Your 2019 White Sox

[Balta1701]

I'd love to add a guy like AJ Pollack in 2019.

I thought he was a decent add - with his injury history he might only need a couple year deal, if he needs extra time off have guys like Polo and Engel who can platoon for him and not be terrible, and Robert can pencil in to take over for him towards the end of his contract.

[steveno89]

I'll give the 2019 roster a shot. Won't be the sexiest but here goes.

 

1B Zach Collins

2B Yoan

3B Yolmer

SS TA

LF Ryan Cordell

CF Leury

RF Eloy

C Seby Zavala

DH Delmonico

 

Bench: Narvaez, Saladino, Engel, May

 

Rotation: Rodon, Kopech, Giolito, Lopez, Hansen. If Rodon is still having problems everyone moves up a slot with Dane Dunning moving into the 5th spot.

 

Bullpen: Vieria, Burdi, Fulmer, Clark, Fry, D.Dunning.

 

I think Abreu and Avi are gone by then be t I won't speculate as to the return. Also don't want to assume the Sox go after Manny Machado so I left him out of the mix. Plus, I think the Sox see Jake Burger as their future 3B and will have Yolmer continue to play 3B until Burger is ready.

 

I think what could be even more interesting is forecasting the 2020 lineup when names such as Robert, Adolfo, Burger, Cease, Sheets, Rutherford, Basabe, Clarkin start coming into the picture.

 

I can't imagine the Sox standing pat next offseason and letting a prime free agent class slip by without attempting to make some noise. Our payroll will be at a minimum allowing us to explore significant free agent additions.

[BlackSox13]

Damn straight it ain't sexy but the future for the Chicago White Sox sure is!

Yes it is. We're watching a future contender being rebuilt from the ground up and it's pretty damn cool.

 

I just want to point out that the payroll for this proposed roster would be like $25M to $30M. You got plenty of room to add free agents even if you think Machado is an unrealistic target.

I hear ya. I just don't want to assume the Sox sign anyone like Machado. We all know that not every prospect will fulfill their projections so the Sox will have to to spend on free agents to fill in the holes, and I'm sure they will. I'm just not sure what those holes will be.

[Balta1701]

I hear ya. I just don't want to assume the Sox sign anyone like Machado. We all know that not every prospect will fulfill their projections so the Sox will have to to spend on free agents to fill in the holes, and I'm sure they will. I'm just not sure what those holes will be.

There's so much depth in this organization that the one area I'd circle as "we need to address this soon and with big money" is the bullpen. We might well pull a dominant starting rotation and a strong lineup out of our hats by 2020, but the bullpen isn't likely to do the same thing with what we have. Even if a failed starter or two heads out there, there aren't a ton of guys at AAA who are about to jump up and support that bullpen. That's where I dumped most of my money in my roster setup. Go for broke on the bullpen and every other position still has people with potential. Conveniently, there are huge names on the list who will probably be happy to sign for our money if we are willing to spend it.

[Dam8610]

Yes it is. We're watching a future contender being rebuilt from the ground up and it's pretty damn cool.

 

 

I hear ya. I just don't want to assume the Sox sign anyone like Machado. We all know that not every prospect will fulfill their projections so the Sox will have to to spend on free agents to fill in the holes, and I'm sure they will. I'm just not sure what those holes will be.

 

3B is a pretty glaring org hole, and the second best free agent in next year's class, who will be 26 at the time, just so happens to play 3B. Machado matches this team's needs so perfectly it doesn't make sense for the White Sox to not pursue him, and most teams who would hand out the kind of contact he'll want have their 3B situation resolved.

[Balta1701]

3B is a pretty glaring org hole, and the second best free agent in next year's class, who will be 26 at the time, just so happens to play 3B. Machado matches this team's needs so perfectly it doesn't make sense for the White Sox to not pursue him, and most teams who would hand out the kind of contact he'll want have their 3B situation resolved.

Based on this year, I want to see Yolmer get a shot as an every day player there. If he's basically a 2 WAR player there, which is what he was this year while switching positions, then he's at least a decent big leaguer. Yes, Machado is a helluva lot better, but if you can fill that position with an adequate player who is strong defensively and cheap, then the upgrade to Machado is much smaller than the upgrade would be if we only had Saladino there.

 

If Sanchez flops in 2018, and no one like Saladino steps up, then you're right and that becomes the highest priority.

[OmarComing25]

3B is a pretty glaring org hole, and the second best free agent in next year's class, who will be 26 at the time, just so happens to play 3B. Machado matches this team's needs so perfectly it doesn't make sense for the White Sox to not pursue him, and most teams who would hand out the kind of contact he'll want have their 3B situation resolved.

Machado can also play SS though, so I could see a team signing him and moving him over.

[Bob Sacamano]

Machado can also play SS though, so I could see a team signing him and moving him over.

 

Heck, he might even play SS in 2018.

Edited November 21, 2017 by soxfan2014

[southsider2k5]

There's so much depth in this organization that the one area I'd circle as "we need to address this soon and with big money" is the bullpen. We might well pull a dominant starting rotation and a strong lineup out of our hats by 2020, but the bullpen isn't likely to do the same thing with what we have. Even if a failed starter or two heads out there, there aren't a ton of guys at AAA who are about to jump up and support that bullpen. That's where I dumped most of my money in my roster setup. Go for broke on the bullpen and every other position still has people with potential. Conveniently, there are huge names on the list who will probably be happy to sign for our money if we are willing to spend it.

 

Honestly it is the last area I would look at. We have a pack of true relievers who throw in the high nineties or better in the system in Diaz, Burr, Burdi and Vieira. They also have lot of minor league starting pitchers who are doing the same, many of whom will absolutely fail to get the majors as a starter. The Sox do still have some live arms sitting on the 40 man roster as well who could round into a relief core. Plus with the year to year volatility of relievers, it is tough to justify eight figures a year for the good ones when you have so many plus arms in the system.

[Chicago White Sox]

Honestly it is the last area I would look at. We have a pack of true relievers who throw in the high nineties or better in the system in Diaz, Burr, Burdi and Vieira. They also have lot of minor league starting pitchers who are doing the same, many of whom will absolutely fail to get the majors as a starter. The Sox do still have some live arms sitting on the 40 man roster as well who could round into a relief core. Plus with the year to year volatility of relievers, it is tough to justify eight figures a year for the good ones when you have so many plus arms in the system.

I don’t think there is anything wrong with buying at least one elite reliever. Adding a guy like Kimbrel or Miller adds quite a bit of certainty to the back-end of the pen. With a young, developing staff I think that’s invaluable. Plus we should have millions upon millions to spend. Honestly, I pretty surprised at how conservative some of these plans are. The luxury of having a surplus of young, cost-controlled talent in place is you can spend a bit lavishly in free agency and go after the best / most dominant players. Elitr elievers shouldn’t be excluded from consideration IMO.

[BlackSox13]

3B is a pretty glaring org hole, and the second best free agent in next year's class, who will be 26 at the time, just so happens to play 3B. Machado matches this team's needs so perfectly it doesn't make sense for the White Sox to not pursue him, and most teams who would hand out the kind of contact he'll want have their 3B situation resolved.

It's a match, on paper. We don't know how many years or how much money he's looking for and then there's opt-outs to take into consideration. I'd like to get a better idea of what he's looking before I say I want him. I would definitely talk to his agent after the 2018 WS finishes up to get an idea of what he's looking for.

[Bob Sacamano]

It's a match, on paper. We don't know how many years or how much money he's looking for and then there's opt-outs to take into consideration. I'd like to get a better idea of what he's looking before I say I want him. I would definitely talk to his agent after the 2018 WS finishes up to get an idea of what he's looking for.

 

Well right after the season, his demands will be probably be higher than he will get. Anyone know who his agent is?

[BlackSox13]

Well right after the season, his demands will be probably be higher than he will get. Anyone know who his agent is?

Machado's agent is Dan Lozano. He's the agent that got Pujols that insane contract with LAA.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

Machado's agent is Dan Lozano. He's the agent that got Pujols that insane contract with LAA.

 

Scary to think about. Pujols was 32 when he signed that deal. Machado is going to be only 25...

[hi8is]

Scary to think about. Pujols was 32 when he signed that deal. Machado is going to be only 25...

How crazy would it be to see a 12 year contract handed out ?

[BlackSox13]

Scary to think about. Pujols was 32 when he signed that deal. Machado is going to be only 25...

Even scarier is that Machado will be 26 when he becomes a FA, same age as Stanton when Stanton signed a 13 year contract worth 325M. That contract will be the starting point for Machado and it's already being speculated Machado could end up closer to 400M. If that's the case, I'm not in the least bit interested in Machado.

[hi8is]

Even scarier is that Machado will be 26 when he becomes a FA, same age as Stanton when Stanton signed a 13 year contract worth 325M. That contract will be the starting point for Machado and it's already being speculated Machado could end up closer to 400M. If that's the case, I'm not in the least bit interested in Machado.

I could make an argument for Machado at a near 400 million 13 year contract. A faulty argument at that but it's fodder for offseason talk, none the less:

 

Current dollar value per WAR for 2017 is 10.5m with that rate rising at least 3% annually. If we just stick with that 10.5m figure... a 400 million dollar contract over 13 years would require a total WAR of 38 for a "break even point."

 

Machado has averaged 5 WAR across his first 6 seasons with some up and down abberations that are a certainty throughout those 13 years. Take the 5 WAR average and multiply it out for 13 seasons and you've got a WAR projection of 65.

 

That's a 170% ROI.

 

Again... a faulty argument but I'm sure more advanced logic of this vein will be in Machado's Free Agent package handed out to GM's next year.

 

I'd be fine getting behind it and I'd also be fine letting it go.

[Dam8610]

How crazy would it be to see a 12 year contract handed out ?

 

You don't think Harper will get 12 years?

[Chicago White Sox]

Machado is going to get an opt-out, so I think contract length is less of a concern. Regardless, I don’t see him getting more than 10 years.

 

Let’s say you pay him $35M/year with an opt-out after year 4. You basically need 16 WAR over his 26 to 29 year old seasons to break even. IMO, that seems like his floor and you could very well get 24 WAR over that period. The obvious risk with a Machado signing if he suddenly pulls a Heyward and now you’re stuck with an albatross contract for 10 years. But honestly, that seems like an incredibly unlikely outcome to me and we can’t be afraid to take small, calculated risks to add impact talent when we’ll have money to burn.

[hi8is]

Machado is going to get an opt-out, so I think contract length is less of a concern. Regardless, I don’t see him getting more than 10 years.

 

Let’s say you pay him $35M/year with an opt-out after year 4. You basically need 16 WAR over his 26 to 29 year old seasons to break even. IMO, that seems like his floor and you could very well get 24 WAR over that period. The obvious risk with a Machado signing if he suddenly pulls a Heyward and now you’re stuck with an albatross contract for 10 years. But honestly, that seems like an incredibly unlikely outcome to me and we can’t be afraid to take small, calculated risks to add impact talent when we’ll have money to burn.

Another aspect of Machado that hasn't been discussed ( to my knowledge ) is his character. The dude seems like a walking primadonna in the vein of ARod-lite. In most free agent and trade target related discussions, Kenny Williams and RH both have always seemed to place a high importance on these "intangible" items... like personality, character, and clubhouse leadership skills.

 

I wonder if Manny brings up a red flag to the brass in our front office.

[RockRaines]

FYI, I dont get the impression they are going to spend money this offseason, we are maybe a year away from that.

[hi8is]

...maybe...

[Chicago White Sox]

FYI, I dont get the impression they are going to spend money this offseason, we are maybe a year away from that.

Who said otherwise? The point of this thread was to talk about spending next year.

[Chicago White Sox]

Another aspect of Machado that hasn't been discussed ( to my knowledge ) is his character. The dude seems like a walking primadonna in the vein of ARod-lite. In most free agent and trade target related discussions, Kenny Williams and RH both have always seemed to place a high importance on these "intangible" items... like personality, character, and clubhouse leadership skills.

 

I wonder if Manny brings up a red flag to the brass in our front office.

This is a fair point. Character becomes much more important when you’re making a potential $300M+ investment. At the same time, there simply aren’t a lot superstars that become free agents at 26. I still think they go for him because outside of any character concerns he’d really be a perfect addition.

[ChiSoxJon]

SS Anderson

2B Moncada

3B Machado

1B Abreu

RF Jimenez

DH Garcia

LF Delmonico

C Castillo

CF Garcia

 

Bench: C/1B/DH Collins, 2B/3B/SS Sanchez, UT Cordell, 1B/3B/DH Davidson

 

Rotation: Kopech, Rodon, Giolito, Lopez, Hansen

'Pen: Cody Allen, Kelvin Herrera, Hector Rondon, Carter Capps, Trevor Rosenthal, Fulmer, Burdi