illinilaw08 Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:04 PM) It's no flaming spear being thrown into the ground while riding bare-back on a horse like Florida State, but they did research and based it off of the dances of plain indians, right? The dance was created by a bunch of former boy scouts without any input from Native Americans. That makes it "based on a true story." It doesn't make it authentic... Without getting into a tangent, that was a huge problem with the Chief. I distinctly remember getting a program at a game in the 90s that told me the dance was authentic. When the university is peddling a false narrative, it makes it very difficult to obtain allies from the other side of the debate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians. Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (GoSox05 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 08:59 PM) One thing I never understood about teams holding on to these weird old racist names and logos based on Native Americans. There are so many cool names to go with. Cleveland Spiders was a really cool name. That would be bad ass if they changed to that now. I saw some of the alternate logos people did for the Redskins, some really cool ones. The Spiders would really be good. The Cleveland Spiders. Wow. You have something here. Send some tweets to their media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:46 PM) The dance was created by a bunch of former boy scouts without any input from Native Americans. That makes it "based on a true story." It doesn't make it authentic... Without getting into a tangent, that was a huge problem with the Chief. I distinctly remember getting a program at a game in the 90s that told me the dance was authentic. When the university is peddling a false narrative, it makes it very difficult to obtain allies from the other side of the debate... If it wasn't for that dance, the Chief logo might still be around. I thought the halftime dance was awesome as a student years ago, but yeah, it was probably time to retire it. I still wear the logo, I don't see a problem with it. My biggest annoyance is that FSU can do all those "traditions" because the Seminole tribe is still around. Meanwhile Illini were a tribe in the area, but since they are not around anymore, it's a trouble point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM) Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians. Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target. I guess I’m missing the point here. Are you suggesting that referring to a Native American as an “American Indian” would be offensive? Maybe I’m not informed on the issue, but my understanding is a vast portion of the world back then was considered part of “India”. Regardless, the Cleveland Indians aren’t based on modern day Native Americans but Indian tribes that existed in the early days of America. So calling them the “Cleveland Native Americans” really does not make any sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkfan Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 When our kids grow up and see what we've done, they're going to ask how we can bear the sight of our own faces in the mirror, knowing that we passively let this tragedy occur. This is truly a sad day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 The FDR "correction" will occur about the same time that the Japanese admit to what they did in Nanjing, the Bataan Death March, etc. We all know that there was a large element of racism, the fact that German-Americans were not similarly rounded up and placed in internment camps, but there's at least some evidence out there that Japanese working at Pearl Harbor were part of the attack planning and execution. Should everyone ELSE in the Western US have suffered due to the actions of maybe 10? That's a question for the historians to discuss and decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM) Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians. Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target. National Museum of the American Indian What is the correct terminology: American Indian, Indian, Native American, or Native? All of these terms are acceptable. The consensus, however, is that whenever possible, Native people prefer to be called by their specific tribal name. In the United States, Native American has been widely used but is falling out of favor with some groups, and the terms American Indian or indigenous American are preferred by many Native people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 (edited) QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM) Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians. Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target. American Indian is actually the preferred term for a lot of indigenous groups in the US. They use First Peoples a lot in Canada, not sure about Central and South America, but here American Indian is perfectly acceptable. e: thoroughly beaten by Leonard! Edited January 31, 2018 by StrangeSox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 04:58 PM) It wasn't authentic... According to the group that ran it and various articles it was. That was part of the defense of it. That it wasn't a caricature or made up, it was authentic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 09:34 PM) American Indian is actually the preferred term for a lot of indigenous groups in the US. They use First Peoples a lot in Canada, not sure about Central and South America, but here American Indian is perfectly acceptable. e: thoroughly beaten by Leonard! In the lacrosse world where the Native Americans are dominant they want to be referred to as the Iroqouis nation, as Leonard said. as a matter of fact they cannot participate in any World Cup tournament outside north america because they do not have passports. No other countries recognize them as an Independent nation and they have no passports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (greg775 @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 08:12 PM) The Spiders would really be good. The Cleveland Spiders. Wow. You have something here. Send some tweets to their media. GAY! Oops a non political correct comment. Queer sports names just like the Wizards. I'm done with this thread. I am part Cherokee. It's not the end of the world what is being done in Cleveland. Maybe our team should be called the Sox too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 07:30 PM) I guess I’m missing the point here. Are you suggesting that referring to a Native American as an “American Indian” would be offensive? Maybe I’m not informed on the issue, but my understanding is a vast portion of the world back then was considered part of “India”. Regardless, the Cleveland Indians aren’t based on modern day Native Americans but Indian tribes that existed in the early days of America. So calling them the “Cleveland Native Americans” really does not make any sense. QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 08:36 PM) National Museum of the American Indian QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 09:34 PM) American Indian is actually the preferred term for a lot of indigenous groups in the US. They use First Peoples a lot in Canada, not sure about Central and South America, but here American Indian is perfectly acceptable. e: thoroughly beaten by Leonard! My point is that the word "Indian" is only associated with Native Americans because Columbus thought he was in India and thus called them Indians at first. The term stuck through time. In my opinion, the word "Indian" should only be used in the context of the country of India, and not Native Americans. Not about being offensive, just a matter of accuracy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 31, 2018 Author Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 30, 2018 -> 05:57 PM) Another thing people should stop doing is referring to Native Americans as Indians. Sure, "Cleveland Native Americans" doesn't have the same ring to it, but Indians... are... from India. Sorry, Columbus, but you missed your target. Its only a 500 year old mistake. No biggie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 Finally: The Indians Are Replacing Their Racist Mascot Chief Wahoo With A White Woman Wearing A Native American Halloween Costume Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jan 31, 2018 -> 04:33 PM) Finally: The Indians Are Replacing Their Racist Mascot Chief Wahoo With A White Woman Wearing A Native American Halloween Costume Ellen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 Manfred also made sure to note that Tiffany has 1/64th Cherokee ancestry, so the costume is basically celebrating her own heritage if you think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 Would anyone had noticed if they did this but didn't announce it or put out a press release? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 QUOTE (Brian @ Jan 31, 2018 -> 10:19 PM) Would anyone had noticed if they did this but didn't announce it or put out a press release? That is a fantastic post. Now that I think about it, they should have not even put out a press release. Just don't use Chief Wahoo and move on. Excellent take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEANS Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 yes people of course would notice, chief wahoo has started to be phased out of the past few years and people noticed that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Jan 31, 2018 -> 12:12 AM) GAY! Oops a non political correct comment. Queer sports names just like the Wizards. I'm done with this thread. I am part Cherokee. It's not the end of the world what is being done in Cleveland. Maybe our team should be called the Sox too. Wat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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