in a questionable situation for blackmail purposes, there ARE people in this business that would do it. Humans suck, all around.

 

NOT saying that's what Rapp did. He's a pretty good guy from all I know. I haven't met him personally, but many friends have, and I've met close friends of his as well. But there are people who are ruthless on BOTH sides of this coin.

This is just a bizarre post. What does Rapp being a “pretty good guy” have to do with anything? He was a successful child actor that was sexually assaulted by a grown-ass man. There’s no alterior motive here or with any other child stars (like the Corey’s for example) that are victims of predatory actions by powerful adults. This s*** is disgusting & simply unacceptable, so whether Rapp is a “good guy” or not is simply irrelevant and quite frankly takes away from the issue at hand.

[iamshack]

This is just a bizarre post. What does Rapp being a “pretty good guy” have to do with anything? He was a successful child actor that was sexually assaulted by a grown-ass man. There’s no alterior motive here or with any other child stars (like the Corey’s for example) that are victims of predatory actions by powerful adults. This s*** is disgusting & simply unacceptable, so whether Rapp is a “good guy” or not is simply irrelevant and quite frankly takes away from the issue at hand.

Not trying to speak for Reddy, but he has been an actor for many years, I believe.

 

While he took it a bit further than I was intending, I have no doubt that he knows better than I do the types of things that go on in the film/television industry.

 

I was speaking more from an adoration standpoint, I guess. Meaning I have no doubt that many minors have sex with "grown-ass" men and women in the film, music, sports and political worlds by design. That certainly doesn't excuse adults from taking advantage of a minor's inability to legally consent, but I think it is important to recognize there are degrees of fault in these situations. I also want to add it does not make it appropriate for adults to engage in that type of activity, but to pretend it doesn't happen is to keep your head in the sand.

 

I'm not sure what Rapp describes rises to the degree of sexual assault, although I must admit I am not up to speed on what New York courts are currently considering the elements of sexual assault of a minor to be. Throwing around terms like "sexual assault" or "rape" or "molested" may be unfair, even as inappropriate as the behavior may have been.

[Reddy]

This is just a bizarre post. What does Rapp being a “pretty good guy” have to do with anything? He was a successful child actor that was sexually assaulted by a grown-ass man. There’s no alterior motive here or with any other child stars (like the Corey’s for example) that are victims of predatory actions by powerful adults. This s*** is disgusting & simply unacceptable, so whether Rapp is a “good guy” or not is simply irrelevant and quite frankly takes away from the issue at hand.

 

FAUX OUTRAGE BECAUSE YOU DON'T LIKE MY POLITICS SO YOU'RE TAKING PARTS OF MY POST OUT OF CONTEXT YAAAARRR

[Reddy]

I'm not sure what Rapp describes rises to the degree of sexual assault, although I must admit I am not up to speed on what New York courts are currently considering the elements of sexual assault of a minor to be. Throwing around terms like "sexual assault" or "rape" or "molested" may be unfair, even as inappropriate as the behavior may have been.

 

Agree with this.

[Chicago White Sox]

Not trying to speak for Reddy, but he has been an actor for many years, I believe.

 

While he took it a bit further than I was intending, I have no doubt that he knows better than I do the types of things that go on in the film/television industry.

 

I was speaking more from an adoration standpoint, I guess. Meaning I have no doubt that many minors have sex with "grown-ass" men and women in the film, music, sports and political worlds by design. That certainly doesn't excuse adults from taking advantage of a minor's inability to legally consent, but I think it is important to recognize there are degrees of fault in these situations. I also want to add it does not make it appropriate for adults to engage in that type of activity, but to pretend it doesn't happen is to keep your head in the sand.

 

I'm not sure what Rapp describes rises to the degree of sexual assault, although I must admit I am not up to speed on what New York courts are currently considering the elements of sexual assault of a minor to be. Throwing around terms like "sexual assault" or "rape" or "molested" may be unfair, even as inappropriate as the behavior may have been.

I don’t get where you’re going with this “inability to legally consent” in relation to Rapp though. Whether Rapp was 14 or 40 he didn’t express any desire to engage in sexual activities with Spacey. There was clearly no consent, legal or not. This story is simply about an adult who tried to sexually assault a 14 year old boy. There isn’t any gray area here which is why I find Reddy bringing up Rapp’s character to be bizarre and counter-productive to the discussion at hand.

[Reddy]

I’m sorry, but what business are you in Reddy? I guess I’m missing your connection to Kevin Spacey here.

I spent over a decade in the acting business in NYC (I just quit to go back to grad school this past summer, though I still do gigs on occasion). I have many connections to a lot of big players in the business and am personal friends with many broadway stars, friends of Anthony Rapp, etc. Anthony is a far more famous stage actor than anything else, and my degrees of separation from most people in the entertainment industry is one or two at the very most.

[Reddy]

I don’t get where you’re going with this “inability to legally consent” in relation to Rapp though. Whether Rapp was 14 or 40 he didn’t express any desire to engage in sexual activities with Spacey. There was clearly no consent, legal or not. This story is simply about an adult who tried to sexually assault a 14 year old boy. There isn’t any gray area here which is why I find Reddy bringing up Rapp’s character to be bizarre and counter-productive to the discussion at hand.

 

1) you don't actually know that. None of us do.

 

2) there was no consent, but also, nothing happened. What in the description Rapp gives constitutes sexual assault or rape? Spacey made a move, Rapp rebuffed it and left, and nothing further happened.

 

OBVIOUSLY I condemn Spacey for even MAKING the move in the first place, and he's a really skeezy dude and deserves this backlash, but I guess my question is what crime did he actually commit? Like... endangerment of a minor or something? Honestly asking. Don't know much about the laws here.

 

3) In the context of the point I was making, I brought up his character to strengthen the argument that he wasn't trying to use Spacey to get a leg up in the business. Read the whole damn post and stop extrapolating they way you want to.

 

[iamshack]

I don’t get where you’re going with this “inability to legally consent” in relation to Rapp though. Whether Rapp was 14 or 40 he didn’t express any desire to engage in sexual activities with Spacey. There was clearly no consent, legal or not. This story is simply about an adult who tried to sexually assault a 14 year old boy. There isn’t any gray area here which is why I find Reddy bringing up Rapp’s character to be bizarre and counter-productive to the discussion at hand.

Oh, I'm not meaning to introduce that into Rapp's situation; I was trying to comment on other situations that likely occur wherein a minor has sex with an adult, which results in statutory rape regardless of the minor's willingness.

 

As for Rapp, you are correct. According to him, he was not interested in Spacey's advances. However, while Spacey apparently would have liked to engage in some sort of sexual acts with Rapp, Rapp was able to escape prior to any of that occurring (at least from the details he was willing to divulge).

 

While I understand your point in characterizing Spacey as a dirtbag, I don't believe he sexually assaulted Rapp. He did not molest him. He did not rape him.

 

 

[Chicago White Sox]

FAUX OUTRAGE BECAUSE YOU DON'T LIKE MY POLITICS SO YOU'RE TAKING PARTS OF MY POST OUT OF CONTEXT YAAAARRR

I actually agree with the majority of your “politics”, I just don’t like when self-absorbed, arrogant people make important issues about themselves. There was zero reason to bring up Rapp’s character in this discussion, none whatsoever. He was clearly the victim of disgusting actions by a grown man. Hell, even Spacey doesn’t deny it. I still have no idea why you felt the need to bring his character into this discussion other than to use it as outlet to brag about your cool “Hollywood” inner circle.

[Chicago White Sox]

Oh, I'm not meaning to introduce that into Rapp's situation; I was trying to comment on other situations that likely occur wherein a minor has sex with an adult, which results in statutory rape regardless of the minor's willingness.

 

As for Rapp, you are correct. According to him, he was not interested in Spacey's advances. However, while Spacey apparently would have liked to engage in some sort of sexual acts with Rapp, Rapp was able to escape prior to any of that occurring (at least from the details he was willing to divulge).

 

While I understand your point in characterizing Spacey as a dirtbag, I don't believe he sexually assaulted Rapp. He did not molest him. He did not rape him.

Ok I gotcha. I can agree with this for the most part. But I still consider what Spacey did was sexual assault. He tried to force his way onto Rapp, just because Rapp was able to escape doesn’t change his motivation and his initial actions. But honestly, we’re just arguing terminology at this point.

Edited November 2, 2017 by Chicago White Sox