Mlb.com top prospects

[southsider2k5]

Possibly it's hard to feel sorry for and give the benefit of the doubt considering his own history *cough* Mike Sirotka. I do know the Red Sox were given the option of avoiding the trade so if they did some real shady stuff we would have had the same opportunity.

 

That is absolutely a ridiculous leap, especially when the Padres were busted by the league for improprieties. This just comes off as petty.

[wrathofhahn]

That is absolutely a ridiculous leap, especially when the Padres were busted by the league for improprieties. This just comes off as petty.

 

Possibly but it's hard to feel a whole lot of sympathy for Williams when he has done the exact same thing. The padres were busted by the league but only the marlins and sox cases were cited and in both cases Manfred offered to rescind the trade. Of course it's possible if not likely the Padres did the same repeatedly before but it's also possible for players to get injured just by happenstance as well. So we will never know.

 

Also remember James Shields was already 34 at the time of the trade and had a ton of mileage on his arm and was making way more then he was worth moving forward. Whether the Padres were honest or not with their medicals isn't even the point. The trade should have never been made even if he was completely healthy.

[fathom]

How quickly some forget Shields' epic start before the trade.

[Jack Parkman]

How quickly some forget Shields' epic start before the trade.

With all due respect to the White Sox Front Office, before that start in which Shields gave up 10 runs in less than an inning, Shields was pitching to a 3.02 ERA in April and May of 2016.

[wrathofhahn]

With all due respect to the White Sox Front Office, before that start in which Shields gave up 10 runs in less than an inning, Shields was pitching to a 3.02 ERA in April and May of 2016.

 

At the time of the trade he had a 4.44 FIP. 1.426 WHIP (pitcher park in the NL) was 34 with diminished velocity and still had 3/65 remaining on his deal. Sure the Padres ate some money around half his salary but it was always a bad bet to take even if he was uninjured.

Edited February 18, 2018 by wrathofhahn

[Jack Parkman]

At the time of the trade he had a 4.44 FIP. 1.426 WHIP (pitcher park in the NL) was 34 with diminished velocity and still had 3/65 remaining on his deal. Sure the Padres ate some money around half his salary but it was always a bad bet to take even if he was uninjured.

What was his FIP before his last start with the Padres on 5/31/2016? Shields had one horrible start up until the trade(the aforementioned 10 run start) that skewed everything. Sure, it was a harbinger of things to come, but nobody could have known that at the time. It was probably just seen as a blip. He had been pitching to a 3.06 ERA up until getting shelled on 5/31/16. I went and looked at his starts on Baseball Reference, there was nothing in his game to assume that he'd get shelled. Sox FO probably thought he just didn't have it on 5/31/16 vs Seattle. FYI- Shields, up until that start, hadn't given up more than 4 runs in a game up until that start on 5/31/2016, and was 2 starts removed from a 7 inning 0 run 9 K game vs the then-defending NL champ Mets.

This was the box score of the start before Shields got shelled on 5/31/16

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/SF...201605250.shtml

 

Edited February 18, 2018 by Jack Parkman

[wrathofhahn]

What was his FIP before his last start with the Padres on 5/31/2016? Shields had one horrible start up until the trade(the aforementioned 10 run start) that skewed everything. Sure, it was a harbinger of things to come, but nobody could have known that at the time. It was probably just seen as a blip. He had been pitching to a 3.06 ERA up until getting shelled on 5/31/16. I went and looked at his starts on Baseball Reference, there was nothing in his game to assume that he'd get shelled. Sox FO probably thought he just didn't have it on 5/31/16 vs Seattle. FYI- Shields, up until that start, hadn't given up more than 4 runs in a game up until that start on 5/31/2016, and was 2 starts removed from a 7 inning 0 run 9 K game vs the then-defending NL champ Mets.

This was the box score of the start before Shields got shelled on 5/31/16

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/SF...201605250.shtml

 

I don't know but his WHIP was atrocious and heavily influences FIP so yeah most likely it wasn't good. Also remember in 2015 he had a 4.45 FIP. Also remember that he was pitching in the NL (no DH) and one of the most pitcher friendly parks.

 

http://www.parkfactors.com/SD

 

 

 

 

[southsider2k5]

Possibly but it's hard to feel a whole lot of sympathy for Williams when he has done the exact same thing. The padres were busted by the league but only the marlins and sox cases were cited and in both cases Manfred offered to rescind the trade. Of course it's possible if not likely the Padres did the same repeatedly before but it's also possible for players to get injured just by happenstance as well. So we will never know.

 

Also remember James Shields was already 34 at the time of the trade and had a ton of mileage on his arm and was making way more then he was worth moving forward. Whether the Padres were honest or not with their medicals isn't even the point. The trade should have never been made even if he was completely healthy.

 

Again, this is complete libel.

 

Kenny Williams hasn't done the same thing. He did not create two sets of paperwork in order to be able to give an incomplete medical history to another team while hiding the teams true findings in order to fool other teams in an effort to hide injuries. This is exactly what was found by MLB.

[Dick Allen]

Again, this is complete libel.

 

Kenny Williams hasn't done the same thing. He did not create two sets of paperwork in order to be able to give an incomplete medical history to another team while hiding the teams true findings in order to fool other teams in an effort to hide injuries. This is exactly what was found by MLB.

Yes, the Sirotka caper is riduculous to blame on KW, and I love finding things to blame on KW. Gord Ash waived his opportunity at a physical.

[Bob Sacamano]

I don't think info anything was withheld from the White Sox about James Shields. I think he just got hurt after. Just bad luck. Otherwise, why weren't we involved in the whole Red Sox and Marlins report and being offered to reverse the trade?

 

Edit: either way, it's in the past now. Let's not dwell on it and talk about the guys still here.

Edited February 20, 2018 by soxfan2014

[southsider2k5]

I don't think info anything was withheld from the White Sox about James Shields. I think he just got hurt after. Just bad luck. Otherwise, why weren't we involved in the whole Red Sox and Marlins report and being offered to reverse the trade?

 

Edit: either way, it's in the past now. Let's not dwell on it and talk about the guys still here.

 

I don't think there is any doubt he was hurt. You could see him stretching his back often after pitches and he also started to remake his arm angles to drop down a lot more. The #1 reason pitchers do that is injury. I think how quickly he went down in 17 was a result of finally having to admit to what was wrong all along.

[Dick Allen]

I doubt Shields was injured enough to Kibosh the trade. It may have meant SD eat a little more money or take a different prospect. But the prospect was one who had not played, so I would imagine that wasn't very likely.

Edited February 20, 2018 by Dick Allen