2018 Democrats thread

[Reddy]

Except in the end...tearing down fellow like-minded politicians will help how?

 

Remember your talking about The Better Deal last year? Nobody even remembers what was in it anymore...the best you’d get would be something about FDR or LBJ, and that’s if you polled 1000 registered Dems, let alone independents.

I agree. Dems are really, really bad at selling a cohesive message, sticking to it, and walking to the same drumbeat. That's the nature of the beast when you're the party of shades of gray.

 

And I attack the Bern as much as I do because I truly believe that all he'll do is tear apart the only party that stands in the way of a far-right GOP and Trump winning re-election. There's no fiber of my being that thinks 1) he'd win or 2) that he'd be effective

[Dam8610]

Beyond paying those issues lip-service, and only when confronted about them, what has he actually done? And what is he GOING to do? (I'm guessing you didn't read the article, as this is all addressed)

 

Here's another, an op-ed from a person of color: Bernie Sanders' History Of Civil Rights Activism Is No Excuse For Him To Slack On Fighting Racism Now

 

 

https://www.alternet.org/election-2016/20-e...an-rights-1950s

 

Bernie was the one fighting for their rights the whole time, even when Bill Clinton was making policy he'd later apologize for to minority communities. How about promote that instead of the garbage myth that his supporters are racist just because they're more concerned about taking economic justice back from neoliberals and Republicans?

Edited April 6, 2018 by Dam8610

[Dam8610]

And another thing: the DNC is not responsible for the words that come out of Bernie's mouth... You can use them as an all-encompassing boogeyman if you want, but it starts making you sound rather Trumpian when you always blame someone or something else for your mistakes.

 

I said "Democratic apparatus", you assuming that means DNC is a mistake on your part. It's so much more than that. All of it a problem.

[southsider2k5]

Beyond paying those issues lip-service, and only when confronted about them, what has he actually done? And what is he GOING to do? (I'm guessing you didn't read the article, as this is all addressed)

 

Here's another, an op-ed from a person of color: Bernie Sanders' History Of Civil Rights Activism Is No Excuse For Him To Slack On Fighting Racism Now

 

Watching the Dems destroy themselves even before the primary saddens me as it means another term for Trump.

[southsider2k5]

https://www.alternet.org/election-2016/20-e...an-rights-1950s

 

Bernie was the one fighting for their rights the whole time, even when Bill Clinton was making policy he'd later apologize for to minority communities. How about promote that instead of the garbage myth that his supporters are racist just because they're more concerned about taking economic justice back from neoliberals and Republicans?

 

And it is such a strange nitpick. Realistically the policies he is talking about are much more towards what the Dems believe will achieve equality, even though Sanders quite can't articulate it right. I mean if you sat down and said what actual policies will achieve equality, it would be straight out of the Sanders playbook, unlike the Clintons and many others who have flipped all over the place based on the current breeze. But somehow Bill gets painted as 'the first black president' while having done less for them. Until Donald Trump was elected, the Clintons were the more effective conarists politically in my lifetime.

 

But yet, Sanders is the one with the racist image. It just blows my mind.

[southsider2k5]

I agree. Dems are really, really bad at selling a cohesive message, sticking to it, and walking to the same drumbeat. That's the nature of the beast when you're the party of shades of gray.

 

And I attack the Bern as much as I do because I truly believe that all he'll do is tear apart the only party that stands in the way of a far-right GOP and Trump winning re-election. There's no fiber of my being that thinks 1) he'd win or 2) that he'd be effective

 

And here you are contributing to that schism.

[caulfield12]

And it is such a strange nitpick. Realistically the policies he is talking about are much more towards what the Dems believe will achieve equality, even though Sanders quite can't articulate it right. I mean if you sat down and said what actual policies will achieve equality, it would be straight out of the Sanders playbook, unlike the Clintons and many others who have flipped all over the place based on the current breeze. But somehow Bill gets painted as 'the first black president' while having done less for them. Until Donald Trump was elected, the Clintons were the more effective conarists politically in my lifetime.

 

But yet, Sanders is the one with the racist image. It just blows my mind.

 

Flip their home states.

 

Make Sanders the guy who loves binging on McDonalds, struggles with his weight, can play the sax, talk about his underwear and cheats on his wife/is equally comfortable on Howard Stern or Davos platform...and a 50% better public speaker who can talk foreign policy articulately and sounds more Sunday Baptist churchl sermonizer than macroeconomics professor with a funny Seinfeld accent. (Or convince black voters he’s Larry David from the last 2-3 years of Curb Your Enthusiasm.)

 

Voila...Sanders has universal black support.

Edited April 6, 2018 by caulfield12

[Reddy]

https://www.alternet.org/election-2016/20-e...an-rights-1950s

 

Bernie was the one fighting for their rights the whole time, even when Bill Clinton was making policy he'd later apologize for to minority communities. How about promote that instead of the garbage myth that his supporters are racist just because they're more concerned about taking economic justice back from neoliberals and Republicans?

good lord, man. You're 1) using bulls*** blogs as if they're legit sources of information (typical of the Bernie wing) and 2) you're not answering the question. No one has said he hasn't done anything for civil rights, we're asking what does he PLAN TO DO NOW? He has no answer for that. That's the point being made by people of color in the Democratic party when they criticize Bernie on these issues.

[Reddy]

And here you are contributing to that schism.

The fact that you and the Berners are on the same side here says all that needs to be said.

[caulfield12]

Watching the Dems destroy themselves even before the primary saddens me as it means another term for Trump.

 

If they cant defeat Trump (despite the complete chaos he is creating), then they should break in half and isolate the Deplorables from Anaheim/Orange County/Mitt Romney/Colin Powell Republicans.

 

Those two parties combined should at least be able to unite and take out Trump and worry about governing fom the progressive left or moderate center at a later point in time. In many ways, the East/West Coast Dems are so distinctive from Rust Belt/Heartland Dems. Hard to reconcile the two groups, at least currently.

[caulfield12]

The fact that you and the Berners are on the same side here says all that needs to be said.

 

Or that he would now actually prefer Sanders to Trump...if he could vote today, ceteris paribus.

[Reddy]

Sanders is the one with the racist image. It just blows my mind.

Every single time he's faced with responding to or dealing with black activists and/or responding about issues regarding race, he gaffes. He says something stupid. He's earned his reputation. He's absolutely not racist - he just prioritizes his economic policy over social justice because he believes the first will help with the latter. But having a rich old white guy tell black Americans that HE better knows what will help them than they do doesn't always come off so great, does it?

[GoSox05]

good lord, man. You're 1) using bulls*** blogs as if they're legit sources of information (typical of the Bernie wing) and 2) you're not answering the question. No one has said he hasn't done anything for civil rights, we're asking what does he PLAN TO DO NOW? He has no answer for that. That's the point being made by people of color in the Democratic party when they criticize Bernie on these issues.

 

Lmao. You just used Buzzfeed and Bustle and you are going to criticize Alternet as a source.

[caulfield12]

Every single time he's faced with responding to or dealing with black activists and/or responding about issues regarding race, he gaffes. He says something stupid. He's earned his reputation. He's absolutely not racist - he just prioritizes his economic policy over social justice because he believes the first will help with the latter. But having a rich old white guy tell black Americans that HE better knows what will help them than they do doesn't always come off so great, does it?

 

But you can say the same about the Parkland activists...because black on black violence is peripheral to limiting all gun violence, and not the central unifying message.

 

Go back to RFK’s 1968 campaign. Would that message today work against Trump effectively?

[bmags]

Flip their home states.

 

Make Sanders the guy who loves binging on McDonalds, struggles with his weight, can play the sax, talk about his underwear and cheats on his wife/is equally comfortable on Howard Stern or Davos platform...and a 50% better public speaker who can talk foreign policy articulately and sounds more Sunday Baptist churchl sermonizer than macroeconomics professor with a funny Seinfeld accent. (Or convince black voters he’s Larry David from the last 2-3 years of Curb Your Enthusiasm.)

 

Voila...Sanders has universal black support.

 

What do you think you are saying with this post. It is incredibly condescending.

 

Basically to sum-up:

- The monolithic black vote is more comfortable with looser morals, intimidated by education, struggles with weight gain and distrusts jews

 

The southern black political bloc has reasons for backing certain candidates that aren't because they are brainwashed by propoganda.

[caulfield12]

Lmao. You just used Buzzfeed and Bustle and you are going to criticize Alternet as a source.

 

Do Kamala Harris or Booker even have their own plans to address African American economic and academic underperformance...?

[Reddy]

Lmao. You just used Buzzfeed and Bustle and you are going to criticize Alternet as a source.

Buzzfeed is absolutely considered a legitimate source these days. I work on Capitol Hill and it's right up there with politico, the hill, etc these days in its credibility. Bustle is a more fair critique, but it's an op-ed and I labeled it as such, which doesn't mean the facts are indisputable. It's a perspective.

[bmags]

But you can say the same about the Parkland activists...because black on black violence is peripheral to limiting all gun violence, and not the central unifying message.

 

Go back to RFK’s 1968 campaign. Would that message today work against Trump effectively?

 

The parkland activists actually made sure to include victims of daily gun violence in black and impoverished neighborhoods, including making it a large part of the Chicago march, and meeting with students from Chicago high schools plagued by gun violence.

 

Knowing the value of those perspectives goes a long way.

[Reddy]

What do you think you are saying with this post. It is incredibly condescending.

 

Basically to sum-up:

- The monolithic black vote is more comfortable with looser morals, intimidated by education, struggles with weight gain and distrusts jews

 

The southern black political bloc has reasons for backing certain candidates that aren't because they are brainwashed by propoganda.

Agreed.

 

Talk about good timing: The Diversity Of Black Political Views - FiveThirtyEight

Edited April 6, 2018 by Reddy

[caulfield12]

What do you think you are saying with this post. It is incredibly condescending.

 

Basically to sum-up:

- The monolithic black vote is more comfortable with looser morals, intimidated by education, struggles with weight gain and distrusts jews

 

The southern black political bloc has reasons for backing certain candidates that aren't because they are brainwashed by propoganda.

 

I taught in an inner city school from 2002-2007 and my students almost universally related to Clinton for many of those reasons.

 

They always said he was the first black president. He was fallible. Human. Admired his overcoming a terrible rural upbringing, abuse/family alcoholism, becoming a Rhodes Scholar. They admired his intelligence and ability to speak in black churches.His love for music and movies and he talked a big game about poverty eradication.

 

How can you explain that nearly universal sentiment prior in the 2008 South Carolina primary?

 

 

Edited April 6, 2018 by caulfield12

[GoSox05]

good lord, man. You're 1) using bulls*** blogs as if they're legit sources of information (typical of the Bernie wing) and 2) you're not answering the question. No one has said he hasn't done anything for civil rights, we're asking what does he PLAN TO DO NOW? He has no answer for that. That's the point being made by people of color in the Democratic party when they criticize Bernie on these issues.

 

You seriously don't know what Bernie Sanders would do if he got into the White House? You act like he is devoid of ideology, you may not like what Bernie Sanders plan is, but trying to say he doesn't have one is ridiculous.

 

 

I'd love to know what the great Martin O'Malley has planned.

[bmags]

I taught in an inner city school from 2002-2007 and my students almost universally related to Clinton for many of those reasons.

 

They always said he was the first black president.

 

How can you explain that nearly universal sentiment prior in the 2008 South Carolina primary?

 

No, no you first. Your connection that he's the first black president is because black voters identified with the characteristics you described?

 

The origins of that quote are around something far different.

[Reddy]

You seriously don't know what Bernie Sanders would do if he got into the White House? You act like he is devoid of ideology, you may not like what Bernie Sanders plan is, but trying to say he doesn't have one is ridiculous.

 

 

I'd love to know what the great Martin O'Malley has planned.

It's weird how you people create magical arguments and put them in the mouths of "centrists" when they never in fact made those arguments to begin with.

 

Of course Bernie is ideological. He has an agenda. Social justice issues for black America are not on his priority list, and he doesn't have policy plans to deal with those issues. Does he? Can you enlighten me?

[BigSqwert]

Of course Bernie is ideological. He has an agenda. Social justice issues for black America are not on his priority list, and he doesn't have policy plans to deal with those issues. Does he? Can you enlighten me?

 

LMGTFY

 

and in case you're too lazy to look up women's issues

Edited April 6, 2018 by BigSqwert

[Reddy]

I'd love to know what the great Martin O'Malley has planned.

 

O'Malley messed up on the Black Lives Matter front when he was running as well. I won't deny that. But he was elected Mayor of Baltimore as a white guy TWICE and he isn't galavanting around the country for photo ops with black civil rights leaders just to bolster his 2020 bid. He's actually been campaigning for every Democrat he can to actually help us win elections. He's been on the ground in something like 30 states thus far campaigning for Dems while Bernie mugs for the camera behind Al Sharpton. Please.

 

Oh, and here's O'Malley's platform for Criminal Justice Reform, followed by his plan to revitalize urban America: https://martinomalley.com/policy/criminal-justice/, https://martinomalley.com/policy/american-c...nd-communities/

Edited April 6, 2018 by Reddy