southsider2k5 Posted November 7, 2017 Author Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 04:22 PM) Because it is very easy to keep track of how many games a bullpen blew the game. Whether you want to use conventional means like blown saves, or (preferably) you lean more towards analytics and look at WPA+ and WPA-, shutdowns and meltdowns, WAR, FIP, etc, you can tell how good or bad your bullpen was and how much work is necessary. I also don't believe that a bad bullpen leads to overextending starters. A bad bullpen leads to position players pitching and different relievers being called up from the minors with little to no effect whatsoever on the starting pitchers. The White Sox are absolutely a team that will extend starters when it feels that it can't trust the pen. This is a Don Cooper trait. What I do disagree with is the idea that we can't tell if the problem lies with the pen or starters. I think that is super easy to figure out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (JUSTgottaBELIEVE @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 01:28 PM) Isn't that what just about every free agent says when signing with a new team? Bottom line, money talks. If the White Sox offer Reed as much or more than the rest of the league there's a great chance he signs. This isn't a Carlos Beltran situation trying to grab a ring before hanging it up. In that type of situation I could see it being about more than the money. So you don't accept David Robertson's reasoning for signing with the Sox and you don't accept Hahn saying the Sox will not be spending on big free agents. Well, go ahead and keep thinking the Sox have a chance at signing Reed. Just don't complain when Reed signs with a contender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 02:05 PM) Good point. Times are changing. I feel like that Jose Abreu record deal will be shattered next offseason. Yeah, same here. I'm not really a fan of JR myself but I can't ignore the big money he spent on a prospect. That right there tells me he will spend on free agents to fill the gaps when the time comes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUSTgottaBELIEVE Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 04:22 PM) Because it is very easy to keep track of how many games a bullpen blew the game. Whether you want to use conventional means like blown saves, or (preferably) you lean more towards analytics and look at WPA+ and WPA-, shutdowns and meltdowns, WAR, FIP, etc, you can tell how good or bad your bullpen was and how much work is necessary. I also don't believe that a bad bullpen leads to overextending starters. A bad bullpen leads to position players pitching and different relievers being called up from the minors with little to no effect whatsoever on the starting pitchers. The Sox will be running out 3 or 4 very young starters in their rotation. Sox will try to push these guys to get that extra inning or two if the bullpen is a hot mess as expected. I'm not sure that's a good thing with these arms in the rotation being as young as they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUSTgottaBELIEVE Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 04:31 PM) So you don't accept David Robertson's reasoning for signing with the Sox and you don't accept Hahn saying the Sox will not be spending on big free agents. Well, go ahead and keep thinking the Sox have a chance at signing Reed. Just don't complain when Reed signs with a contender. I don't classify guys like Reed, Swarzak, McGee, etc. as "big" signings. And watch when they do sign a vet this offseason. I bet they are quoted saying similar things as DRob in 2014 "I really like the moves that this organization is making" "I think this team is very close to competing and want to be a part of it" etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 7, 2017 Author Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (JUSTgottaBELIEVE @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 04:48 PM) I don't classify guys like Reed, Swarzak, McGee, etc. as "big" signings. And watch when they do sign a vet this offseason. I bet they are quoted saying similar things as DRob in 2014 "I really like the moves that this organization is making" "I think this team is very close to competing and want to be a part of it" etc etc I am feeling fairly confidence that the types of players we sign for our bullpen this year won't be the kind of players that get an interview surrounding their signings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (JUSTgottaBELIEVE @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 05:18 PM) But how will one judge whether a team is "close" to competing if they only win 70 games, largely because the bullpen is awful? A bad bullpen also lends itself to overextending the starters in an effort to compensate. I'm not sure that's a good thing for the rebuild either. The same way you know the bullpen is garbage right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 QUOTE (JUSTgottaBELIEVE @ Nov 7, 2017 -> 04:48 PM) I don't classify guys like Reed, Swarzak, McGee, etc. as "big" signings. And watch when they do sign a vet this offseason. I bet they are quoted saying similar things as DRob in 2014 "I really like the moves that this organization is making" "I think this team is very close to competing and want to be a part of it" etc etc Oh, I'll take that bet. No FA is going to sign this winter with the rebuilding White Sox and say those things. You're at least one year too soon on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.